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Peakoil.com :: View topic - Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing?
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Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing?
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allenwrench
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Joined: Apr 23, 2008
Posts: 857

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:37 pm    Post subject: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Is there a limit to how high ammumnion will go..or no limit?
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biofuel13
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Joined: May 07, 2008
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Location: Chaska, MN

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 1:09 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Well I would say there are a couple factors involved, but all focused on supply and demand. Metals keep going up up up and so you will see that reflected in ammo prices. Add in the fact that more and more people seem to be arming themselves and their family members and you've got a pretty good recipe for a continued inflation of prices.
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GeoJAP
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Joined: Feb 14, 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 1:11 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I believe they will keep going up. The cost of raw materials (copper, lead) coupled with other business cost increases (energy costs, health care, etc) will push prices up.

Also, the U.N. has gotten many countries that used to surplus their older ammo (South Africa, Portugal, Britain, etc) to destroy their surplus rather than sell it on the open market. There is less surplus ammo available, which means less supply, which is also driving prices up.

I personally buy lots of surplus and eastern European ammo from wholesalers. My local Academy sporting goods store has good deals on Remington UMC 9mm ball also.

I can post some links to very reputable and competitively priced ammo wholesalers, if you like. You can get cases shipped directly to your door.
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farmall
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 1:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

GeoJAP wrote:


I can post some links to very reputable and competitively priced ammo wholesalers, if you like. You can get cases shipped directly to your door.


That would be nice, I have wondered where to go.
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grampybone
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 1:24 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Ammo has been going up steadily for over a year. Buy now while it's still relatively cheap! It's not going to go down in price anytime soon.
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joeltrout
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Joined: Sep 19, 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 1:31 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Does anyone have figures on how much ammo is used on a daily basis in Iraq? If the Dems win and pull out of Iraq would that add much ammo to the market to lessen prices or not enough to make much of a difference?

joeltrout
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GeoJAP
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:20 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I forgot to add the SW Asia conflicts to my list of reasons. Thanks Joel. I don't know the exact answer to your question, Joel, but I believe that if that were to happen, that you would start to see some more Lake City USA surplus on the market in time (which is virtually non-existent at the moment).

Here are some people that I have bought ammo from for almost 10 years now. I trust them very much.

www.aimsurplus.com <- Erik at Aim Surplus is the best guy in the business in my book.
www.amunitiontogo.com <- Great prices, friendly staff, and just up the road from me in Brenham, the home of Blue Bell ice cream.
www.ammoman.com <- I believe his name is Eric also. Wide assortment of surplus, as well as current-production American and foreign ammo.
www.wideners.com <- Not as wide of a selection as others, but good prices. Reloading supplies.
www.grafs.com/ <- Never ordered from them but they have a very good reputation. Lots of reloading supplies.

If you have a 01 or 03 federal firearms license, you can order from Century Arms. They are the biggest arms importer in the entire USA. They only sell to entities licensed by the BATF. I used to have an 03 collectors firearms license and would order directly from them. Century's policy on ammo shipping (a few years ago anyway) is $13 flat rate, irrespective of quantity. So you can order 3,000 rounds of .308 (195 pounds) and shipping is still only $13. That's a heckuva deal. Their self-assembled firearms are abominations but their ammo deals are incredible sometimes.
www.centuryarms.com

The US Civilian Marksmanship Program also sells good-quality surplus .30-06 for about $0.30 per round to use in M1 Garands and Remington 1903's. You need to jump through the hoops to get qualified with them, but it's not too hard. You can also buy an M1 Garand or .22 training rifle from them.
http://odcmp.com/
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vision-master
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

allenwrench wrote:
Is there a limit to how high ammumnion will go..or no limit?


You are only going to need one bullet!
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TnAndy
Heavy Crude
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Joined: Aug 31, 2005
Posts: 100

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

allenwrench wrote:
Is there a limit to how high ammumnion will go..or no limit?


Ammo, like everything else, is NOT "going up"......the paper fiat we use to buy it is simply getting crappier.

Example: 1964 when I first started driving, gasoline was 30 cents/gal......3 silver dimes.

Today, gasoline is STILL 3 silver dimes......but the silver dimes cost 1.30 in paper fiat to get.

Neither the gas nor the silver dimes changed much.....the paper simply got more worthless.

And since they are creating it by the boatload in one bubble after another, or to bailout someone from the last bubble, then odds are, yes...in terms of FRN ( federal reserve notes ), ammo is "going up".....along with about everything else, and it gets faster and faster toward the end of the fiat scheme. Count on it.
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GeoJAP
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Joined: Feb 14, 2008
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:56 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

Not exactly. I agree that the falling dollar drives up the prices when buying surplus ammo or copper. But Portuguese .308 was $0.15 per round in 2004. Today it is about $0.65 per round, if you can find it at all. It is more of a supply issue, I think, not as much because of currency debasement.

