The largest element in our budget of discretionary spending goes for national security. We are spending today more on national defense, so-called really on war, than all the other nations on earth combined. That’s an astonishing figure. Its also amazing to see that perhaps, 20,000 insurgents in Iraq have fought to a standstill 130,000 of the most-highly trained, heavily equipped troops on earth.
...
CHALMERS JOHNSON, AUTHOR: The third book is done and it’s called, ”Nemesis.” The subtitle is, ”The Last Days of the American Republic.” It’s to say I don’t see the wait out any longer. That the Congress – or that the separation of powers has clearly broken down; the President has achieved virtually anything he might’ve wanted to do in that area. I don’t think the political system will save us. The military could conceivably take over; they’ve threatened this but I don’t think so for reasons that I think are pretty obvious, above all, the fact that no enlisted – only enlisted men have been convicted in the prison torture scandals, none of the officers. The result is that within the armed forces today, enlisted men are extremely sensitive to illegal orders, saying, you’re going to take the rap for it, not us. There’s no more illegal order than to take over Congress, so the officers I just don’t think believe innocent men would follow their orders today, so my wife keeps saying to me, come up with something optimistic and I come up with bankruptcy. Its – that looks like it might be the thing that will bring the republic to an end.
LAMB: You know that there are people watching right now that say that guy’s a wacko. I mean that’s an extreme of it but it’s like the conspiracy theorists and all that …
JOHNSON: ... you and I were having this conversation in say, 1985 and I said to you, four years from now the Soviet Union will disappear. You’d have thought that’s not really a reliable analyst. Well, it’s gone. It’s disappeared. Its – Russia today is a much smaller place than the Soviet Union was. Empires go very, very rapidly and we’re getting extremely overextended; really very serious thin ice. It’s reported and this is not terribly novel with me, right now and a lot of people know this, understand it and are worried about the trend of event.
Joined: Sep 14, 2004 Posts: 6428 Location: Rural Virginia
Posted: Thu Jun 15, 2006 6:16 am Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
I read Johnson's earlier "The Sorrows of Empire"---it blew me away. Should be required reading for every American, liberal, conservative, and in-between. Johnsons describes how we are a military empire of 750 bases circling the globe, into which we pour our national treasure for very little positive return, or negative return, for the average citizen. Most of these activities are conducted in near-total secrecy. _________________ "Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog
"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother
Joined: Jan 03, 2005 Posts: 133 Location: South Carolina
Posted: Thu Jun 15, 2006 8:36 am Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
After watching that Interview I have to say I'm impressed. I'm certainly going to be purchasing Mr. Johnsons books in the near future. _________________ Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one.
- Albert Einstein
Posted: Thu Jun 15, 2006 11:01 am Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
"The Sorrows of Empire" and "Confessions of a Corporate Hit Man" are basically all you need to know about the shadow government, the military-industrial complex and the Bush regime ... err ... administration.
I'm with Chalmers. Be optimistic and hope for bankruptcy.
Posted: Thu Jun 15, 2006 2:14 pm Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
In his 2004 book, The Sorrows of Empire, Chalmers Johnson observes that America has started down the path “already taken by its erstwhile adversary in the cold war, the former Soviet Union.”
He describes how America’s refusal to dismantle its empire of military bases following the demise of the Soviet Union, combined with Bush’s misguided response to September 11, engendered blowback and made a decline of America virtually inevitable. Johnson offers these sobering words:
Quote:
The US still has a strong civil society that could, at least in theory, overcome the entrenched interests of the armed forces and the military-industrial complex. I fear, however, that the US has indeed crossed the Rubicon and that there is no way to restore Constitutional government short of a revolutionary rehabilitation of American democracy. Without root and branch reform, Nemesis awaits. She is the goddess of revenge, the punisher of pride and arrogance, and the United States is on course for a rendezvous with her.
From George Washington to Dwight Eisenhower, enlightened US leadership has repeatedly warned of the danger to democracy posed by the merging of the state and unlimited corporate power - most especially in the military arena. Failure to heed this wisdom will indeed ensure our rendezvous with Nemesis.
FYI: The title of his upcoming book to complete his triology of dire warnings appears prophetic: Nemesis
Last edited by Petrodollar on Fri Jun 16, 2006 8:29 am; edited 2 times in total
Joined: Sep 14, 2004 Posts: 6428 Location: Rural Virginia
Posted: Fri Jun 16, 2006 6:33 am Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
Of course, the same thing happened in ancient Rome, as the Republic was gradually squeezed out by a series of iron-fisted leaders (starting with Julius Caesar) who cited a perpetual state of "emergency" as their justification for not restoring the Republic and its democratic principles. The "emergency" was the result of military overextension and financial mismanagement, just as we have with the US today. Bush may one day be seen as our first emperor. I'm not sure the wounds he's inflicted can ever be healed. _________________ "Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog
"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 2:14 am Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
They've got to be kidding. The book is done, but it's not coming out until February 2007 (according to Amazon.com)? It might actually be behind the curve by then. I guess what I'm really saying is "I want it now!".
