Joined: May 24, 2004 Posts: 3429 Location: California, USA
Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 4:10 am Post subject: Re: Why Americans don't trust Cheney
The reasons I don't trust Cheney are really simple:
The war in Iraq was based largely on his doctrines and policies. Yet the Administration's conduct of the war has been fraught with utter abject military incompetence: from tweaking intel to fit policy, to underestimating required troop strength, to failing to plan for the post-maneuver phase, to inadequate supplies, serious intel leaks such as the Iran Crypto leak, and exercises in pure childish spite such as the Plame affair; that it is terribly clear that Cheney does not know what he is doing.
He may have good intentions for all I know, and I'll even give him the benefit of the doubt on that point. But he is like a drunk driver in denial, swerving all over the road and hitting the occasional pedestrian along the way. He's a danger to the nation, whether he knows it or not, and whether he likes it or not.
And the other reason I do not trust Cheney is that he seems all too willing to accede to depredations against fundamental liberties to a degree that practically accomplishes our enemies' goals for them!
And not only Cheney, but Bush also, and the rest of what Colin Powell calls the "neo-con cabal," or very often simply "the f---ing crazies." Their hubris exceeds their competence by an order of magnitude. They must go, or they must have their proverbial hands tied by Congress, the sooner the better.
Joined: Oct 12, 2004 Posts: 1647 Location: Davis, California
Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 6:30 am Post subject: Re: Why Americans don't trust Cheney
gg3 wrote:
The reasons I don't trust Cheney are really simple:
The war in Iraq was based largely on his doctrines and policies. Yet the Administration's conduct of the war has been fraught with utter abject military incompetence: from tweaking intel to fit policy, to underestimating required troop strength, to failing to plan for the post-maneuver phase, to inadequate supplies, serious intel leaks such as the Iran Crypto leak, and exercises in pure childish spite such as the Plame affair; that it is terribly clear that Cheney does not know what he is doing.
He may have good intentions for all I know, and I'll even give him the benefit of the doubt on that point. But he is like a drunk driver in denial, swerving all over the road and hitting the occasional pedestrian along the way. He's a danger to the nation, whether he knows it or not, and whether he likes it or not.
And the other reason I do not trust Cheney is that he seems all too willing to accede to depredations against fundamental liberties to a degree that practically accomplishes our enemies' goals for them!
And not only Cheney, but Bush also, and the rest of what Colin Powell calls the "neo-con cabal," or very often simply "the f---ing crazies." Their hubris exceeds their competence by an order of magnitude. They must go, or they must have their proverbial hands tied by Congress, the sooner the better.
Congress is in on the game. Their lack of balls demonstrates this. All politics in America is simply a farce, a sharade. _________________ Joseph Stalin "It is enough that the people know there was an election. The people who cast the votes decide nothing. The people who count the votes decide everything. "
Joined: Aug 11, 2005 Posts: 724 Location: Eastern NC
Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 7:52 am Post subject: Re: Why Americans don't trust Cheney
Cheney is my HERO! He shot a lawyer. He keeps the liberals pissed all the time, making them make hillarious statements as we have seen above, making their candidates unelectable.
Pick up a history book guys, anytime the US has been at war we've restricted liberties. The constitution allows such. Yet with all those restrictions we have never decended to a totalitarian state.
And that part about making us a reviled state, absolutely a bellylaugh! As more of the European countries have had to deal with the extremes of Islam, they have done much the same as the US. While we were kissing butt during the Clinton years and yes the early Bush years, our embassies were blown up, our ships attacked. Wow, isn't it great to be liked by all while they blow you up!
Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 8:10 am Post subject: Re: Why Americans don't trust Cheney
Fishman wrote:
Pick up a history book guys, anytime the US has been at war we've restricted liberties. The constitution allows such. Yet with all those restrictions we have never decended to a totalitarian state.
There's a first time for everything. Germany was never a totalitarian state until Hitler came round.
Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 9:42 am Post subject: Re: Why Americans don't trust Cheney
Pick up a history book and see that in every past war that the US and probably every nation has been in, that gov'ts raise taxes to pay for a war. They don't cut taxes for the wealthiest among us and cut every program that actually helps the rest of us. I would rather have decent roads and schools and health care for all, than have all my taxes spent on this stupid war, where it seems many millions have gone missing. This administration's ideas to keep America strong? "GO SHOPPING!!!" My God...our Victory Garden grandparents must be rolling over in their graves.
