Future of timber (for timber owners and aficionados)

Heineken

I appreciate the comments, Treefarmer and SCF. I suppose it's worth trying to find someone who could take a look at them. There are mills here in this county---I can hear them at work on very quiet mornings with no wind.

I have many magnificent hardwoods on my property. For example, I have a grove of yellow-poplar trees that are two to three feet dbh and 125 feet high (what they call a "poplar cathedral"). I have some fabulous scattered white oaks. But I'm probably going to leave them being magnificent. You get that heavy machinery lumbering around and the place is never the same again (at least, not in your lifetime). I treasure my trails and the beauty. Maybe I could consider a conservation easement.

Someone connected with the Chicago Climate Exchange answered my inquiry about selling carbon credits in my total 75 acres of timber. He said that acreage is too small to be of interest!
_________________
"Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog

"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother

Newfie

Heineken

Negative, Newfie. Contact the Chicago Climate Exchange for more info. My guess is you've got a chance to get listed on the exchange, with that sort of acreage.
_________________
"Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog

"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother

TreeFarmer · Heavy Crude Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 350

If someone finds out about this please let us know. I have 273 acres.

TF

bromius · Heavy Crude Joined: May 26, 2008 Posts: 142

Hello everyone. This is my first post here, and I really can't believe I haven't stumbled on this site before. I've been following environmental and energy issues like a cult since, well, at least 2001. Thinking or talking about evolution, genetics, psychology and the philosophy and practice of science also get my brain buzzing. First time I heard the phrase 'peak oil' was back in 2004 or so, in a class at my college. I'm studying forestry there and will wrap that up this December. My choice to study forestry came partly from my enjoyment of being outside, but it was also strategic. By that time I had seen the writing on the wall. The area I call home is blessed with some lovely second growth forests that are coming into maturity, ironically thanks to oil being substituted for wood in many ways. If oil truly peaked, and I think it recently has or soon will, the pendulum is surely going to swing back the other day. I will be getting into the market just as it does. I do think likelihood of severe economic disruption increases daily, which will be an obstacle, but one I feel I can use my creativity and will to overcome. I'm also determined to be a good steward of the forests I manage so that they thrive and help sustain us indefinitely.

I know I have a great deal more to learn about the subjects that forestry encompasses, but at the same time I've spent countless hours already reading, writing about, and spending time in the field practicing it. I'm itching to share this knowledge now that I feel confident I understand and can use it. So please, ask me questions, use my knowledge. Its what will make me better, and you'll gain by it.

I'll make some more specific comments in this thread a little later, but for now, its just hello. I'm so glad I found this place.

-Bromius

Heineken

Welcome, Bromius! What a wonderful first post.

I was actually enrolled in the Virginia Tech forestry school a couple of decades ago. But the age difference between me (30s) and my rowdy, immature classmates caused me personal difficulties that led me to withdraw. Instead, I fell back on my English background and some other training and returned to my former profession as an editor (ultimately to the benefit of my finances, but not my soul).

But I never lost my love for trees and forests and wildlife; in fact, it's deepened with the years. I didn't become a forester, but at least I became a forest owner, and a very involved one.

My most recently read book in the field was "Positive Impact Forestry."

Actually I do have a question maybe you could help me with (I'm sure I'll have others, too). Last year I bought a stand of 23-yo loblolly pine that was thinned about 4 years ago (a bit late, I'd say). Maybe 5% of the trees were damaged in the thinning operation, with the damage ranging from minor nicks to huge gashes. Should I cut down the more seriously damaged trees or just leave them be? Is such damage typical, and if so, what's the usual procedure for dealing with it? I read somewhere that such trees should be removed from the stand within the first year after the damage to avoid attracting SPBs; but that window is past now so I'm safe, right?

Where are you located, BTW?
_________________
"Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog

"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother

bromius · Heavy Crude Joined: May 26, 2008 Posts: 142

Heineken -
Its cool you got some training in the field. The forester and/or loggers you deal with must appreciate working with an owner that has a deeper appreciation of whats going on. I can't wait to own some acres of my own.

As for your question, I looked up some info on southern pine beetle (I don't have any practical experience in loblolly pine since I'm in upstate NY, but I've studied southern pines, especially plantations. The extent and growth rates of these forests is pretty astounding). It sounds like what you don't want in your stand are trees that are alive but significantly weakened, since beetles can more successfully attack them and build up their population in the area. I would say if the wound at the base of the tree is fairly small and looks to be healing over, leave it since it isn't affecting the vigor of the tree. If the wound is severe and doesn't look to be healing, or looks stressed (thin crown, low amount of live crown, yellow needles) cut it.

The only other thing I would say is if you do cut, and that area has really deep, sandy soil that is very well to excessively drained, you might want to put some borax powder on the fresh cut stump. It helps prevent Annosum root rot which is a problem in these areas.