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 8:28 am Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
Anyone basing our collapse on the ability of 20,000 guerilla's to hold off a major national power is stupid.
We are fighting guerillas that look like every other civilian. No uniforms, no bases, no nothing but just like every other person you see over there.
You tell me how you kill all guerillas when they live and hide, and fight, from civilian centers of population. Do we just bomb the city and hope few innocents die?
No you have to pretty much wait for them to shoot at you and then hope they dont disappear to pop up again tomorrow.
Isreal has the same issues in lebonon today. Russia had the same issues in Afghanistan and Pakistan in the 80. USA had the same issues in the 60-70 in vietnam.
Guerilla war fare is slow, bogging down, inch by inch fighting. Not an indication 20,000 idiots are better then the highly trained and well equiped American Army.
I have never heard of this guy, but if hes basing our collapse around this war and the fact we cant beat 20,000 guerilla's, then hes an IDIOT.
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 9:43 am Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
Fergus,
The point is, that guerilla wars are very often lost by occupying army.
Look on Vietnam for example.
Regardless of total air & cities control and superior forces war was lost anyway.
Now look on Afganistan & Soviets.
They not only lost this war, but their conventional forces got backbone broken, precipitating faster collapse of Soviet Empire.
US fighting in Iraq is more and more following the infamous path of Soviets in Afganistan, and may easy lead to failure, if strategy is not changed on time.
You can already observe weak puppet government, collapse of law & order, you have many fanatic fractions fighting each other and yet all cooperating to fight US Army. This is very much the same, what Afganistan was about.
Even best trained soldiers who cannot distinguish between friend and foe on the battlefield are simply USELESS.
The best bet for US is to secure Iraq oil infrastructure (if there is still such a thing), drain as much oil as possible and get out.
Doing so US could still be seen as victorious.
All meddling with democratic Iraq and directly involving US troops into something, what essentially is a tribal warfare is bound to fail with many more bodybags coming home meantime.
May be Saddam should be "reinstalled" there? He is still alive...
Joined: Apr 03, 2004 Posts: 6501 Location: My Grandkids' Farm
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 10:55 am Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
Fergus wrote:
Isreal has the same issues in lebonon today. Russia had the same issues in Afghanistan and Pakistan in the 80. USA had the same issues in the 60-70 in vietnam.
Briton had the same problem with it’s colonies in the Americas in the 1700s.
As did Spain and Portugal and all the colonial powers in history – our's just looks a little different. _________________ Make a plan and work it:
Joined: Apr 27, 2005 Posts: 244 Location: new york city wacko
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 11:24 am Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
Fergus wrote:
Anyone basing our collapse on the ability of 20,000 guerilla's to hold off a major national power is stupid.
...
I have never heard of this guy, but if hes basing our collapse around this war and the fact we cant beat 20,000 guerilla's, then hes an IDIOT.
But it was the administration's desire to expand empire that got us into the virtually unwinnable guerilla war in Iraq in the first place. This is exactly what Chalmers is talking about. Just like the Romans, we're bogged down and overextended. _________________ "If you're always looking for the invisible hand to guide you, you will find that the invisible hand often gives you the invisible finger." - some guy on CNBC
Joined: Sep 06, 2004 Posts: 5315 Location: Smalltown New Zealand
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 2:35 pm Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
Fergus wrote:
No you have to pretty much wait for them to shoot at you and then hope they dont disappear to pop up again tomorrow.
You solve the problem politically, not militarily. _________________ "Complex problems have simple, easy to understand, wrong answers." - Henry Louis Mencken
Joined: Mar 04, 2006 Posts: 269 Location: La Crosse, Wisconsin
Posted: Wed Aug 02, 2006 8:00 pm Post subject: Re: Chalmers Johnson: ”The Last Days of the American Republi
EnergyUnlimited wrote:
Fergus,
The point is, that guerilla wars are very often lost by occupying army.
Look on Vietnam for example.
Regardless of total air & cities control and superior forces war was lost anyway.
Now look on Afganistan & Soviets.
They not only lost this war, but their conventional forces got backbone broken, precipitating faster collapse of Soviet Empire.
US fighting in Iraq is more and more following the infamous path of Soviets in Afganistan, and may easy lead to failure, if strategy is not changed on time.
You can already observe weak puppet government, collapse of law & order, you have many fanatic fractions fighting each other and yet all cooperating to fight US Army. This is very much the same, what Afganistan was about.
Even best trained soldiers who cannot distinguish between friend and foe on the battlefield are simply USELESS.
The best bet for US is to secure Iraq oil infrastructure (if there is still such a thing), drain as much oil as possible and get out.
Doing so US could still be seen as victorious.
All meddling with democratic Iraq and directly involving US troops into something, what essentially is a tribal warfare is bound to fail with many more bodybags coming home meantime.
May be Saddam should be "reinstalled" there? He is still alive...
I had read earlier today that one of the goals of Osama Bin Laden is to bankrupt the United States the same way they did with the Soviet Union in Afganistan. He said it is quite easy because the U.S. is so easily provoked. Just think what we could do in this countries with the billions of dollars being thrown away on that idiotic war in Iraq.
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