Posted: Tue Feb 21, 2006 9:46 am Post subject: Re: Why Americans don't trust Cheney
RonMN wrote:
Could it be that he loves his country so much that he's willing to sacrifice his final years in order to make his country a better place for his rich friends?
There, fixed that up for you. _________________ The whole of human history is a refutation by experiment of the concept of "moral world order". - Friedrich Nietzsche
Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 6:06 pm Post subject: Cheney
If you read the following interview with Cheney with PO in mind, it seems pretty clear to me that:
1) they invaded Iraq because they KNOW they are running out of oil - remember the energy meetings Cheney had in early 2001 where they used a map of Iraq to divvy up the oil.
2) Cheney doesn't give one rat's ass about what anyone thinks cause he knows he could drop dead at any moment. Which may make him one of the most dangerous people on the planet.
Quote:
MARY CHENEY SAYS HER FATHER SAID EXACTLY WHAT SHE WANTED TO HEAR WHEN SHE TOLD HIM SHE WAS GAY
Tue May 02 2006 15:29:37 ET
Vice president tells VANITY FAIR his image might be better if he spent more time trying to improve it, “but that’s not why I’m here”
New York, N.Y. – In her new memoir, NOW IT'S MY TURN(Simon & Schuster/Threshold Editions, 2006), Mary Cheney writes that when she told her parents she was gay, the first words out of her father’s mouth “were exactly the ones that I wanted to hear: ‘You’re my daughter, and I love you, and I just want you to be happy.’”
VANITY FAIR editor Todd Purdum reports that Mary Cheney tells her story in a voice very much like her father’s, and that she came out to her parents when she was a junior in high school, on a day when, after breaking up with her first girlfriend, she skipped school, ran a red light, and crashed the family car. Cheney writes that her mother hugged her, but then burst into tears, worried that she would face a life of pain and prejudice. When Purdum asks the vice president whether he thinks gay people are born that way, Cheney scrunches up his mouth, fixes him with a look that says “Nice try,” then says: “I’m not going to get into that. Those are deeply personal questions. You can ask.”
Mary Cheney tells Purdum that her father “has very little tolerance for bullshit, pardon my French.” She also says that one common reaction from people who have read the manuscript of her book is “‘Wow, you guys really have this close-knit, loving family,’ and it always strikes me as ‘Yeah, of course we do.’ It was very surprising to me that people would think we didn’t.” When Purdum asks Cheney if he is fatalistic about his heart disease, Cheney says, “I am. I don’t even think about it most of the time. You do those things a prudent man would do, and I live with it.” Asked what he would have for breakfast at Nora’s Fish Creek Inn, his favorite pre-fishing spot in Wilson, Wyoming, Cheney responds without missing a beat: “I’d probably have two eggs over easy, sausage and hash browns,” then hastens to add that that is not his normal breakfast. “The day I go fishing, I get off my diet,” he says.” At a roundtable lunch with reporters a couple of years ago, two who were present tell Purdum that Cheney cut his buffalo steak in bite-size pieces the moment it arrived, then proceeded to salt each side of each piece.
Cheney tells Purdum that he has not changed over the years, but perhaps many of his contemporaries think he has “because of my associations over the years, or because I came across as a reasonable guy, people have one view of me that was not necessarily an accurate reflection of my philosophy or my view of the world.”
Purdum asks Cheney if, during his “darkest night,” he has even “a little doubt” about the administration’s course. “No,” he tells Purdum. “I think we’ve done what needed to be done.” Of the debate over whether or not the administration hyped the pre-war intelligence, Cheney says, “In the end, you can argue about the quality of the intelligence and so forth, but ... I look at that whole spectrum of possibilities and options, and I think we did the right thing.”
Cheney rejects the caricature of him as the power behind the throne, insisting, “I think we have created a system that works for this president and for me, in terms of my ability to be able to contribute and participate in the process.” When Purdum says that the cartoon characterization of him must not be accurate, Cheney says, “My image might be better out there, this caricature you talk about might be avoided, if I spent more time as a public figure trying to improve my image, but that’s not why I’m here.”
