Joined: May 27, 2007 Posts: 1203 Location: The Post Peak Oil Historian
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 3:27 am Post subject: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
It will come as a surprise to most non-experts, but just as we are living in the 21st century according to the calendar, we are creatures of what's called the Holocene in geological time.
And it's been that way, according to scientists, for about 11,700 years -- a discernible boundary in Earth's history that is marked, among other ways, by evidence of meltwater lakes and gravel ridges left across the Canadian landscape when the glaciers retreated at the end of the last ice age.
All of recorded human history has taken place within the Holocene. But now, a distinguished group of British geologists has provocatively proposed that the Holocene is over and that we have entered a new geological era -- the Anthropocene.
"Since the start of the Industrial Revolution, Earth has endured changes sufficient to leave a global stratigraphic signature distinct from that of the Holocene . . . encompassing novel biotic, sedimentary and geochemical change," the scientists state in February's cover story of GSA Today, a publication of the Geological Society of America.
"These changes, although likely only in their initial phases, are sufficiently distinct and robustly established for suggestions of a Holocene-Anthropocene boundary in the recent historical past to be geologically reasonable."
link _________________ In a time of deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act.
- George Orwell
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 7:15 am Post subject: Re: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
Must suck being a geologist - you only get to name a new epoch/era every couple million years or so. _________________ Massive Human Dieoff must occur as a result of Peak Oil. Many more than half will die. It will occur everywhere, including where you live. If you fail to recognize this, then your odds of living move toward the "going to die" group.
Joined: Oct 06, 2006 Posts: 1011 Location: was rwwff
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 8:21 am Post subject: Re: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
DoomWarrior wrote:
Given that civilization has only another decade or two remaining, why start a new era now?
Because whether or not civilization survives is not particularly relevant to the fact that the changes that we've initiated will endure for thousands of years to come. _________________ Yes, we are. As we are.
And so shall we remain; Until the end.
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 9:05 am Post subject: Re: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
Quote:
Because whether or not civilization survives is not particularly relevant to the fact that the changes that we've initiated will endure for thousands of years to come.
If civilization does end over the next few 100 years the stratigraphic record would be so thin as to be practically unrecognizable. Although not a student of the "rare event" school of thought (aka Velikovsky) it is true that thick stratigraphic sections that aren't related to 100's of millions of years of paleohistory are formed through rapid depositional events. This can occur from landslides, floods, turbidite flows, volcanism etc. As a consequence I would argue since all of the events that result in rapid deposition are unrelated to man's activities the rock record will barely show us as being here.
I always like to use the famous "movie" analog when people start to think their importance on earth is overly significant. If earth's history was a movie that latest 1 year:
- single cell organisms first show up in April...a pretty boring first 3 months of film viewing
-the first vertebrates arrive in late May
-July sees the arrival of land plants
-in late August the first amphibians appear
-dinosaurs dominate the film for Sept, Oct and November
-the great Laramide orogeny happens in the end of November and the dinosaurs more of less dissappear (meteorite?), Cancun probably wasn't a good place to be holidaying then
-in early December mammals begin to dominate
-on Dec 31st the first evidence of man shows up. During that afternoon there are four successive glacial advances and retreats.
- it isn't until 11:oo PM that old stone age man (homo sapiens sapiens or cro-magnon man) finally appears.
-at 11:59:40 Colombus discovers America.
My point here is that on this scale of things the human impact on earth which really only started in the twentieth century (a couple of seconds before the end of the movie) is extremely short lived, so much so as to be completely unnoticeable in the overall geologic timeframe. Suck it up folks....we aren't that important.
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 9:47 am Post subject: Re: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
No, we're only causing the fastest extinction event ever.
Also the single celled organisms were the only form of life for a far higher percentage of time than your analogy says. _________________ "One minute I held the key, next the walls were closed on me, and I discovered that my castle stands upon pillars of salt and pillars of sand."
