Like the illusion of Wall Street, with its vast and powerful investment banks, now shuttered, China too is an illusion perpetuated by the Globalists that gave us the 15,000 mile Caesar salad, poisoned cat food and lead based paint on babies' pacifiers. Like the illusion that money would come from thin air to always push housing prices higher, China has spent a generation pursuing its illusion. Pursuing an unattainable dream to be like the West, while 6000 years of its carefully shepherded top soil blows into the sea.
Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 7:39 pm Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
jbeckton wrote:
Aaron wrote:
You sir, are an evil man to continue your campaign of misinformation posts like this one.
I am embarrassed for you and by you.
The only useful purpose you serve is as an object lesson in the dark side of humanity.
Want to know why PO is a problem?
Look no further than this post.
Deliberate disinformation is nothing short of treason against mankind.
Your long-standing commitment to quantity disinformation posts is a self-evident indictment of your credibility.
And proof of your selfish agenda.
"May you live forever."
Aaron, which post/poster is this refering to?
Unfortunately Aaron's post accurately describes more then 1 person. I lost count how many times a techno-cornucopian started spreading "sexed up" statistics about some energy technology. Whenever I ask for details they give me IMPOSSIBLE technical specifications for a technology that supposedly can perform 200% and cost 50% of what is realistic. That's why I gave up on visiting the technology forum.
I got tired of people posting threads about EV cars and batteries that "supposedly" have twice the energy density, twice the Cycle durability, twice the range, half the battery weight, and half the cost.
If I sound "disappointed" that is not true. You see, in order to get disappointed you have to at least assume the other person had decency to begin with. However if you never assumed the person to be honest to begin with then you never have to worry about getting disappointed ever again.
Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 8:59 am Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
Maybe the whole purpose of this latest idea from Her Majesty's govt is to wake the public up to what an expensive, logistically complex and visually intrusive scheme this would be. Not to mention that after you'd gone to all the trouble of building this huge network of wind generators the power supply would be intermittent. Certainly, an expansion of the nuclear industry would look small-scale compared to this (with the added benefit of power 24/7).
Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 9:03 am Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
thylacine wrote:
Maybe the whole purpose of this latest idea from Her Majesty's govt is to wake the public up to what an expensive, logistically complex and visually intrusive scheme this would be. Not to mention that after you'd gone to all the trouble of building this huge network of wind generators the power supply would be intermittent. Certainly, an expansion of the nuclear industry would look small-scale compared to this (with the added benefit of power 24/7).
Ya, but nuclear power doesn't have the fluffy feel good sound to it like wind power! That overrules all logic.
I am curious, what is the public consensus about nuclear power in England after they have witnessed what France has done?
Any Brits here? _________________ Those that cannot do..... teach. Those that cannot teach......teach gym.-Jack black
Joined: Oct 01, 2007 Posts: 479 Location: Rural farm
Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 10:59 am Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
I would move to the mainland, the islands while you can still fly, it is harder by canoe later. _________________ ___________________________
Everything is going to happen more or less simultaneously.
Your relatives,their broken down car, and their credit card debt are coming to live with you in 2008
Last edited by kadoomsoon on Fri Dec 21, 2007 8:18 am; edited 1 time in total
Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 11:41 am Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
TheTurtle wrote:
mkwin wrote:
It is typical of doomers to talk about a problem at the very extreme of possibility as if it were an impending disaster.
What leads you to believe the problem of rising waters is "at the very extreme of possibility"?
Because no respected climatologist is predicting a sea level rise more than a couple of meters in the most extreme scenarios. These predictions are based on the assumptions of all 3 major ice sheets melting, something no climate model predicts as remotely likely, especially the massive east antarctic ice sheet.
Joined: Mar 04, 2005 Posts: 2753 Location: New Zealand
Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 2:31 pm Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
jbeckton wrote:
Aaron wrote:
You sir, are an evil man to continue your campaign of misinformation posts like this one.
I am embarrassed for you and by you.
The only useful purpose you serve is as an object lesson in the dark side of humanity.
Want to know why PO is a problem?
Look no further than this post.
Deliberate disinformation is nothing short of treason against mankind.
Your long-standing commitment to quantity disinformation posts is a self-evident indictment of your credibility.
And proof of your selfish agenda.
"May you live forever."
Aaron, which post/poster is this refering to?
I think Aaron is certainly referring to me. He has criticised some of my posts in the past, some were justifiable. But not this one. See also my thread on connecting wind farms.. However, I'm not sure whether the British government intends to do this. Could our current transportation system be replaced eventually by an electrified one? _________________ Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe. H. G. Wells.
Fatih Birol's motto: leave oil before it leaves us.
Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 2:48 pm Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
Graeme wrote:
I think Aaron is certainly referring to me. He has criticised some of my posts in the past, some were justifiable. But not this one. See also my thread on connecting wind farms.. However, I'm not sure whether the British government intends to do this. Could our current transportation system be replaced eventually by an electrified one?
I am surprised, you seem to bring a lot of world energy news to this site for better or worse, it's at least worth discussing.
I think it is important to understand things even when you don't agree with them. The doomers should be happy you bring these stories so they can confront any fallacies the feel they contain head on. _________________ Those that cannot do..... teach. Those that cannot teach......teach gym.-Jack black
Joined: Mar 04, 2005 Posts: 2753 Location: New Zealand
Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 11:22 pm Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
Government Falls Behind on Wind Farm Targets
Quote:
The government made an announcement yesterday about a major expansion of off shore wind power. Mark Newton wind farm expert from Fisher German chartered surveyors responds.