Heineken

That's great advice. The county forester who looked at the place said just leave them be, but your advice sounds better.

So far I haven't seen any damaged tree that seems to be ailing, but I'll watch for such cases. There are a very few dead standing pines.

Part of the property has a 7-acre former wheat/corn field I had planted in loblolly seedlings this spring. They're doing well, but the weeds are giving them a run for their money, I can tell you that (they scalped when machine planting, but the effect wasn't nearly as lasting as I had hoped it would be). I get down there when I can with my scythe to attack the broadleafed weeds. I'd rather not resort to herbicides.

I also planted some cherrybark oaks among the loblolly seedlings. I protected them with weed mats and staked wire cages. One study I read said that the growth of cherrybark oaks is poor in such settings, but I'm stubborn. I can give them individual attention.

The loblolly is one of the world's fastest-growing trees---a consideration when you're my age (early 50s). My ultimate goal for that property is a mixed stand, though. I'm not a big fan of plantations. There's an understory of hickory and oak stump sprouts I'd like to favor, so I'm reducing the number of sprouts to one one per stump when they get about ten feet high. The gum sprouts and red maple sprouts I chop down.
_________________
"Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog

"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother

bromius · Heavy Crude Joined: May 26, 2008 Posts: 142

Here is a good resource for anyone looking to gain a better of their forest land, especially at the tree level. The Silvics of North America is basically very detailed guide to 300+ of the most commercially or ecologically important trees in the lowe 48 states. Everything from physical descriptions, to growth habits, to ecology. Its available free from the Forest Service web page in PDF format in two volumes. I'm posting the link for the volume on conifers here.

Silvics of North America: Volume 1

I would also recommend checking out their website since they have all sorts of research publication by region (research station).

These won't tell you everything you need to know, but its a good place to start. Even if you delegate a lot of the work to a professional forester, having a deeper understanding of what a forest is and what it does will help you communicate what you want to them and hopefully get a better result in the end.

TreeFarmer · Heavy Crude Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 350

Heineken, I own 100 acres of pine trees down in GA. I would say just ignore the damaged trees, if they make it good, if not, well thats no different than cutting them down.

As for your newly planted trees, IMHO, you should have sprayed over them with a Velpar + Oust mixture just before spring. That would have kept the weeds off and given them a real fighting chance. I'm not sure what you could spray this time of year. Perhaps you could rig a good band sprayer and spray the middles, getting pretty close to the trees but not hitting them, and use roundup.

TF

Heineken

TF, the field in question had been planted in the corn the preceding year (and in wheat the year before that). My county forester said the scalping operation would probably be sufficient to control the weeds. Maybe he was wrong.

I e-mailed him about the problem and he said not to worry; since the weeds are annuals, they'll die in the fall and this will free up the seedlings for another round of growth next spring.

He did warn me about broadleafed weeds that can in some cases overwhelm a first-year seedling.

I have a probably irrational fear of herbicides. However, I may resort to them next year because I sure as hell am not going to weed around 3,000 seedlings ever again!

Anyway, this year, I keep at it with my sickle. Today I went down there again and cleared weed-free circles around another 200 or so seedlings. I take a sort of grim satisfaction in freeing them up, but it's brutal, brutal labor.

So far the seedlings are making excellent growth (survival after planting was at least 95%, too). Some have grown as much as a foot.

What you said about the damaged trees was exactly what the county forester said.

If I see any damaged trees that are starting to die, I do think I'll fell them to avoid potential SPB spots.
_________________
"Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog

"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother

TreeFarmer · Heavy Crude Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 350

H, I did not scalp my field because I did not want to make it uneven. I wich I would have known what you were going to do before hand, I could have put you on a better track perhaps. I don't fear the modern herbicides that much at all ( I could be totally wrong in not fearig them I know) but I don't use any pesticides.

If your trees are in rows, here is somethign you can do now. Get your tractor and rotary mower and mow beside each row, thus clearig the middles. Then, rig your sprayer where you can straddle one row at a time and spray some roundup plus Atrazine on either side of the tree, don't get it on the tree.

After you do this, you will only get some weeds right in the row, however, sunlight will be able to get to your trees from the sides now, so they will do well.

If you are interested in this let me know and I'll give more detailed instructions.

TF

Heineken

I don't have a tractor or those attachments, TF. I do have a 30" DR brush mower, which I will eventually be using to mow between the rows (for aesthetics if nothing else).

You're right, scalping does create a lumpy field, but I'm not too concerned about this (except for in the 1/3-acre area I'm keeping mowed for my camp site---I'll be having an 8 x 14 wooden shed installed there, so I can stay comfortably overnight).

If herbiciding becomes necessary I'll do it through the VA Dept. of Forestry---they have programs for this
_________________
"Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog

"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother

TommyJefferson