China's Great Leap Forward into Africa - what do we do?

lorenzo · Fission Joined: Jan 01, 2005 Posts: 2092

We, sensitive Europeans and Americans, must urgently think of how we are going to deal with China's shopping spree in Africa. China's behaving like a real coloniser.

There are 500 000 Chinamen in Africa now, working feverishly on all kinds of development projects aimed at extracting the continent's vast resources.

The Chinese do all this without any regard for 'values' which we suposedly hold dear: human rights, transparency, anti-corruption, etc...

When you ask the Chinese about this, they will bluntly say: we have experienced bullying by the West, just like the Africans, for decades - so we don't have to take lessons from you.

Really, China's moving incredibly rapidly in Africa, not burdened by any sensitivities from the colonial or cold war past, as we do. They also take risks, and are not afraid to enter politically unstable regions (Congo, Southern Sudan, Liberia, Côte d'Ivroire, etc...), which we would never dare to invest in. They also use their political power to block action to prevent or stop genocides and wars (such as the one in Darfur - China signed petro-deals with the Khartoum government, and doesn't want action to be taken on Darfur, because it would threaten those deals).

In short, China's a new coloniser, and we should start thinking of how to deal with them on this subject.

One Belgian politician shocked quite a few people a while ago, when he said about this: "We must stop the Chinese from taking over the Congo. Because once they own they country, there won't be anything for us to take." Perverse pragmatism.

Anyway, what do we do?

Doly · Expert Joined: Dec 03, 2004 Posts: 4031

I suspect the international answer is going to be: nothing. Few people care about Africa, and it keeps China entertained.

waegari

Jack · Dark Lord Joined: Aug 11, 2004 Posts: 4970

Let's see now...

China has 1.3 billion smart, hard-working people.

China has nukes.

China has a strong (and growing) industrial infrastructure.

China is financially and economically strong. They are becoming militarily strong.

China has strong and growing nationalism.

And the West has...an aging population, a tendency to ship industry to China, and a habit of borrowing money to fund social programs.

So what will we do about Africa and China? Nothing. Nothing at all.

And if there is an insurgency in Africa, which China deals with, we will cluck our tongues and say tut, tut. We will continue to borrow Chinese money and buy cheap Chinese goods. We will do nothing.

Besides, China will probably sell us some of the oil on credit.

Don't worry, be happy! Cool

_________________
Dieoff. Fun to watch. Better with hot buttered popcorn! new_popcornsmiley

waegari

Jack · Dark Lord Joined: Aug 11, 2004 Posts: 4970

China faces a great challenge - if they do not maintain exponential growth, despite increased costs for energy and other raw materials, then they may have difficulty maintaining order. Even if they use extraordinary measures, avoiding insurrection may prove problematic.

But it would not be surprising for a government to use foreign adventures to divert the population from domestic troubles. And what better foreign adventure could there be than war in Africa?

I think we are going to get more interesting times.
_________________
Dieoff. Fun to watch. Better with hot buttered popcorn! new_popcornsmiley

emersonbiggins

backstop

Lorenzo -

In response to China's attempts to get its per capita fossil fuel emissions up to 1/14th of US per capita emissions,

there are a number of untouched options that the EU & US could apply if they had the intelligence and initiative to do so.

1/. Initiate the negotiation of a global "Treaty of the Atmospheric Commons" based, as the Africa Group has demanded,
on the climate policy framework of "Contraction & Convergence."

2/. Disavow, and formally apologize for, their conduct over the last 250 and 150 years repectively, and, in full and final recompemse,
implement the treaty de facto with regard to the annual purchase of Africa's surplus GHG emissions rights. (see www.gci.org.uk )

3/. In return for a proportion of those payments, pump into African societies the Sustainable energy technologies
[repeat 'Sustainable', NOT 'Renewable']
that Africans farmers & townspeople find most appropriate to their needs.

That would be a truly effective hearts & minds strategy.

It could provide Africa with sustainable energy self reliance perhaps within a decade, without incurring additional usurious debt,
and would also provide the huge benefit of ending the large proportion of its foreign currency earnings that now go to pay the fossil fuel import bills.

In other words it would go a long way to transforming Africa's prospects.

It would also greatly advance the funds going into Sustainable Energy R,D&D in the US & Europe.

China meanwhile, would be left to continue its diligent dead-end search for still greater fossil fuel dependence.

This might seem like playing a mean hardball with the Peking regime,
but it leaves them the option of starting to play for the common good whenever they choose to do so.
(Personally I doubt the Communist regime will endure the transition to the Sustainable any better than will the Corporatism in the West).

So just who should we be voting for to embody that requisite intelligence and initiative in foreign policy ?

We have such people here in Europe, but I gather US politicians still need some education in this context ?

regards,

Backstop
_________________
"The best of conservation . . . is written not with a pen but with an axe."
(from "A Sand County Almanac" by Aldo Leopold, 1948.

Jack · Dark Lord Joined: Aug 11, 2004 Posts: 4970

kochevnik · Intermediate Crude Joined: Aug 20, 2004 Posts: 881

The Chinese are above all, pragmatic people. What you call 'colonization' is what they call, "good business". And I don't see any Chinese traipsing all over the Dark Continent calling themselves the new lords of the 'inferior' dark race like the Europeans did for centuries.

They're just being brutally honest - they want the resources and they're clearly willing to pay top dollar to whoever controls them.

It's called CAPITALISM.

And Jack's the only one who got it completely right - 'We' aren't going to do a Goddamn thing other than sit back and watch the Chinese lock up every drop of oil they can, as fast as they can.

You snooze - you lose.

lorenzo · Fission Joined: Jan 01, 2005 Posts: 2092

kam30en · Heavy Crude Joined: Dec 17, 2005 Posts: 274

Just one problem for the Chinese, Africa doesn't have much oil. So sure, China can have the oil in Africa, but I bet they won't be getting oil from the ME.

rogerhb

cube · Fusion Joined: Mar 12, 2005 Posts: 3364

At least the Chinese are PAYING for these resources unlike what Europe did a couple hundred years ago. Rolling Eyes

Besides what do you guys expect China to do with its excess US currency reserves, let it sit and collect dust? Might as well spend it now while the US dollar still has value. And seeing that the US has effectively closed the window on selling US assests (remember Dubai port fiasco and the China Unocal fumble?) the message is clear.

The US dollar has no value in the USA. Rolling Eyes