Pressure on the supply of raw materials for current production ammo similarly affects prices for new production.


Last edited by GeoJAP on Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:17 pm; edited 1 time in total
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JJ
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Joined: Aug 07, 2007
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

GeoJAP wrote:
I forgot to add the SW Asia conflicts to my list of reasons. Thanks Joel. I don't know the exact answer to your question, Joel, but I believe that if that were to happen, that you would start to see some more Lake City USA surplus on the market in time (which is virtually non-existent at the moment).

Here are some people that I have bought ammo from for almost 10 years now. I trust them very much.

www.aimsurplus.com <- Erik at Aim Surplus is the best guy in the business in my book.
www.amunitiontogo.com <- Great prices, friendly staff, and just up the road from me in Brenham, the home of Blue Bell ice cream.
www.ammoman.com <- I believe his name is Eric also. Wide assortment of surplus, as well as current-production American and foreign ammo.
www.wideners.com <- Not as wide of a selection as others, but good prices. Reloading supplies.
www.grafs.com/ <- Never ordered from them but they have a very good reputation. Lots of reloading supplies.

If you have a 01 or 03 federal firearms license, you can order from Century Arms. They are the biggest arms importer in the entire USA. They only sell to entities licensed by the BATF. I used to have an 03 collectors firearms license and would order directly from them. Century's policy on ammo shipping (a few years ago anyway) is $13 flat rate, irrespective of quantity. So you can order 3,000 rounds of .308 (195 pounds) and shipping is still only $13. That's a heckuva deal. Their self-assembled firearms are abominations but their ammo deals are incredible sometimes.
www.centuryarms.com

The US Civilian Marksmanship Program also sells good-quality surplus .30-06 for about $0.30 per round to use in M1 Garands and Remington 1903's. You need to jump through the hoops to get qualified with them, but it's not too hard. You can also buy an M1 Garand or .22 training rifle from them.
http://odcmp.com/


thanks for the links...are you in bellville?
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GeoJAP
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Joined: Feb 14, 2008
Posts: 295
Location: Texas

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:12 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

JJ wrote:

thanks for the links...are you in bellville?


I'm in Austin. Two hours away is still "just up the road" in Texas. Smile
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smallpoxgirl
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Joined: Nov 08, 2004
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:25 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

I don't think that metals prices are the driving force behind it. Copper prices have been fairly flat for about two years. Lead prices maxed out last fall and are currently in a pretty significant down trend.


_________________
"So while you sit and whistle Dixie with your money and your power.
I can hear the flowers a-growin in the rubble of the towers.
I hear leaders quit their lying
I hear babies quit their crying.
I hear soldiers quit their dying, one and all." - OCMS
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JJ
Heavy Crude
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Joined: Aug 07, 2007
Posts: 348

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:26 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

GeoJAP wrote:
JJ wrote:

thanks for the links...are you in bellville?


I'm in Austin. Two hours away is still "just up the road" in Texas. Smile


hear ya....my ex is in belleville why i asked... (grew up in Austin when we had the Armadillo, etc.)
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GeoJAP
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 3:44 pm    Post subject: Re: Will ammo prices keep skyrocketing? Add User to Ignore List Reply with quote

smallpoxgirl wrote:
I don't think that metals prices are the driving force behind it. Copper prices have been fairly flat for about two years. Lead prices maxed out last fall and are currently in a pretty significant down trend.


If I was to hazard a semi-educated guess, I'd have to say that the price increase is due to a combination of all the factors listed above: SW Asia conflicts, commodity prices, dollar devaluation, decreased surplus supply, and energy prices.

IIRC, 2004 was when a lot of different surplus ammo just started disappearing altogether off the market. $0.06/round Turkish 8mm surplus disappeared, and now costs $0.40/round if you can find it, $0.10/round .308 surplus is gone and costs $0.55/round if you can find it.

2006 was when a lot of prices on continuously available ammo started to noticeably increase. Winchester, Remington et al. cited "increased production costs". And it's still increasing.

The only ammo I can still afford to buy in bulk is the current-production ammo from eastern European countries. Barnaul, Silver Bear and Wolf from Russia is steel cased but functions just fine in my gas piston rifles. Privi Partizan is very high quality ammo from Serbia. It has a brass case so you can shoot it reliably in your ARs or nice bolt action rifles, and it's reloadable. I occasionally find some Lake City, Federal or Remington ammo on sale and snap it up, but that isn't too often.
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