Joined: Dec 04, 2004 Posts: 2337 Location: perpetual state of exhaustion
Posted: Tue Nov 01, 2005 11:44 am Post subject: Re: Nothing Pops A Housing Bubble Like Unemployment
Quote:
Except in the late 90s when they developed the farmland in Kelowna BC.
It gets worse, I was reading an article and it said that the encroaching suburbanites were complaining about the noise that you get from farms. I guess they didn't like the smell of cow poop, and the noise from farm animals interrupted their quiet mornings sitting on their balconies.
There was a vineyard owner in Kelowna (which brought this to mind), who'd been there for years before they started to develop the farmland near his place. the vineyard owner used a gun to scare off the birds each morning from eating his grapes and the suburbanites marched down to city hall to complain.
this is appently a huge issue. as suburbia encroaches on farmland, they don't want to be reminded of farms etc while living in their city like homes.
wild eh?
Joined: Oct 03, 2004 Posts: 522 Location: Washington State
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 2:04 pm Post subject: Re: Nothing Pops A Housing Bubble Like Unemployment
If TPTB go forward with their proposal to eliminate the mortgage interest deduction, it will hasten the pop. _________________ This is where everybody puts profound words written by another...or not so profound words written by themselves
Highlander 2007
Joined: Aug 17, 2004 Posts: 3541 Location: 39° 39' N 77° 77' W or thereabouts
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 3:54 pm Post subject: Re: Nothing Pops A Housing Bubble Like Unemployment
highlander wrote:
If TPTB go forward with their proposal to eliminate the mortgage interest deduction, it will hasten the pop.
Where did you read they would eliminate mortgage interest deductions? I have only read that morgage interest deductions will be capped and that the cap is on interest greater than $400K
Posted: Thu Nov 03, 2005 4:09 pm Post subject: Re: Nothing Pops A Housing Bubble Like Unemployment
BabyPeanut wrote:
highlander wrote:
If TPTB go forward with their proposal to eliminate the mortgage interest deduction, it will hasten the pop.
Where did you read they would eliminate mortgage interest deductions? I have only read that morgage interest deductions will be capped and that the cap is on interest greater than $400K
If they had any balls, they would eliminate the mortgage interest deduction for second homes, a $20 billion/year entitlement program. _________________ "It's called the American Dream because you'd have to be asleep to believe it."
Experts say jump in cancelled orders for new homes is latest sign of how investors inflated the real estate market recently, and how the market is due for a downturn.
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) - Home builders are growing concerned about an increasing number of cancelled new home orders, which experts say could be a sign of an underlying weakness in the recent run in home prices.
Specifically, the cancelled orders could be the latest warning sign that buyers who were turning to real estate as an investment, rather than for their own housing needs, are shifting out of real estate. And that could mean that in many hot markets, the air is about to come out of over-inflated real home prices overall.
Joined: Apr 05, 2005 Posts: 1628 Location: Springsteen Country (NJ)
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 3:48 pm Post subject: Re: Home flippers fleeing
This is excellent news! I live in a town in central New Jersey that's under extreme development pressure that we're trying to stop. There's a farm behind my house that Troll Brothers is trying to get approvals to build on. Maybe this will make them think twice, especially combined with the $80/bbl oil we'll certainly get this summer! We have a mayor that's in the pocket of the developers (even though he ran on stopping development), so a few of us got together to start a recall petition drive. One thing I've learned is that people need to be shaken and startled into believing that you can actually stop growth, that it's not inevitable. Amazing the brainwashing that the growth machine has shoved into people's minds that they'll support the very thing they'll later complain about, increased population/development.
I'll post some more on our quest to fight the growth machine when the story starts jelling more. _________________ Joe P. United Political Debate
"Only when the last tree is cut; only when the last river is polluted; only when the last fish is caught; only then will they realize that you cannot eat money." - Cree Indian Proverb
Joined: May 24, 2004 Posts: 3429 Location: California, USA
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 3:54 pm Post subject: Re: Home flippers fleeing
I'll wade right into this by saying in no uncertain terms that home-flippers, defined as those who earn all or a substantial part of their income or profits by buying & selling houses to make money on short-term speculative increases in value (not including developers, builders, and real estate agents acting at the behest of ordinary buyers and sellers, all of which are separate cases), are scum.