Purdum reports that Cheney travels with a chemical-biological suit at all times. When he gave his friend Robin West and his twin children a ride to the White House a couple of years ago, West commented on the fact that Cheney’s motorcade varied its daily path. “And he said, ‘Yeah, we take different routes so that “The Jackal” can’t get me,’” West tells Purdum. “And then there was this big duffel bag\ in the middle of the backseat, and I said, ‘What’s that? It’s not very roomy in here.’ And [Cheney] said, ‘No, because it’s a chemical-biological suit,’ and he looked at it and said, ‘Robin, there’s only one. You lose.’”
Purdum talks with former New York Times reporter and former executive editor of The Philadelphia Inquirer, James Naughton, who asks of Cheney: “Does he acknowledge that he is not as pleasant as he used to be?” Naughton knew Cheney as a fellow prankster during the 1976 campaign, and all but sighs in search of an explanation as to why he is so different now. “I guess I would like to believe,” he says, “without any evidence to support it, that coming very close to death has somehow compelled him to act as though he only has so much breath and so much life, that he’s only got so much time to accomplish what he has to do. But the public figure is nothing like the private one that I remember.”
Gerald Ford tells Purdum: “He may have changed a bit, but that was required for the change of circumstances.” Ford, who will turn 93 in July, adds, “Times change, and people change as a result of that.”“If you’re looking for a change from one point to another, being vice president is sui generis,” Lynne Cheney tells Purdum. “It’s not quite like any other job.” The June issue of Vanity Fair hits newsstands in New York and L.A. on May 3 and nationally on May 9.
Posted: Tue May 02, 2006 10:14 pm Post subject: Re: Cheney
I'm not worried about Cheney. They keep him in a cryo-stasis chamber, only taking him out when lawyers need to be shot. :D _________________ The whole of human history is a refutation by experiment of the concept of "moral world order". - Friedrich Nietzsche
Dick Cheney is the most influential and powerful man ever to hold the office of vice president. This series examines Cheney's largely hidden and little-understood role in crafting policies for the War on Terror, the economy and the environment.
Quote:
Just past the Oval Office, in the private dining room overlooking the South Lawn, Vice President Cheney joined President Bush at a round parquet table they shared once a week. Cheney brought a four-page text, written in strict secrecy by his lawyer. He carried it back out with him after lunch.
In less than an hour, the document traversed a West Wing circuit that gave its words the power of command. It changed hands four times, according to witnesses, with emphatic instructions to bypass staff review. When it returned to the Oval Office, in a blue portfolio embossed with the presidential seal, Bush pulled a felt-tip pen from his pocket and signed without sitting down. Almost no one else had seen the text.
Cheney's proposal had become a military order from the commander in chief. Foreign terrorism suspects held by the United States were stripped of access to any court -- civilian or military, domestic or foreign. They could be confined indefinitely without charges and would be tried, if at all, in closed "military commissions."
"What the hell just happened?" Secretary of State Colin L. Powell demanded, a witness said, when CNN announced the order that evening, Nov. 13, 2001. National security adviser Condoleezza Rice, incensed, sent an aide to find out. Even witnesses to the Oval Office signing said they did not know the vice president had played any part.
Think of the number of books that are going to be written about Cheney once he's gone. Everybody's scared to death of him now, with just cause. Once he's out of the picture, though, people are going to start spilling their guts. _________________ "Thank you for attending the oil age. We're going to scrape what we can out of these tar pits in Alberta and then shut down the machines and turn out the lights. Goodnight." - seldom_seen
Joined: Sep 14, 2004 Posts: 6475 Location: Rural Virginia
Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2007 6:49 am Post subject: Re: Angler: The Cheney Vice Presidency
Cheney's role has been to serve as Bush's brain, which is demonstrably missing. Both are utterly heartless; the propaganda machinery supplies that. _________________ "Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog
"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother
Joined: Sep 14, 2004 Posts: 6475 Location: Rural Virginia
Posted: Mon Jun 25, 2007 7:21 am Post subject: Re: Angler: The Cheney Vice Presidency
SpringCreek, huge swaths of US government activity---and spending---are classified. In many cases, even most people in Congress don't know what's going on. The most enlightening book on this general subject is "The Sorrows of Empire: Militarism, Secrecy, and the End of the Republic," by Chalmers Johnson.
Ever hear of the US military base named "Camp Bondsteel"?
I keep pushing this book because it's one of the best I ever read. _________________ "Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog
"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother
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