Get the US out of the UN

Chicagoan · Heavy Crude Joined: Jun 19, 2004 Posts: 315

Let me make myself clear. I am against American imperialism in any form. I believe that we should reduce our existing army and bring all of our troops home. Not just in Iraq, but everywhere. This should be done as quickly as possible. We should make it a law that all Americans own guns and know how to use them. Nobody would dare invade us then.

This site really explains my views on the UN.
http://www.getusout.org/unreform.html

evilmonkeyspanker · Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2005 1:02 am Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN

The US government has no more integrety than the UN I say all togther it is a perfect fit.

hoplite · Heavy Crude Joined: Oct 22, 2004 Posts: 300

WE don't have to leave the UN, just stop funding them. All the UN does with our money is fund their appetite for booze, drugs, and blonde hookers. THats the truth, as much as it hurts your liberal ears.

LadyRuby · Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2005 9:16 pm Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN

Tyler_JC · Posted: Sun Sep 04, 2005 11:13 pm Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN

Chicagoan · Heavy Crude Joined: Jun 19, 2004 Posts: 315

gg3 · Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 12:25 am Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN

The entire history of human civilization shows that when destructive capabilities reach a given size, the scope of law and order must expand to encompass and contain those destructive capabilities.

When families could wipe out other families, they learned to form tribes.

When tribes could wipe out tribes, they formed the first tribal unions or confederacies.

When these entities could wipe each other out, they formed into city-states, and then further into nation-states.

And in the early part of the 20th century, as destructive capabilities grew to include the means of mass warfare and aerial bombardment, the last of the European city-states were absorbed into nation-states as well.

The advent of nuclear and biological weaponry (even moreso than chemical weaponry) has given nation-states the capability to destroy one another.

Logically, and based on all of our history, the scope of law must expand to encompass and limit that destructive capability.

Those human settlements that did not expand their scope of law, have either perished due to unconstrained warfare, or remained at (or fell to) a level of barbarianism as we presently see in various parts of the Middle East, Africa, and the balkanized ethnic "-stans" of Europe. There is no reason to expect the present epoch to be any different than the past. And the occasional exceptions do not invalidate the rule.

So we have a choice: either we will live in a world of lawful and orderly relations among nation-states, or we will live in a world of lawlessness where deterrence eventually fails and mutual destruction among nation-states becomes more and more common.

The United Nations, for all of its problems, is a step toward fulfilling the necessity of lawful and orderly relations between nation-states.

Chicagoan, are you so sure you want to live in a lawless world? If so, how'bout you put your muscles where your mouth is and spend a couple of weeks on patrol duty in New Orleans?

falser · Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 1:10 pm Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN

The US has been taking a giant dump in the middle of the UN for a long time now. Just read PNAC, the US wants to abolish the UN (WW2 relic) and NATO (cold war relic) and completely replace it with totaltarian American authority. The Iraq war wasn't just about destablising middle eastern governments, it was a big theatrical show for the world to see that the US can do anything it wants without it's permission.

SHiFTY · Heavy Crude Joined: Jun 27, 2005 Posts: 171

The US could indeed exit the UN... if it was at all self sufficient.

As it stands, the US relies very heavily on the rest of the world. For example, oil from M.E., vast quantities of cheap goods from China, computer programmers from india, cheap loans from Japan & S. Korea, Uranium from Australia, luxury goods from Europe and so on.

Like it or not, the US is heavily interdependent on the rest of the world, and any move towards isolationism could only hurt the US.

I imagine that the US will keep doing the same things, i.e. paying lip service to the UN and just doing what it likes anyway...

rogerhb · Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 4:26 pm Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN

Apparently the UN op in Korea went ahead because the Russion delegation could not get to the vote in time.

Similarly, the other countries in the UN could arrange to vote the US off the security council by having the vote in Cuba (say). Visas could be denied to anybody with the surname Bolton.

Macsporan · Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 8:18 pm Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN

It is hard for me to find words to describe what a foolish proposal this is. Rolling Eyes

America does not need to be more isolated and reviled than it already is.

With PO imminent a brutish international free-for-all is the last thing we need.

We need international planning and cooperation to work and work well.

The UN might not be a perfect World Government, but its the only one we've got.

Don't listen to these cursed Neo-Cons, they're not exactly Nazis but they're most of the way there; and grossly incompetent to boot.

I've never understood why some people have it in so bad for the poor old UN. Sad

It does a lot of good in the world and would do a lot more if Uncle Sam would cough up his dues.

There may well be some shady types hanging around it, there may well be corruption but it is hardly unique in this respect.

Also it has almost no power. It doesn't levy taxes and has no army or police force.

Any UN resolution can be ignored by any nation-state. Israel is a present ignoring 68 of them.

Any UN resolution can be Vetoed by the Security Council consisting of, yes what a surprise, largely the rich white nations of the Northern Hemisphere. Rolling Eyes

The UN is harmless, virtually impotent.

Leave it alone. It needs strengthening, not abandonment.

The stuff about US imperialism I wholly agree with, not because its US but because its Imperialism.
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Son of the Enlightenment

basil_hayden · Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 8:21 pm Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN

Anything Macsporan hates, I like. Does that make me a neocon?

Macsporan · Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 8:26 pm Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN

No, just very conservative.

Don't worry, its no longer a criminal offence and the social stigma is rapidly fading.

Perhaps one day you'll even be able to tell your parents.
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Son of the Enlightenment

falser · Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 8:30 pm Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN

rogerhb · Posted: Mon Sep 05, 2005 8:47 pm Post subject: Re: Get the US out of the UN