“The reality is that the 7,000 target for off shore wind turbines set by the government for 2020 is likely to be unrealistic, considering that their short term target of 10% electricity produced by renewable energy by 2010 is already falling far short.”
In Britain, the new turbines will be built at a number of wind farms off the coast of England and Wales, including a massive project called the London Array that will plant 271 turbines at the mouth of the Thames River. The new projects will be spearheaded by companies including Scottish and Southern Energy, which is looking to diversify its renewable power generation portfolio. "We are the UK's leading generator of renewable energy, so we will definitely be involved," said Sharron Miller-McKenzie, a spokeswoman for the company.
businessweek _________________ Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe. H. G. Wells.
Fatih Birol's motto: leave oil before it leaves us.
Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 8:44 am Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
thylacine wrote:
Maybe the whole purpose of this latest idea from Her Majesty's govt is to wake the public up to what an expensive, logistically complex and visually intrusive scheme this would be. Not to mention that after you'd gone to all the trouble of building this huge network of wind generators the power supply would be intermittent. Certainly, an expansion of the nuclear industry would look small-scale compared to this (with the added benefit of power 24/7).
So you are saying that offshore turbines will be visually intrusive when the majority will barely be seen from shoreline. Complex, YES!! Expensive YES!!! but compared to similar expansion of nuclear, NO!! You get variable supply which as many posters have pointed out before can be managed especially in combination with responsible nat. gas use. and geographic diversity and interconnection. And you get the side benefit of not leaving future generations with additional millstones around their necks in terms of how they can proceed dealing with the myriad issues of nuclear most of which we have not even remotely started to be addressed with the existing facilities. _________________ For ionizing radiation “…the human epidemiological evidence establishes—by any reasonable standard of proof—that there is no safe dose or dose-rate…the safe-dose hypothesis is not merely implausible—it is disproven.” Dr. J.W. Gofman 4
Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 9:24 am Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
Andy wrote:
thylacine wrote:
Maybe the whole purpose of this latest idea from Her Majesty's govt is to wake the public up to what an expensive, logistically complex and visually intrusive scheme this would be. Not to mention that after you'd gone to all the trouble of building this huge network of wind generators the power supply would be intermittent. Certainly, an expansion of the nuclear industry would look small-scale compared to this (with the added benefit of power 24/7).
So you are saying that offshore turbines will be visually intrusive when the majority will barely be seen from shoreline. Complex, YES!! Expensive YES!!! but compared to similar expansion of nuclear, NO!! You get variable supply which as many posters have pointed out before can be managed especially in combination with responsible nat. gas use. and geographic diversity and interconnection. And you get the side benefit of not leaving future generations with additional millstones around their necks in terms of how they can proceed dealing with the myriad issues of nuclear most of which we have not even remotely started to be addressed with the existing facilities.
It will take much more effort and much more time to implement (in the short term granted) wind power on the scale nuclear is already capable of. If we had that time I would be all for wind, but now we need stable power, and lots of it as PO will cause increased reliance on electricity.
If we limit ourselves to wind and solar, the GW problem will only grow as we are forced to burn more coal and cannot afford the time and money to build emissions controls along with it.
In the short term, the choice is coal or nuclear, not alternatives or nuclear.
At least for the most part. _________________ Those that cannot do..... teach. Those that cannot teach......teach gym.-Jack black
Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 4:12 pm Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
jbeckton wrote:
I am curious, what is the public consensus about nuclear power in England after they have witnessed what France has done?
Any Brits here?
They have not witnessed it. Most British people if asked either would not know about the French grid being mostly nuclear, or would not consider the fact relevant to their own country and experience. What the French did does not seem to count, for lack of a better expression. It is not considered a valid precedent because it was established elsewhere. Public opinion remains split, and thanks to that attitude, the French experience is dud ammunition in the hands of the pro-nuclear camp.
Of course, freeze them good and hard one winter and it will be a different story.
For the time being, all the money is going into gas. _________________ Volatility. When life isn't exciting enough.
Joined: Mar 04, 2005 Posts: 2753 Location: New Zealand
Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2007 11:27 pm Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
Future Breeze - Spain to Install Offshore Wind Farms
Quote:
In an effort to boost the use of renewable energy sources, the government of Spain has permitted legislation for the set up of offshore wind parks.
RNCOS has recently released a comprehensive market research report “Spain Energy Sector Outlook” that analyzes the changing scenario of the energy sector in Spain. As per the report, the wind power installed capacity in Spain has increased to 11,615 MW during 2006, with the new installed capacity of 1588 MW and is projected to reach up to 20,155 MW by 2010.
The report has found that Spain is the pioneer in worldwide wind industry along with Germany and stands as the second biggest wind energy producer at the European as well as international level.
prminds _________________ Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe. H. G. Wells.
Fatih Birol's motto: leave oil before it leaves us.
Posted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 2:21 pm Post subject: Re: Offshore wind to power every British home by 2020
To clarify the above, when I tell people that the French get most of their electricity from nuclear power and even export it, the response is usually "Interesting, but that's not a reason for us to do it." _________________ Volatility. When life isn't exciting enough.
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