For emphasis, home-flippers as defined above, are scum.
If anyone wants to raise a controversy over this I'll be more than glad to expand on the point later tonight.
Joined: Dec 06, 2005 Posts: 850 Location: Stopped at the border.
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 4:00 pm Post subject: Re: Home flippers fleeing
So, is this the result of higher interest rates or of the lack of any real appreciation of wages at the working level during the last two decades? Introductory wages today, adjusted for inflation, are less than the minimum wage of a decade ago. When people thought there was something to be gained from it they could lie about the actual percentage, saying it was 33% (a third) of their wages that they were putting towards their house while actually throwing more like 67% (two thirds) at their mortgages. I used to be a payroll clerk, doing income verification, I know how people scam. Credit costs are hammering these poor unfortunates. The smart ones will get out of their untenable situations now, but most people in those positions aren't all that smart. They will keep it together until they can't keep it together. Their incentive to keep it together is all of the shopping cart dwellers they are seeing on their city's streets.
It is beginning to look like the touters of American style capitalism, you know the ones that never have enough bad things to say about Europe and its 'socialist' policies, are going to conveniently go away for awhile. They are all going to the same place as Abbey Joseph Cohen, the limbo of all uni-dimensional intellects.
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 4:36 pm Post subject: Re: Home flippers fleeing
I think most home-flippers don't do it full-time. Like the e-traders of the dot-com boom, most of them have day jobs, and use flipping homes as a side investment.
One of my friends bought two condos as an investment last year. She works full-time as a corrections officer (which should be pretty steady work), and is not planning to quit any time soon. Nor is she planning to live in the condos; she has a house, and doesn't want to live in the neighborhood where her condos are.
But you can see why this kind of investor would bail out quickly if the market starts softening. They aren't dependent on real estate, so when things start looking squishy, they cut and run. Even if they lose money, it's generally money they can afford to lose, because they have day jobs.
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 5:45 pm Post subject: Re: Home flippers fleeing
gg3 wrote:
I'll wade right into this by saying in no uncertain terms that home-flippers, defined as those who earn all or a substantial part of their income or profits by buying & selling houses to make money on short-term speculative increases in value (not including developers, builders, and real estate agents acting at the behest of ordinary buyers and sellers, all of which are separate cases), are scum.
For emphasis, home-flippers as defined above, are scum.
If anyone wants to raise a controversy over this I'll be more than glad to expand on the point later tonight.
Scum? Actually they are providing a valuable service to renters. There are so many people buying and renting out condos, that vacancy rates are up and these nouveaux landlords have to compete with one another for tenants, keeping rent prices down. My bros and sister and I bought a place together and we're renting it out at a price the tenants can pretty easily afford. If they wanted to buy the same property, with minimum down, their payments would double.
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 6:40 pm Post subject: Re: House speculators fleeing
Considering that housing accounts for a huge chunk of the US economy, it's not good for the economy. I forget what fraction of it that it is, does anyone know? Kunstler says it I think in the End of Suburbia. Your satisfaction of stopping a development will be considerably lessened by other effects of this on you.
Posted: Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:42 pm Post subject: Re: Home flippers fleeing
threadbear wrote:
If they wanted to buy the same property, with minimum down, their payments would double.
I guess it goes without saying, but your tenants are barely covering half (if that) of your expenses of owning these condos, correct? The only logical reason why someone would do this is if they think that the equity gain will far outweigh the pittance in rent they're getting in the meantime. Otherwise, what's the gain of renting a place at a loss, right? I suppose this will work until the market sours.
(I'm not trying to sound sarcastic, I'm just wondering the justification for such a move. ) _________________ "It's called the American Dream because you'd have to be asleep to believe it."
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