We cannot drill our way out of this oil crisis. Since 2000, oil companies working in the U.S. have doubled the number of wells drilled per year.
Although increased drilling has added new oil to the nation's supply, it has not done so fast enough to offset the terminal decline of existing fields.
We are going to have to import more of our oil. Period.
Joined: Dec 27, 2004 Posts: 10760 Location: Village of Idiots
Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 5:25 pm Post subject: You Want it to Happen!
Here's the response I got on another board after posting about the Guardian PO article:
"I will give the Guardian credit for briefly giving the opposing view. As usual for them, they sensationalize what they want, and let the rest linger at the end of the article.
Meanwhile, folks like you wishing to live out their Mad Max fantasies are all a tingle in their naughty bits...(not that I don't have my own Tina-Turner-in-a-cage-inspired fantasies..."
Hw do you respond to people who say you "want it to happen" just because you believe PO is a fact?
Joined: Dec 04, 2004 Posts: 2313 Location: perpetual state of exhaustion
Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 5:46 pm Post subject:
I would respond that unlike some people I have a good grip of reality and know that Mad Max isn't actually realistic or possible. If all they can quote as a possible reality is a movie made fantasy shows they really don't have a good grip on either their own world or any possible one.
Yeah, its enough to make you cry or bang your head against the nearest solid object but it just shows they will reject out of hand instead of actually thinking through what things would be like.
Whether you want it to happen or not won't "make it happen". What you or anybody else "wants" is completely irrelevant. Either it will happen or it won't. Now, we all know PO will happen, basic geology tells us that. The real question of course is when and how.
So, fine.. if they don't want to believe just because you "want" it, then that's their prerogative. The best you can do against a situation like that is to link to relevent and factual articles, the less "mad max" the better (LATOC.net is not a good choice here, as great as that site is. Best let them stumble across that one themselves). Use quotes from the article, and when they get snotty, just ask them to provide factual data and analyses that show that your data is wrong. _________________ We've tried nothin' and we're all out of ideas.
I am only one. I can only do what one can do. But what one can do, I will do. -- John Seymour.
Yup, I know that feeling alright. There's only so many times you can be insulted and fobbed off by people who clearly know nothing of what they speak, and yet they mouth off as though they know everything. Point is, these are people you don't know... it really, REALLY is not worth letting them get you down in anyway. Best simply to say your bit, provide facts and links, and just laugh off anyone who tries to insult you. In a few years they're gonna be saying "Peak Oil? Sure I heard about that ages ago"... the jokes on them when they realise just how unprepared they really are.
Besides, what do you expect from the masses? They believe it when Bush says "everythings gonna be just fine". _________________ We've tried nothin' and we're all out of ideas.
I am only one. I can only do what one can do. But what one can do, I will do. -- John Seymour.
i have seen that allot of people here want a fast doomsday type crash to happen.
i personaly belive it's cause they can't stand their current lifestyle. they long for the so called simpler life but will be scared ****less if it comes true no matter how macho they apear on the board. _________________ Religion is excellent stuff for keeping the common people quiet.
'Napoleon Bonaparte'
Joined: Dec 04, 2004 Posts: 2313 Location: perpetual state of exhaustion
Posted: Thu Apr 21, 2005 7:37 pm Post subject:
See I disagree, I am sure there are things most of us hate about the current state of affairs and although there are many of us who fear the doomsday thing. I don't think so many of can be catagorized as doomers.
If that were true the planning forum would be empty because the consensus would be there is no point in planning since its the end anyway.
Yes, there seem to be a lot of "gun nuts" here but they too are working towards the future. They are just a wee mot more protective than the rest of us.
What's the difference between wanting it to happen and not wanting it to happen? Nothing, because wishes don't matter.
Everyone's a psychoanalyst. It's sickening. _________________ "By the time individuals discover that remaining resources will not be adequate for the next generation, the next generation has already been born. " David Price
Scientists (see Harrison Brown, James Bonner and John Weir in "The Next Hundred Years" published by Caltech in 1957) have been arguing for a gradual transition away from fossil fuels for half a century now. That is because we did NOT want an economic crash or population die off. Environmentalists started Earth Day 35 years ago with the same type of concerns. Even at this late date, we wish to mitigate the effects of declining oil production as much as possible.
Having said that, I must admit that I would prefer that the oil URR is 2T bbl rather than 4T bbl or more. Since the scientists and environmentalists have been ignored, a geological limitation on human oil burning is the only thing protecting this planet from a runaway greenhouse effect.
You could always adopt my approach. Nod, smile, and respond "You're absolutely right. I do. What's more, I expect to make a profit on the deal."
Then walk away, grinning.
NIIIIICE! I'd definitely like to adopt that if you don't mind, for the people I talk to with a capitalistic streak in them.
A similar one that I use already, for those with a little more empathy and intuition but who still don't believe me when I talk about PO... I just make a brief mention on the topic without any emotional investment, and then if they try to shrug it off, calmly say something like "Nevermind, you're apparently not ready for this yet. When you're ready and you have questions, I'll have answers for you, but until then you are not prepared to know these things and nothing I do or say will change that. I can only help you when you're ready to ask the right questions."
That throws people for a major loop, because suddenly they feel like they've been knocked back to a state of childhood naivete about something they've never been exposed to... and that often pisses them off sure, but it nonetheless piques their interest. Nobody likes feeling like they're being left out on something important.
Do I want global unrest, riots, etc? All of my life's work, dreams, hopes crushed???
Fark no.
But if it's gotta happen [and I do think it is probable], then bring it. Let's get this crap over with...while I'm still young, strong, motivated, prepared.
Joined: Sep 29, 2004 Posts: 2105 Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Posted: Fri Apr 22, 2005 9:46 am Post subject:
PO is a theory that states that we have found all the easy and cheap hydrocarbons and from now on hydrocarbon recovery will get more and more expensive. I don't get any cat calls when I explain PO that way because there is a lot of evidence to that effect.
The problem is that many on this site link PO to another theory; oil apocalypse. This is not a scientific theory because, like most apocalyptic ideas, it is based on static, unchanging conditions. It’s kind of like people of old wondering how they were going to stay warm when all the firewood was used up.
Without technology, we'd still be living in caves, etc. Technology has allowed humans to create conditions to increase population. We need technology more than ever when confronting PO.
Explain things that way and you'll look at worst like a pessimist. Go the apocalyptic route and you will be ridiculed as you should be.
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