Joined: Dec 27, 2004 Posts: 12015 Location: zombie horde wonderland
Posted: Wed Jun 11, 2008 6:47 pm Post subject: Re: [Water] General
joelcolorado wrote:
Any questions?
kk
Yes, what is the most affordable, a windmill or a solar pumping outfit? Which is the better value, in your opinion? What wind speed does one need to have a useful windmill pumping water? How deep a well will a windmill pump from?
Thanks. _________________ "...powerdown so soft and fluffy you'll think you're living in a pillow..." - jboogy
Posted: Thu Jun 12, 2008 8:43 pm Post subject: Re: [Water] General
Windmills will pump from a fairly deep source if set up correctly. Takes about 7 mph wind to run a windmill but if you get a bigger head on it, takes less;. I believe there are better types of windmills now like hellical and some that might pump air down the hole and water back up to you. Most low volume but will provide all the water for a lot of people as they pump steady. I have seen them pump over 20 gallons a minute from a shallow water source. Less from deeper. Easy to maintain. Grease them and check the screws and bolts periodically.
Posted: Fri Jun 13, 2008 1:17 pm Post subject: Re: [Water] General
Joel,
The problem with any kind of pump is that it will eventually require maintenance. And, unfortunately, none of them is immune from damage. My well is my ONLY source of water, so I want to maximize the odds of having water.
Which, in your opinion, is the most maintenance-free type of system?
Posted: Fri Jun 13, 2008 2:52 pm Post subject: Re: [Water] General
One of the new solar water pumps is the most maintenance free. Have extra solar panel, pump and wire available however in case of failure. These are small volume pumps only putting out 3 gallons a minute etc.
Joined: Oct 16, 2004 Posts: 1195 Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2008 7:19 am Post subject: Re: [Water] General
I'd prefer to trust rain water than underground, unless I lived near a heavily industrial area. And if you put your tank on a hill higher than the house, with a canopy to collect the water you would have gravity feed as well. No need for pumps. _________________ Kind regards, Katkinkate
"The ultimate goal of farming is not the growing of crops,
but the cultivation and perfection of human beings."
Masanobu Fukuoka
Posted: Sat Jun 14, 2008 9:46 am Post subject: Re: [Water] General
Rainwater is okay for use but filthy. You would need VERY good filter system and sized for your use depending on average rainfall. However, you leave yourself open to running out at some point. Better to use BOTH sources for safe and maximum efficiency. Rainwater is excellent for gardens etc. With a nuclear exhange, rainwater will become contaminated for human use also. Even a small weapon in the middle east will affect us here.
Joined: Jan 18, 2008 Posts: 70 Location: The Netherlands
Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2008 7:02 am Post subject: Re: [Water] General
I hope i place this post in the right topic...didn't want to make a new topic for it.
Cheap way to store water...Cola bottles
For a long time i'm collecting Cola bottles because when i return them to the supermarket i get 10 Euro cent back. I don't know if this is the case in all country's. Anyway it's an effective way to make sure those bottles are recycled. Last night i was thinking about other ways to use those bottles and i like to share the results of this thinking with you guys...
One standard size Cola bottle can hold 1.5 Litre of water. I currently have 120 bottles and that's good for 180 Litre of water total. Assuming i need a minimum of 3 Litre a day this is good for 2 months worth of water.
Another advantage of Cola bottles is size; you can store them virtually everywhere. Place a few bottles under your bed, a few in the wardrobe and a few under a desk. You can even tape them to the roof if you're really desperate for space.
As far as i know those bottles are not toxic, virtually indestructible and stay good for many many years.
What do you think?
Any ideas on how to seal the bottles?
Have fun!
Roach _________________ "The hardest thing in the world to understand is the income tax." ~ Albert Einstein
Posted: Mon Jun 23, 2008 9:16 am Post subject: Re: [Water] General
There is plenty of water out there.
As long as we irrigate
Golf courses
Parks
Football fields
Soccer fields
Baseball fields
lawns
wheat
milo
alfalfa
There is water out there. One pivot on 160 acres of farmland is allowed to use 90 million gallons of water a year by law. And there are probably 80,000 of them in Kansas alone. Golf courses can use 2 acre feet of water a year or up to 100 million gallons of water on a typical golf course. Las Vegas and other cities like that have over a HUNDRED golf courses EACH. Are we short of water? NO..
Just poor allocation.
Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 12:47 am Post subject: Re: How to keep stored water fresh/fresher?
I'll comment that I have had very good storage success by starting with the water from the "water stores" around here in Southern Calif. I am not talking little kiosks or filtering machines, these are stores with a commercial system that are quite sizable that can process a 1000 gals/hr.
