Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 12:02 am Post subject: Re: [Food] Storage - General
Hi I've just started planning and using the Food Storage Spreadsheet downloaded from this site.
I'm not sure on the recommended amounts I'm getting from it can someone explain. I'm using method 2 and one person for five weeks gives the results at the end of this post.
This seems way over the top to me - 2lb of bread mix per person per wekk makes a hell of a lot of bread!!
This may be my lack of understanding, but if I was to go out and buy enough for my family I'd cause my own mini food crisis in my locality with the recommended amounts.
The calcs also seem a bit off, with the cost column working on the qty on hand rather than the amount required.
Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 6:53 am Post subject: Re: [Food] Storage - General
I'm thinking of buying a couple of cases of Ramen Noodles to add to my food storage. If I put several of the individual plastic wrapped packs in a mylar bag with oxygen absorbers and then vacuum sealed the mylar bag, how long do you think they would store?
Since there are two items in each bag, the noodles and the flavor packet I'm concerned that one may go bad well before the othere. Does anyone have any experience with this?
Joined: Jan 03, 2005 Posts: 1178 Location: western Wisconsin
Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 12:12 pm Post subject: Re: [Food] Storage - General
By the way, my apples are holding up better than I thought. I just had one for my morning snack today (July 9th), that we picked last October. It was not quite as good as fresh, or a storebought from New Zealand or China, but certainly was a treat for me. No weird soft or brown spots in the flesh, still solid and firm.
Joined: Sep 16, 2004 Posts: 4415 Location: Southwest WI
Posted: Wed Jul 09, 2008 2:03 pm Post subject: Re: [Food] Storage - General
Jim-
What variety was it? I was sad when they finally ran out of McIntosh apples at the grocery store about 6 weeks ago. Red Delicious just don't cut it for me. _________________ "Oil is going up because we use too much oil, and the capacity to replace reserves is dwindling"
-President Bush 11/07/07
Joined: Jan 03, 2005 Posts: 1178 Location: western Wisconsin
Posted: Thu Jul 10, 2008 9:26 am Post subject: Re: [Food] Storage - General
The apple variety that I am still eating from last October's harvest is "Northwestern Greening". It is not necessarily my first choice for apples, but it is a large yellow apple that improves in storage. One reason that it is the only remaining apple in my storage is that I had more of them than any other apple, and I ate all of the others first, as some didn't store as well, and some I liked better than the NW Greenings. When picked the NW Greenings are hard, and and not real tasty, but by mid-winter they had mellowed a bit in both hardness and flavor. They are the apple that we use most in baking and cooking in the winter.
Joined: Dec 27, 2004 Posts: 12473 Location: zombie horde wonderland
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 1:41 pm Post subject: Re: [Food] Storage - General
Quinny wrote:
hi
could anyone please help me with the food storage sheet ive downloaded. see previos post.
if anyone knows who uploaded it i might be able to pm them for help
thanks
We use about 5 pounds of flour for bread per week for two people (2.5 lbs per person per week). Granted we eat a lot of bread (too much). But the figure you quote above 2 lbs per person per week, does not seem unreasonable if you eat a lot of bread.
You'll need to adjust all the amounts based on what you actually eat or plan to eat, always making sure you adjust to provide enough calories. You might try buying a week's worth using those quantities, and see how much of it you actually eat in a week, making sure to take into account any meals out, or take-out food, etc.
There's no good storing foods you and your family won't eat, so it's good to run a trial with the foods you plan to store, to make sure you will eat them, which you will need to do eventually to keep them rotated. Pops counsels to store what you eat, and eat what you store, and I agree.
Anyway, I hope this helps. I'm by no means a food storage expert; our stores are probably not big enough really... _________________ No original ideas are contained in this post.
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:43 pm Post subject: homemade superpails, woohoo!
I made a score on Craigslist today. Some guy was selling hundreds of food grade 5 gallon buckets with rubber gaskets in the lids. They were used to store berries and vanilla flavoring for yogurt (which I verified, seeing as they still smelled like berries even though rinsed). 2 bucks each and they looked like they'd only been used once.
I got 12 and they are sitting out on my back patio now full of baking soda solution to remove the berry smell. Then I need to look into getting myself a heat sealer and mylar bags and oxygen absorber packets. I already have nontoxic silica gel packets for moisture sensitive stuff. I'm wondering if anyone has recommendations for where to get mylar bags, a sealer and the O2 packets. _________________ Mom's comin' round to put it back the way it oughta be...
Although if the buckets are food grade you dont need mylar bags. I would buy some Gamma Seal lids though. _________________ "Battle not with monsters, lest ye become a monster, and if you gaze into the
Abyss, the Abyss gazes also into you."
Ammo at a gunfight is like bubblegum in grade school: If you havent brought enough for everyone, you're in trouble
200 unit 50cc oxygen absorbers, $19.50, got 2 cases for $39. about 10 cents/unit.
500 8x10 3.5mil mylar bags, $85.50, works out to 17.1 cents/unit.
Shipping from Los Angeles to north Florida was $18.68. For 900 things, this works out to 2 cents/unit for shipping. $143 for the entire order.