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 12:25 pm Post subject: Re: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
Just cause I liked the analogy (dont want to hijack the thread):
MYA EVENT TIME /DATE
"4600 Earth formed from planetary nebula 1/1/04 12:00 AM
3900 Inferred origin of life (first cells) 2/25/04 4:41 PM
3800 Oldest age-dated rocks on Earth 3/4/04 3:39 PM
3600 Fossil blue-green algae and stromatolites (prokaryots) 3/20/04 1:33 PM
3250 First fossil evidence of bacteria 4/17/04 9:54 AM
2100 First fossil evidence of cells with a nucleus 7/17/04 9:54 PM
1500 First multi-celled organisms (seaweed and algae) 9/3/04 3:39 PM
670 Oldest marine worms and jellyfish 11/8/04 4:35 PM
600 Vendian period begins: Edicarian fossils 11/14/04 6:15 AM
544 Cambrian system begins 11/18/04 5:11 PM
515 Burgess Shale organisms: first animals with a 11/21/04 12:34 AM
505 Ordovician system begins 11/21/04 7:40 PM
505 First fish 11/21/04 7:40 PM
470 First fossil evidence of land plants 11/24/04 2:30 PM
438 Silurian system begins 11/27/04 3:36 AM
430 First vascular land plants 11/27/04 6:53 PM
414 Oldest lung fish fossils 11/29/04 1:26 AM
408 Devonian system begins 11/29/04 12:53 PM
408 Oldest fossil evidence of mosses 11/29/04 12:53 PM
385 First insects (beetles), scorpions, and centipedes 12/1/04 8:49 AM
380 First lobe-finned fish 12/1/04 6:21 PM
375 First land animals (amphibians) 12/2/04 3:54 AM
370 First sharks 12/2/04 1:27 PM
365 First seed plants (ferns) 12/2/04 11:00 PM
360 Mississippian system begins 12/3/04 8:33 AM
330 First possible reptiles 12/5/04 5:50 PM
320 Pennsylvanian system (Kentucky coal) 12/6/04 12:56 PM
286 Permian system begins 12/9/04 5:51 AM
260 Sail-backed reptiles (Dimetrodon) 12/11/04 7:30 AM
245 End of Paleozoic, 96% of all life on Earth perishes 12/12/04 12:09 PM
245 Triassic system begins 12/12/04 12:09 PM
240 First crocodiles 12/12/04 9:42 PM
228 First dinosaurs (Eoraptor and Saltoposuchus) 12/13/04 8:37 PM
221 First mammals (shrew-like) 12/14/04 9:59 AM
210 First turtles 12/15/04 6:59 AM
208 Jurassic system begins 12/15/04 10:48 AM
195 Dilophosaurus, an early Jurassic dinosaur 12/16/04 11:38 AM
155 First bird, Archeopteryx 12/19/04 4:01 PM
152 Apatosaurus and Brachiosaurus (long-necked 12/19/04 9:44 PM
150 Allosaurus, (meat-eating dinosaur) 12/20/04 1:33 AM
148 Stegosaurus, (plate-backed dinosaur) 12/20/04 5:23 AM
144 Cretaceous system begins 12/20/04 1:01 PM
115 First flowering plants 12/22/04 8:24 PM
82 Duck-billed dinosaurs (Maiasaurus) 12/25/04 11:24 AM
80 Protoceratops (first dinosaur eggs discovered) 12/25/04 3:14 PM
75 Triceratops 12/26/04 12:46 AM
70 Tyrannosaurus rex and Velociraptor 12/26/04 10:19 AM
65 End of Mesozoic, probably meteor or comet impact 12/26/04 7:52 PM
65 Tertiary system begins 12/26/04 7:52 PM
64 First ancestors of dogs and cats 12/26/04 9:47 PM
60 Grasses become widespread 12/27/04 5:25 AM
57 First ancestors of pigs and deer 12/27/04 11:09 AM
55 First horses (Eohippus) 12/27/04 2:58 PM
45 First ancestors of rabbits 12/28/04 10:04 AM
39 First monkeys 12/28/04 9:31 PM
4 Oldest human like ancestors (hominids) 12/31/04 5:18 PM
2 Quaternary system begins 12/31/04 8:56 PM
1 First of four ice ages 12/31/04 10:05 PM
1 Oldest direct human-ancestor fossil, Homo habilis 12/31/04 11:02 PM
0.1 First modern man, Homo sapiens 12/31/04 11:48 PM
0.05 Mammoth and mastodon bones, Big Bone Lick, KY 12/31/04 11:54 PM
228 years Revolutionary War 12/31/04 11:59 PM
63 years World War II 1/1/05 12:00 AM"
And since we are currently in a mass extinction event (top 6, likely 3rd biggest ever), even if us humans go extinct, there would be a definate marking point to say a new age begins here, for any future geologist eons down the road.