These stores use city water, with reverse osmosis, double filtering through activated charcoal and ultraviolet sterilization. It measures on my water testers a few PPM of solids over distilled water. I pay 20 cents/gallon by prepaying $20 at a time. 25 cents is the cash and carry price.
I have bottles with water stored over two years, no chlorine added, that get some sun (whch usually starts algae growth). The water stays perfectly clear and fresh.
If you started with this water in a clean container and added a bit of chlorine, I imagine shelf life would be maximized. I have worked on some water treatment plants, and what comes out of your tap is the source of many contaminants and various plant and bacterial goodies to grow over time.
Without those stores, I'd filter tap water through one of the fine filter systems survivalists use to get the contaminants out as much as possible for water you want to store for years. If there is nothing in it, water itself never goes "bad". Its all been around for a billion years or so!
Posted: Mon Jul 14, 2008 1:35 am Post subject: Re: How to keep stored water fresh/fresher?
Water sits for thousands of years in aquifers without "going bad". Basically you just need to store it in clean closed containers in the dark. Avoid light because it may try to grow algae. Avoid any container that's going to leach out a bad taste. _________________ "I was born in a deep forest
I wish I could live here all my life
I am made from stones and roots
My home, these woods and roads
All my life I loved this sound
Of the woods all around
Eagles fly where the winds blow free" -Korpiklaani
Joined: Nov 25, 2006 Posts: 1373 Location: New York area
Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:57 am Post subject: Re: [Water] General
joelcolorado wrote:
PLEASE someone address the dangers of storing water in plastic bottles. I read that heat and cold makes the plastics come out in the water
Regular plastics are terrible. Polycarbonate plastic less so (I'd prefer glass but 5-gallon glass carboys are simply not practical). _________________ My PO Amazon store (shameless plug).
Joined: Sep 16, 2004 Posts: 4279 Location: Southwest WI
Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 12:25 pm Post subject: Re: [Water] General
Interesting article:
Quote:
The present study covered two rural communities of South Africa: Ncera and Ntselamanzi villages. Raw water from Ncera river is used by the community of Ncera village for drinking, while the community of Ntselamanzi receives their drinking water from Alice purification system. Treated water is supplied to the community by a public standpipe system. In rural communities of South Africa, many households use polyethylene (PE) and galvanized steel (GS) containers for the storage of their drinking water. To investigate the regrowth and survival of indicator microorganisms on the surface of household containers during the storage of drinking water, PE and GS slides were suspended in the appropriate household containers for a period of 48 h. This period of 48 h was chosen as the study period because results from the questionnaire indicated that the largest percentage (62%) of households store their water for that length of time. The experiment was performed to test drinking water as it is collected and stored by rural communities. No disinfection of household containers or slides was done during the study period. Attached coliphages (F-RNA (FP) and somatic phage (SP), coliform bacteria (total coliform (TC), presumptive Escherichia coli (EC), Salmonella (Sal) and Clostridium perfringens (CP) were measured during the study period. With the exception of CP, attached indicator microorganisms consisted of TC, presumptive E. coli and Salmonella, somatic and F-RNA coliphages, although the yield (average count) for the last four groups (EC: <1-3 cfu cm-2, Sal: <1-15 cfu cm -2, FP: < 1-7 pfu cm-2, SP: <1-7 pfu cm-2) was lower than that of TC (3-183 cfu cm-2). However, the lowest yield of indicator microorganisms was noted for presumptive E. coli. Whereas the occurrence and survival of TC was noted on the surface of household containers during the entire period of the experimental study, other indicator microorganisms occurred from time to time. The regrowth of indicator microorganisms occurred 48 h after the exposure of slides to both types of test waters. This length of time mostly resulted in the regrowth of TC (with an increase in bacterial counts) while the persistence of other indicator organism groups on the surface of the slides was apparent. A comparison between PE and GS containers showed that more TC (average count) regrew on PE than on GS containers (for river water, PE: from 36 to 55 cfu cm-2, GS: from 25 to 26 cfu cm-2; for standpipe water, PE: from 147 to 183 cfu cm-2, GS from 3 to 4 cfu cm-2). This study revealed that both types of household containers supported the growth and survival of indicator microorganisms due to the bad quality of the intake water before storage. The storage of drinking water for 48 h mainly resulted in the regrowth of TC. Nevertheless, the persistence of other indicator microorganisms was observed on the surface of household containers.
_________________ "Oil is going up because we use too much oil, and the capacity to replace reserves is dwindling"
-President Bush 11/07/07
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