Like the illusion of Wall Street, with its vast and powerful investment banks, now shuttered, China too is an illusion perpetuated by the Globalists that gave us the 15,000 mile Caesar salad, poisoned cat food and lead based paint on babies' pacifiers. Like the illusion that money would come from thin air to always push housing prices higher, China has spent a generation pursuing its illusion. Pursuing an unattainable dream to be like the West, while 6000 years of its carefully shepherded top soil blows into the sea.
Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 9:55 pm Post subject: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
I had anticipated this happening any day. The Cruising Companies tried to hold off a fuel surcharge as long as they could in the face of near $100 a barrel crude oil prices.
Carnival Corporation was the first to blink. They are adding on $5 per person per day effective February 2008.
The Carnival Corporation operates several cruise lines including Carnival, Cunard, Holland America and Princess.
The company plans to add 21 news ships in service by 2012. With fuel prices sky rocketing and traveling becoming more expensive, this may become a pipe dream.
If you are contemplating in taking a cruise, do so now!
Here are a couple of good sites to get good deals:
If you want to take only one cruise in life, take the 7 night Gulf of Alaska Cruise on Princess. This will be an unforgettable trip to paradise. You will experience the last holdouts of the majestic beauty of nature in its pristine state.
We are the luckiest generation to ever be alive. We take so much for granted - the fast cars, the convenience of cheap air travel, the floating 5 star hotels on these mega cruise ships, our climate controlled homes, air-conditioned shopping malls, abundant food and fancy high tech toys on the shelves, 24/7 electricity, clean drinking water, sprawling mega cities in the heart of the desert, entertainment of all forms on demand - all possible due to cheap energy.
Sadly, much of this is going to change. The next generation will listen to our stories and believe them to be fairy tales.
We should cherish and enjoy the best and last days of our Industrial Civilization. The travel industry will be one of the first casualties.
Joined: Sep 16, 2004 Posts: 4925 Location: Southwest WI
Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:10 pm Post subject: Re: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
My wife and I have done 2 seven day cruises. The one was from Miami down to San Juan and back (long) and the other was a southern Caribbean, which had a lot more stops. Those long cruises must be killing them. They've really got to be burning the fuel compared to the relatively short trips they take when they leave from San Juan.
I still love these ships.
The first time you stand next to one its just amazing. I bet the rich live in them and anchor them off the coasts---zombies don't swim well.
The new itinerary will be:
Miami-Thunder Horse
Thunder Horse-Lake Maracaibo
Lake Maracaibo-HOVENSA oil refinery, St. Croix
HOVENSA oil refinery, St. Croix-Thunder horse
Thunder Horse-Miami
??? _________________ Clothing should be optional.
Posted: Sun Nov 11, 2007 11:40 pm Post subject: Re: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
frankthetank wrote:
My wife and I have done 2 seven day cruises. The one was from Miami down to San Juan and back (long) and the other was a southern Caribbean, which had a lot more stops. Those long cruises must be killing them. They've really got to be burning the fuel compared to the relatively short trips they take when they leave from San Juan.
Cruise ships do burn a lot of fuel. These are more like giant floating 5 star hotels. I was on a 7 night cruise to the Mexican Riviera last week on Dawn Princess. This ship has a gross tonnage of 77,441 tons and can carry 2272 passengers plus 922 crew members.
I was curious about the fuel consumption.
The ship burns 1 gallon of fuel to traverse 90 feet.
So on a typical Mexican Riviera cruise from San Diego, California to Peurto Vallarta, Mexico and back, the ship travels 2,200 Nautical Miles and consumes 800 tons of fuel.
The fuel used is diesel oil or heavy fuel oil.
The fuel tanks have a holding capacity of 2662 tons, which makes it possible to cruise world wide.
The same amount of fuel will drive a family car 19.9 million miles at 36 miles per gallon. You could take 42 round trips to the moon!
The Dawn Princess has 4 diesel engines. Each consumes 1.7 tons of fuel per hour.
These cruise ships are floating monsters. You are right Frank. It seems baffling when you stand in front for the first time. How on earth is this supposed to move?
Joined: Apr 28, 2005 Posts: 3918 Location: West shore Lake Eire, MI, USA
Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 6:03 am Post subject: Re: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
Tapas wrote:
frankthetank wrote:
My wife and I have done 2 seven day cruises. The one was from Miami down to San Juan and back (long) and the other was a southern Caribbean, which had a lot more stops. Those long cruises must be killing them. They've really got to be burning the fuel compared to the relatively short trips they take when they leave from San Juan.
Cruise ships do burn a lot of fuel. These are more like giant floating 5 star hotels. I was on a 7 night cruise to the Mexican Riviera last week on Dawn Princess. This ship has a gross tonnage of 77,441 tons and can carry 2272 passengers plus 922 crew members.
I was curious about the fuel consumption.
The ship burns 1 gallon of fuel to traverse 90 feet.
So on a typical Mexican Riviera cruise from San Diego, California to Peurto Vallarta, Mexico and back, the ship travels 2,200 Nautical Miles and consumes 800 tons of fuel.
The fuel used is diesel oil or heavy fuel oil.
The fuel tanks have a holding capacity of 2662 tons, which makes it possible to cruise world wide.
The same amount of fuel will drive a family car 19.9 million miles at 36 miles per gallon. You could take 42 round trips to the moon!
The Dawn Princess has 4 diesel engines. Each consumes 1.7 tons of fuel per hour.
These cruise ships are floating monsters. You are right Frank. It seems baffling when you stand in front for the first time. How on earth is this supposed to move?