Joined: Aug 03, 2007 Posts: 3147 Location: Boston Suburbs
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 12:31 pm Post subject: Re: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
If that's the case, Cid, then why should you care so much about the day to day geopolitical issues? It's all going to pale in comparison to our environmental problems.
Joined: Oct 06, 2006 Posts: 1011 Location: was rwwff
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 1:59 pm Post subject: Re: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
rockdoc123 wrote:
If civilization does end over the next few 100 years the stratigraphic record would be so thin as to be practically unrecognizable.
We're talking about two different things; certainly the direct evidence of civilization will be barely (if at all) noticeable; however, the results of the actions that we have taken will persist and accelerate long after we are gone. It is the record produced by these changes in environment that justify the labeling of a new era; not the buildings and airplanes of modern man.
I see no reason to doubt that modern man can (and likely will) drive CO2 concentrations all the way to 1000 ppm. That, all by itself, will produce such a huge differential in the geological record; that no future observer could fail to notice. _________________ Yes, we are. As we are.
And so shall we remain; Until the end.
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 4:03 pm Post subject: Re: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
Quote:
I see no reason to doubt that modern man can (and likely will) drive CO2 concentrations all the way to 1000 ppm. That, all by itself, will produce such a huge differential in the geological record; that no future observer could fail to notice.
you speak with such certainty...forgetting that CO2 has been much higher in the geologic record and lower and higher and for very, very long periods of time. You forget the natural buffering system that is the earth....soil and oceans are both sinks for CO2. If man dissappers or the overall population decreases significantly plant life will thrive in a CO2 saturated environment which in turn sucks up more of the CO2. Our long term impact will be very small in comparison to something like a polar reversal. This all notwithstanding the fact there is still no proven causal link between anthropogenic CO2 and rising temperatures and as we keep seeing CO2 levels rising and temperatures not following in lockstep that link becomes even more nebulous...but don't get me started.
Man is nothing more than a minor bacterial infection as far as the earth is concerned.....bad headache, upset stomach, an embarassing rash etc. Once it get's rid of the bacteria it's natural immune system kicks in to bring it back to health.
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 4:33 pm Post subject: Re: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
AgentR wrote:
I see no reason to doubt that modern man can (and likely will) drive CO2 concentrations all the way to 1000 ppm. That, all by itself, will produce such a huge differential in the geological record; that no future observer could fail to notice.
Just curious: if mankind does become extinct, then what "future observers" will be around to appreciate this new geologic era?
Joined: Oct 06, 2006 Posts: 1011 Location: was rwwff
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 4:33 pm Post subject: Re: Humans have pushed planet into a new geological era
rockdoc123 wrote:
Quote:
I see no reason to doubt that modern man can (and likely will) drive CO2 concentrations all the way to 1000 ppm. That, all by itself, will produce such a huge differential in the geological record; that no future observer could fail to notice.
you speak with such certainty...forgetting that CO2 has been much higher in the geologic record and lower and higher and for very, very long periods of time.
We are really talking past each other. You are assuming I hold positions that I do not.
I'm not forgetting CO2 has been much higher; I'm relying on it. It is the reason why I have little doubt that we'll drive it that high. The fact that such concentrations have been sustained for very long periods of times in the past makes it a reasonable prediction that high CO2 levels will long continue, even after humans stop their contribution.
CO2 at the 1000 ppm level for any sustained period of time will produce an unmistakable change in deposited strata; which is what a geologist is really looking for; thus, it is reasonable to consider dubbing a new era, which, for the lack of a better term at the moment, is being given a human-centric name. Nothing really wrong with naming an era after the supreme apex predator that was there at the beginning.
And that is the topic of the thread.... no?
Is it justified to note the start of a new era? Is it wrong to acknowledge the start of one, simply because the observers are experiencing its beginnings directly in real time as opposed to observing accumulated change over time in the distant past? _________________ Yes, we are. As we are.
And so shall we remain; Until the end.
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