For sealing the bags I have a clothes iron. Walmart sells the things for about a $10 bill.
The 8x10 bags hold about 2.5 pounds of rice. I'll be using one 50cc oxygen absorber for each pound of food, rounding up, 3 units per bag. cost per sealed bag is about 44 cents, or about 17 cents per pound. Volume is more economical: bigger bags, bigger absorbers. As this is my first experience with mylar and oxygen absorbers, I wanted the ability to try all sorts of things. At the use rates, I should be able to put up 332 pounds of stuff in 133 bags at which point I should be out of absorbers. Some goods I will store without oxygen absorbers: salt, sugar for example. Tonight its rice and beans.
A particularly useful property of mylar is that it is reusable, provided it is not punctured. Once the contents are used or transfered to a daily use container, the bag is easily cleaned out, dried, and ready for repeated use. Each time the bag is reused it will get a little smaller as the sealed section is cut away. _________________ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--for ever."
-George Orwell, 1984
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:10 pm Post subject: Re: homemade superpails, woohoo!
I meant to add:
I get buckets from 2 sources
-Walmart for regular buckets and lids, no rubber gasket, about $4.50 for a bucket and lid. Be sure to have the bar codes for the pail, lid, and combo at the ready so you can bitch at the cashier when she tries to charge you for the bucket and lid separately. Happens every time I go in.
-Home Depot. A much better bucket and lid, about $6 for the 2 pieces. More durable, heavier duty bucket and handle. Lid has a rubber gasket and can be put in place more permanently. You will need to cut the slots on the lid to open it up. These I use for those Items that will be going into storage for longer terms. Why spend the big money on stuff I will go through in the next couple of years. At this point, this is mostly what I buy.
It also just occurred to me that it is Saturday night and I am at home alone packing food. I need to get out more. _________________ If you want a picture of the future, imagine a boot stamping on a human face--for ever."
-George Orwell, 1984
Joined: Oct 24, 2006 Posts: 111 Location: Pacific Northwest
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:16 pm Post subject: Re: homemade superpails, woohoo!
You do not need a heat sealer to close mylar bags. A hot iron and a board edge to press it on is all you need. Here is a link to a good short video showing how to do it.
I have done alot of superpails myself and they are quite easy t do. Also, I noted someone stated you really did not need them with a good bucket - but I would have to disagree with that comment if you intend to keep the food item a year or more. Plastic pails are sufficiently porous to allow oxygen to permeate. Oxygenation is what causes food to eventually go rancid or spoil. A mylar bag properly sealed and with oxygen removed is NOT porous and will remain oxygenless - substantially increasing the shelf life and quaity of the food stored. Regular bucket storage is a good option for something you will use in relatively short order. _________________ Check out Our Modern "Victory Garden" - http://www.freewebs.com/kitsapfreedomgardener/
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:45 pm Post subject: Re: homemade superpails, woohoo!
Thanks for the video links folks.
DoubleD wrote:
Also, I noted someone stated you really did not need them with a good bucket - but I would have to disagree with that comment if you intend to keep the food item a year or more. Plastic pails are sufficiently porous to allow oxygen to permeate. Oxygenation is what causes food to eventually go rancid or spoil.
Yep, that's the reason for doing the mylar even in food grade buckets -- first, I want smaller packets anyway and second, some of this stuff is likely going to need to keep for quite some time. Both because I'm single and even if I were to feed my housemate or whatever, she doesn't eat much and it's still just for 2 people, really. Maybe my niece if she made it up here in the SHTF situation. Again, doesn't eat much.
Is anybody else using silica gel packets to remove moisture? Primarily for things like sugar or salt, maybe some grains -- I've read you shouldn't use them on beans though as it will make the beans difficult to rehydrate and use later. They're cheap, I got about 200 little ones to throw in food bags. I also got 4 big ones to keep various other things dry, including the fireproof safe I'm planning to get in a week or so to keep small firearms, ammo and important documents. (That's just good sense, peak oil or not, IMO.) _________________ Mom's comin' round to put it back the way it oughta be...
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 8:50 pm Post subject: Re: homemade superpails, woohoo!
No doubt. Use Mylar with metallized surface - not just the clear stuff.
Sorbent Systems is where to get them.
Why not use rubber sealed lids? A buck or two more but with the Mylar you're good forever - or close to it.
As for the Gamma lid - really expensive for what you're getting, and, IMO, not worth the money.
If you crack into a 5 gallon of rice in 5 years, it's not like it's going to go bad before you eat the 5 gallons of rice, so what's the point of a resealable lid on a container that's not O2 tight in the first place?-
Overkill on the O2 absorbers. O2 is the enemy. Without O2, virtually no life can breed in your buckets, be they bacteria, fungus, or insect.
Just my 2 cents - more than one way to skin this cat.
I also don't get the use of smaller bags. If you're doing LTFS for emergencies, then 1 gallon bags don't make any sense to me, unless you're 95 pounds, you need only 1,000 calories a day, and you live alone. _________________ Massive Human Dieoff must occur as a result of Peak Oil. Many more than half will die. It will occur everywhere, including where you live. If you fail to recognize this, then your odds of living move toward the "going to die" group.
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