Joined: Jun 09, 2005 Posts: 581 Location: Australia
Posted: Wed Jun 22, 2005 10:45 pm Post subject:
All this talk of going from capitalism to cannibalism in a few days is bunk IMHO.
The weight of opinion seems to be that oil supply will decrease between 2-5% a year. This is what has happened to US oil production.
This will give us a whole generation to prepare a new civilisation which I have called "Solar Byzantine".
We will have to work very hard and accept a much, much lower standard of living and a bleak, dragooned existance for a while it is doable, if we keep our nerve.
Keeping our nerve is the most important thing.
The second is being willing to accept such things as rationing.
The third is to develop an interest in steam-trains and railways. Post PO will be a "puffernutter's paradise."
Joined: May 14, 2005 Posts: 2125 Location: Along the banks of the muddy Mississippi
Posted: Thu Jun 23, 2005 3:54 pm Post subject:
Macsporan wrote:
All this talk of going from capitalism to cannibalism in a few days is bunk IMHO.
Perhaps ... perhaps.
But can the Solar Byzantium really be a puffernutter's paradise when one is bleakly dragooned? _________________ “Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves.” (Ted Perry)
Joined: May 14, 2005 Posts: 2125 Location: Along the banks of the muddy Mississippi
Posted: Fri Jun 24, 2005 12:46 pm Post subject:
Macsporan wrote:
The 'dragooned' part should last only a generation while Byzantium is being built.
I would propose that any dragooning which lasts an entire generation sets up a societal mindset that will be very hard to break out of during the following generation.
Quote:
If you don't want to go all the way back to the Middle Ages its the obvious thing to do.
Middle Ages? There are many of us who want to go all the way back to the Paleolithic. _________________ “Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves.” (Ted Perry)
Joined: Feb 01, 2005 Posts: 197 Location: Southern Ontario
Posted: Sun Jun 26, 2005 4:37 am Post subject:
Peak oil is not something that we need to be scared of. American reaction to peak oil is something that should be given consideration. I would miss alot of things that this society provides, but I'm not scared to lose them. I hate television, people with ridiculous cars and car stereos, I hate Brittany Spears and her ilk, I hate talking to somebody at work about the car they just bought or the condo they moved into - not because I'm jealous - I could afford those things if I wanted to - but because it's all so meaningless.
I saw on CNN last night (uh-oh) a special presentation of some prepared news magazine with Aaron Brown. He was examining the threat of a nuclear terrorist attack on the U.S. One of the recurring images was of Arabic text used as a filler between location shots or archived footage. He looked at all the possible ways that America might be attacked - suitcase devise, smuggled dirty bomb - smuggled tactical bomb etc, and I couldn't help but wonder what the desired affect of this "special presentation" was. Was it to inform the public about the potential for attack? Was it to re-enforce the culture of fear that pervades America? Maybe he just wanted to entertain!
The thing that got me the most was the manner in which it was presented, and the dramatic flare that was added to the piece. I started to wonder what it might feel like to be an American watching this, and I realized that it would have been like watching a horror movie or riding a rollercoaster. I think the general American population enjoys fear.
Maybe she's right when she says in anger and frustration to me, "then what's the point of getting married, of having children, of planning a future together?"
Because, and as it should be: hope springs eternal.
Joined: May 14, 2005 Posts: 2125 Location: Along the banks of the muddy Mississippi
Posted: Mon Jun 27, 2005 3:21 pm Post subject:
smallpoxgirl wrote:
Montana wasn't such a bad place 200 years ago.
And then Meriwether, Bill and the boys showed up ... _________________ “Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves.” (Ted Perry)
Posted: Tue Jul 26, 2005 9:34 am Post subject: Re: Are you scared of peak oil.
jupiter422 wrote:
I am scared of peak oil .I mean not all the time ,but every once in awile i get scared I start thinking deeply about it and deep in my thoughts a fear arises. I think the fear is the unknown.I'm not scared to die I'm scared of peak oil though. I guess If you get the understanding that this is happening, like it or not and your mind wanders off into the reality before us,, it scary. you try to tell yourself your a surviver and you will pull through,but you just don't know. I live in southern cali. and i hate it i'm from michigan i grew up there in the country I had amish as nieghbors,we grew gardens ,raised farm animals ,fished ,and hunted.I was raised in a poor a-s family.So I know Ican tough thing sout ,but this sh*t is gonna effect the entire civilization. I'm not at all ashamed to admit that peak oil is scary,Good luck too all and too all good luck!!!!
