THE Native Americans Thread (merged)

Ludi

The neat thing is so many Native Americans could eat these things for thousands of years and barely deplete the populations. In Jacksonville, Florida, the highest point of land is an oyster shell midden created by the Timucuan who sat and ate oysters there for thousands of years. You look into the river from the midden and it is full of living oysters.
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MicroHydro · Light Sweet Crude Joined: Apr 10, 2005 Posts: 1286

Forget about culture, there is only one human species alive today, Homo sapiens genocidus-extinctionus. It is clear from genetic evidence that our species exterminated archaic europeans (neanderthals). While less well known, it is also clear from genetic studies of head lice and tapeworms, that our species encountered and exterminated archaic asians (aka Homo erectus, Java man, Peking man, and the 'hobbits') on the way to the americas.

Likewise, our species has been doing mass extinctions for at least 50,000 years. It happened in Australia, New Zealand (seen a Moa lately?), and the americas as well as eurasia. Fire and sharp sticks is all it takes to destroy an entire ecology. There are no innocent humans in our species. The less foolish ones (like some north american tribal cultures and modern Iceland), developed wisdom only after catastrophe.

"Gee, life is harder after we killed off all the mammoths, mastadons, camels, horses, and giant sloths, maybe we shouldn't exterminate all the buffalo"
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Ludi

Um, well, that's all still up for debate in anthropological/paleonotological circles, but we wouldn't want to admit that, would we?

Coulda been climate change, coulda been disease, coulda been humans.

No it's just so much easier to say "humans are just rotten through and through" instead of saying "humans can be really stupid, but some of them learn from their mistakes."

The question is, will WE learn from THEIR mistakes?
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rogerhb

Ludi

LOL! No, it isn't a silly question, unless you're claiming the various tribal peoples who figured out how not to deplete their ecosystems had some other kind of brain! (see examples given by Jared Diamond in "Collapse")

I know it's important for folks to cling to their myths, but the fact is, not all humans behave alike, although they often tend to behave like other similar animals.

You need to realise humans have not been the only animal to displace other animals to the point of extinction. I don't see anyone getting on the case of the big cats who migrated up from South America and displaced ALL of the giant predatory birds, leaving only a few small remnants possibly related (like the roadrunner and the caracara). I don't know why some people seem to expect humans to behave differently from all other animals. It's like there are two myths operating at once: "We're evil sinners" and "We're special, the pinacle of creation." Hmm, seems familiar, somehow....
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"...powerdown so soft and fluffy you'll think you're living in a pillow..." - jboogy

entropyfails · Moderator Joined: Jun 30, 2004 Posts: 605

Ludi

There's certainly evidence that "smart = sexy" and that humans have been selecting for various kinds of smartness since we started to become human. Such developments as language, art, and music may have first appeared as strategies for attracting females, and because human intelligence isn't sex-linked, females became smart as well, though typically in the past smart behaviors were exhibited more by males because of their chick-magnet properties.
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"...powerdown so soft and fluffy you'll think you're living in a pillow..." - jboogy

PenultimateManStanding

One of the most grievous and serious insults you can offer a Mexican is pinche naco. Naco means that someone looks indian, i.e. Aztec, or Central American Indian. Mexicans are proud of their European roots and despise indian genes and features. I had a young Mexican offer me an insult, in "fun" as it often goes in the restaraunt where I work and I'm used to it, but I thought he went too far, so I pulled out the big guns and used it on him. Sure enough, it had the effect I expected: he was very offended though he tried to hide it. Usually these words are fighting words, but in this case, he had to just bite his tongue and bury his resentment because I am a middle aged "gringo": far more "European" than him. We in America have come to renounce our racist views of the past. I think that racist views are the norm around much of the world. Mexicans have no scruples about their own racist views. They may use our own scruples against us, but they have no qualms about their own derogatory attitudes to native american genes and hold them in contempt.

pstarr

those are the pathetic, turned, denominated, clueless, self-hating mesoamericans who think their indigenous traits are unbecoming. The intelligent ones are proud of their Mayan heritage. Screw the others. Surprised

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venky · Intermediate Crude Joined: Mar 13, 2005 Posts: 800

I'll say this, most Americans are free of prejeduce at a personal level, atleast from what I have experienced living in this country.

I am appalled sometimes at the attitudes of some(not all) of my fellow Indians towards blacks, muslims, and foreigners at a very open and personal level.
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katkinkate

All races, at some basic level, see all other races as competitors, potential prey/predator, less than us and/or 'other'. Its an 'us and them' situation. It's just been 'fashionable' in western culture over the last few decades to deny this. The rest of the world haven't felt obligated to follow.
Also I think the definition of racism is viewed differently in different cultures. Generally it's when someone of one race views or acts toward another race negatively, however a lot of people seem to think it is only when whites (currently dominant) hate blacks/reds/yellows (those not dominant) ... and don't see their own racial hatreds as racism.
Anyway, that's how I see it. Racism is the default in all humans.
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"The ultimate goal of farming is not the growing of crops,
but the cultivation and perfection of human beings."
Masanobu Fukuoka

Zardoz

Racism Rears Its Ugly Head in Mexico

PenultimateManStanding

Keith_McClary

From The CIA World Factbook

PenultimateManStanding