Tapas
For ships at sea fuel consumption goes up dramatically with velocity, any idea what her top speed and average speed are? Slowing from 27 knots to 17 would cut fuel consumption by about 50%, you cut a couple of stops off the tour and just go slower to save fuel. _________________ Always appeal to a man's enlightened self interest, you can trust him to look out for himself honestly, It's when you appeal to his Honor or the Common Good that he stops paying attention.
Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 10:00 am Post subject: Re: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
Tanada wrote:
For ships at sea fuel consumption goes up dramatically with velocity, any idea what her top speed and average speed are? Slowing from 27 knots to 17 would cut fuel consumption by about 50%, you cut a couple of stops off the tour and just go slower to save fuel.
Tanada, you are correct. Water and wind resistance goes up exponentially with velocity.
The Dawn Princess has a top speed of 22.5 knots. However, its cruising speed is a lot less, just enough to make it to the next port in time. The cruising speed rarely exceeds 21 knots.
If the Dawn Princess ran on only 2 of its 4 diesel engines and cruised at a slow speed of 14.8 knots, it could travel 11,600 Nautical Miles on a full tank of 2662 tons of diesel fuel.
I think I heard that these ships could travel about a mile before it comes to a stop if the engines are shut down at cruising speed. This is due to its enormous inertia.
Joined: Sep 16, 2004 Posts: 4925 Location: Southwest WI
Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 10:39 am Post subject: Re: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
All this talk makes me want to book a trip!!!
Sailing distance between Miami and San Juan must be about 1000 miles. I remember leaving Miami in the late afternoon, stopped at Nassau the next morning, left there early, sailed the rest of the day, the full next day and arrived the following morning in San Juan.
Both ships we were on were around that 80000 ton mark (NCL Sky and Princess Sea Princess).
A couple? of ships are actually powered by turbine.
Freedom of the seas is 160000 tons. A true monster. _________________ Clothing should be optional.
Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 10:39 am Post subject: Re: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
Yes, I am sure those cruisers use a lot less fuel when going slow. But no matter how slow, a cruising vacation is not a low-energy vacation.
And there are other environmental issues - what happens when all the people on board flush their toilets? Where does it go? Until I get firm information otherwise, I believe what I read just last year or so - these ships have very rudimentary sewage treatment or none at all.
Joined: Sep 16, 2004 Posts: 4925 Location: Southwest WI
Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 11:31 am Post subject: Re: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
It goes right into the ocean. I think they wait until they are out in the open when they dump everything. I guess it isn't horrible, considering are "waste" goes into the Mississippi River (treated) and a lot of towns up and down the river don't even treat their waste.
I watched a couple of slaves (i mean workers) painting something on one of the cruise ships when we were in St. Lucia and i noticed how they rinsed out their paint buckets right in the ocean!
You would think the food price increases would be hurting them? _________________ Clothing should be optional.
Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 12:30 pm Post subject: Re: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
frankthetank wrote:
All this talk makes me want to book a trip!!!
Frank, I just did that! With fuel prices skyrocketing, this is the last call to book a cheap cruise to your favorite destination. It seems every cruise line is increasing their base fare beginning 2008.
Right now, an extremely lucrative deal is being offered on Norwegian's Pride of Aloha. You can get on a 11 day cruise to Hawaii for just $599. I jumped on this Fast Deal being offered by Vacations To Go:
The inside cabins are being discounted 81% off the regular fare!
The ship sails from Honolulu on December 1st. I have never been to Hawaii. I figured this will be my last chance to see this wonderful place and visit the Fanning Islands.
Vacations in Hawaii turn out to be very expensive because of the high costs of hotels and food. It is far cheaper to take a cruise to Hawaii since all your meals are included in the fare and you get to stay in your ship inside your cabin at night. No need to worry about hauling your luggage from hotel to hotel.
frankthetank wrote:
Freedom of the seas is 160000 tons. A true monster.
I would love to sail on this ship.
Royal Caribbean has ordered the world's largest cruise ship at $1.24 billion. This ship will sail on 2009 and have a gross tonnage of 220,000. It will dwarf every cruise ship sailing today and have a maximum capacity of 6400 passengers.
Hope the Project Genesis does not meet the same fate as the AirBus A380.
These extraordinary centerpieces of our Industrial Age seems to bear a close parallel to the giant statues left half built on Easter Island when the last tree was felled.
It is interesting to see how desperate the travel agencies are getting to lure new customers. Prices have been discounted on last minute sailings up to 80% and still no takers. People simply do not have any more discretionary income to splurge on vacations.
The Housing Bubble Collapse has taken its toll on the economy. With no more easy HELOC money at hand, the market for Plasma TVs, Cruises, Vacation homes and flashy BMWs has dried up.
At the same time, the cruise lines and air lines are forced to add on a fuel surcharge.
This adds a double whammy.
2008 will be an interesting year for the Travel Industry.
Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 1:49 pm Post subject: Re: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
I do NOT think direct fuel costs will "sink" the cruising industry. (tongue in cheek grin)
Instead it will be people's disposable income that will become extinct, like the dodo bird, and that will ultimately kill the industry. The cruising industry thrives on the middle class and I think PO is going to hit the middle class the hardest.
Posted: Mon Nov 12, 2007 6:02 pm Post subject: Re: Cruising becomes more expensive - Fuel Surcharge
They better do something or it's bye-bye cruise ships.Makes no difference to me,i've never been on one and don't plan to go on one.If they go,then maybe the price of heating oil will drop,they use a lot of diesel and i think it's more important that people are warm vs. luxury cruises.Gimme some demand destruction!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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