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Oil's energy contribution has declined by about 12% since 1999. The world's economies have also declined by about 12%. (Using conventional metrics, which are time delayed determinations, this will only be seen in hind sight). The massive destruction of asset values now occurring testifies to it happening. Peak is well behind us, world economies have peaked and will continue to decline.

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Peakoil.com :: View topic - THE US Economy Thread (merged)
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THE US Economy Thread (merged)
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Graeme
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 10:28 pm    Post subject: THE US Economy Thread (merged) Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

US government near to debt limit
Quote:
US Treasury Secretary John Snow has told Congress to raise the government's credit limit in order to avoid having some of its operations shut down.
The government needs Congressional authority to borrow and the total accumulated debt is now close to its limit of $8.2 trillion (£4.7 trillion).
If the limit is not increased, the government could find it difficult to pay debts or borrow money.
Congress is expected to agree to an extension, averting any debt crisis.

BBC
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Dreamtwister
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2006 11:06 pm    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Quote:
averting any debt crisis

"We've got a problem guys! We aren't legally allowed to borrow more money! We're screwed now!"
"That's OK, we'll just change the law so we can borrow more."
"Whew, we sure dodged a bullet there!"
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albente
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 12:04 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

The Dollar as a currency seems to go in step with energy supply nowadays. Once the Dollar is renamed 'Freedom-Dollar' or 'Patriot-Dollar' you have an indicator that the whole thing turned sour indeed.
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CoronaWithLime
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 7:44 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

So should I start throwing my money in soft cold gold(the kind i can feel and bite) or consumer goods(toilet plungers, lint removers, dryer softener, ect...) I'm so freaking out man!
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IslandCrow
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 7:50 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

NO PANIC.
The BBC report stated the the Bush Government has already raised the borrowing limit 4 times, so we can be quite sure they will raise it a fifth time. The alternative will be to cut spending or default.
We should be worried about the debt levels, but it is not Panic stations yet.
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LadyRuby
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 8:22 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

What's this business about approaching the debt limit, we're already over.
The debt ceiling is $8.18 trillion. We're at $8.27 trillion as of March 3rd.
Bureau of the Public Debt - Debt to the Penny
Quote:
$8,270,568,938,276.67
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TheTurtle
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 8:29 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

And what does it really mean to be 8 TRILLION dollars in debt, anyway?
It's not like we are ever going to pay that back.

It is all illusion. Rolling Eyes
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IslandCrow
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 9:15 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

LadyRuby wrote:
What's this business about approaching the debt limit, we're already over.
The debt ceiling is $8.18 trillion. We're at $8.27 trillion as of March 3rd.

There was a previous thread on this issue about a month ago, and the basic answer to your point is that not all the debt counts towards the legal limit, so they are probably still under the legal limit.
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venky
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 9:17 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

8 trillion, that is still only about two thirds of GDP. Dont deny that it is a cause for concern, especially with the irresponsibility of it all. But still, such a ratio is common in most industrialized countries, in many its even worse. Before the hyper inflation in Germany in the 1920's the debt was something like 5 times the GDP I believe.
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Cran
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 9:44 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Why don't they just print out $8.27 trillion in new bank notes and pay back the loan! Cool

Sorted! Evil or Very Mad
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TommyJefferson
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2006 11:44 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

venky wrote:
...such a ratio is common in most industrialized countries

http://www.gillespieresearch.com/cgi-bin/bgn/article/id=342
That article says the US debt to income ratio is 334%
"...the highest level of debt to GDP seen among the 14 other "AAA" countries is at 75.6% for Canada, followed by France at 71.1%, Germany at 65.1% and Austria at 64.9%, versus a GAAP ratio of total financial obligations to GDP of 334.3% for the United States."
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Raxozanne
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 1:40 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I really can't see the point in having an official debt limit as they just keep on raising it anytime they approach it.
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warnio
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2006 3:20 pm    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I would like to say these two things:
1) the US government has been doing this for at least 150 years, it's a very normal thing. No news actually.
2) The public debt of the USA is, in my eyes, not high. It's only 65% of it's GDP.

I live in Belgium, we have a debt of 94% and we're doing just fine ! Twelve years ago we had a debt of 135%. That was high but it obviously didnt kill us Smile
Other countries like Italy 107% and Japan 170% have a high debt. The public debt of the USA is average at most. You guys can just relax, nothing to worry about...
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oilfreeandhappy
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 12:12 am    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Yeah, I guess we shouldn't worry. Maybe Mexico will bail us out. The debt is one thing, but the record federal deficit is the big concern. Until this gets under control, the debt will continue to skyrocket.
http://home.comcast.net/~oil_free_and_happy/

warnio wrote:
I would like to say these two things:
1) the US government has been doing this for at least 150 years, it's a very normal thing. No news actually.
2) The public debt of the USA is, in my eyes, not high. It's only 65% of it's GDP.
I live in Belgium, we have a debt of 94% and we're doing just fine ! Twelve years ago we had a debt of 135%. That was high but it obviously didnt kill us Smile
Other countries like Italy 107% and Japan 170% have a high debt. The public debt of the USA is average at most. You guys can just relax, nothing to worry about...
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uNkNowN ElEmEnt
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 12:57 pm    Post subject: Re: US government near to debt limit Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I think that's why they made Bernake the Fed head. so they can just print their way out of any major problem... or so they think.
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