Joined: Feb 23, 2005 Posts: 242 Location: Kingston, ON, Canada
Posted: Thu Jul 28, 2005 12:25 pm Post subject:
I am not scared of the fall of civilization. I sincerely believe it's not going to happen.
I'm heading into the alternative energy industry once I get out of school, so I should be fairly secure for a job. I want to work on hydrogen fuel cells and energy policy, both of which I believe will be important as petroleum becomes scarcer.
The only thing that does scare me is America. I'm Canadian, you see, and we are the USAs largest external source of oil. And we're obliged to keep selling it to them, even if it means Canadians go without, under NAFTA. And if we withdraw from NAFTA (all it requires is a six-month waiting period, no penalties or anything) then I'm scared of what our currently-friendly Southern neighbours might do.
Joined: Jul 26, 2005 Posts: 26 Location: Black Warrior
Posted: Fri Jul 29, 2005 1:02 pm Post subject:
Yea, I'm not scared to scale down my already modest lifestyle. I am scared of the reaction of my fellow sleepwalking Americans. I work with a lot of young people and I can tell you they don't have the first freakin' clue that the world they have gotten used to up until now might not be around much longer.
And I'm worried about the reaction of my government. I believe we wouldn't hesitate to go to war for oil and we are probably already seeing the start of it in Iraq. I don't think it's going to be pretty, whatever happens.
But for my part, all I can do is to keep learning, keep trying to tell people as much as I can, though that prospect is fraught with hazards, and try to maintain some sense of sanity. I'm reminded of that story about the lady who was cursed. It might even be a Biblical story. She knew what was going to happen in the future but no one would believe her. Scary.
Joined: Mar 22, 2005 Posts: 201 Location: Pocatello
Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 5:33 pm Post subject:
thequietkid10 wrote:
I'm not affaid of Peak Oil, if it means Great Depression Round II or we turn into a larger version of Cuba.
It's the prospect of watching everyone around me suffer and die because of the massive die off thing that bugs me.
I'm not so much affaid of my own mortallity if I can get as much out of my life as possible.
That's pretty much me to. When I told my immediate family about it, that is the immediate family for ME (Mother, Aunt and Uncle) they were receptive. I've always been looked at as eccentric in my family. But they listened and understood what I was saying, probably because I broke down about two minutes in. But point is they listened and understood. I didn't like having to slap down some of their statemtents. My mother seemed to have trouble grasping the enormity of the problem. "I'll just not gas up my car" she says." But I think I got to her. But the most touching thing happened a couple of days later when I was talking on the phone with my Uncle. He asked how things were going since we spoke (ironically, this was around easter). I said alright. (When I first spoke to them, I hadn't really slept in days and was seriously emotionally unstable I think) He said "Whatever happens, we'll stick together". That to me was a confirmation of sorts. He's an old fashioned guy and (I don't want to say simple...) down to earth. What I mean is, it would probably be difficult for a man of his small town upbrining to really get what I was saying. But that he didn't dismiss me as a looney or disregard what I said. That he says we'll stick togethe resoftened my heart. Because I believe him. This little segment of the family is extremely close. We've also got a few hardcore survivalists! (No surprise, we're in Idaho) so maybe that'll be a plus.
But what scares me? Seeing them perhaps suffer and knowing there's no way out of it. Feeling myself suffer and knowing there's no way out of it. I'm not afraid to die for myself (if that makes sense). But like I said in my very first post here, leaving my twin alone in this future world well...sucks. What scares me is the process. You've seen pictures of those extremely bony people in Africa, starving to death over the course of years. My problem (and maybe this is selfish) is seeing myself like that. Seeing my family like that. When it comes to the point that there's no going back, you will starve to death, is suicide justified? Like throwing the towel in when boxing, is admitting you can't win and ending the fight really that dishonorable?
Joined: Oct 16, 2004 Posts: 1195 Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posted: Sat Oct 22, 2005 8:55 pm Post subject: Re: Are you scared of peak oil.
agni wrote:
jupiter422 wrote:
I'm not at all ashamed to admit that peak oil is scary,Good luck too all and too all good luck!!!!
I'm not too scared of it. I have no car! I have no debts! I think I'll make it through nicely if with some hardship.
-A
I also have no car or debt, but I have my family is spread over the east coast of Australia. I have a baby niece (Bellamae) and a 8 year old nephew (Dylan), my Dad is getting old and my sister is chronically depressed with schizoid disorder. I'm not so afraid of peak oil happening soon, as much as worried how my family will survive, and how can I help them with few resources of my own. _________________ Kind regards, Katkinkate
"The ultimate goal of farming is not the growing of crops,
but the cultivation and perfection of human beings."
Masanobu Fukuoka
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