whats with solar panels being popular?

peak · Tar Sands Joined: Aug 21, 2005 Posts: 79

if you been in the stock market lately, you'll notice some solar panel stocks have been having a huge run up - particularly Chinese ones.

The dirty secret is that it is 10 times cheaper to ship "e-waste" from the United States to China than to properly dispose of it in the United States. the e-waste ends up in communities - some of it can be used as recycled polysilicon.

for more info about this:
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/10/30/tech/main3430422.shtml?source=RSSattr=SciTech_3430422

what they are doing is sorting through this electronic junk to make solar panels. This keeps the inventory costs low increasing profit margins. Solar panels just cost to much to make and don't provide enough energy. When this scrap runs low - solar companies are going to have to use more pure polysilicon which costs FAR more. Obviously people here are overlooking that the production of cheap solar panels relies on a finite source of silicon scrap - some of which has piled in Chinese neighborhoods where citizens have taken a small amount of money to have electronic junk put on their state owned rented property.

the sun isn't out all the time, why do people have the idea that solar panels are the solution to peak oil when in my view is completely out of the equation? How many cars are out there that run on electricity and use the power from solar panels? Why do I hear people in the finance media say that rising oil prices mean rising solar stock prices?

solar panels on BIG SUV's / on houses with SUV's batteries and everything JUST FINE. at least the idea is not as pathetic as windmill SUV's. SUV's with a windmill ontop of them.

EDIT: I'd also like the mention that there is future growth and demand behind solar panels thanks to the European socialist.

Looks like thin film solar panels they are going to eventually overtake the older solar panel models since they are cheaper to make.

fiedag · Tar Sands Joined: Apr 20, 2006 Posts: 28

SolarDave · Heavy Crude Joined: May 19, 2005 Posts: 377

dooberheim

This computer's running on solar-charged batteries. I can do a lot of things from this computer that I used to have to drive to do. So it helps.

Solar panels are not the solution to peak oil. There's no one solution - oil is a unique gift. If we get organized (and stop having kids), we can make a transition in a reasonably orderly fashion. Is we just go on with the crisis-of-the-day mentality we have, we'll make the transition with death and destruction.

DK
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evilgenius

There is a rising tide of doomsayers against the solar solution. some say what peak is saying, others that necessary raw materials will run out, and some that thin film breaks down before it pays for itself. Is there any truth to these voices, or is it just nostalgic fear? I'm thinking of investing in solar myself, but have been worried that alternatives might be in a bubble. I don't want to get caught at the top when I could wait and buy more shares. Also, not every alt company is going to make it. Any ideas on the best bets to cross the finish line?
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Bas

I have a bunch of solarcompanies in my "favorites" plan to buy a variety of them once we had the stockmarket crashed and they become reasonably priced; I think it will be the premiere sector to profit from peak energy/global warming.

I have good hope on electric cars at least in the medium term, though a car will never run directly on solar, they can indirectly through the grid but it will be pretty pricey (at least for the forseeable future) so we'll still have to drive much less, use more public transportation, bicycles, go through a second big depression, maybe a die off of some sort and size and everything else that we're currently facing. (hey, I'm in a positive mood today Smile

)

WisJim

I've been investing in solar for over 25 years. First, we installed a wind generator to provide 95% of our electricity at a house we built, back in 1977. We added PVs to it as our power "needs" had increased. in the mid-1980s. I installed some of the earliest available modules using thin-film technology in the later 80s, and they were a flop. Still have the 2 Sovonics brand panels, but they are useless. The other PVs, the earliest ones that we purchased, are still working well, as is the wind generator, although we have moved the wind and PV systems, and the family, to a different location, and have added more PVs to the system.

Solar water heating, though, has a shorter payback and should have just as long a life as quality PV panels. Experts say that the warranties on PVs are generally for half of the minimum expected life span, but no one knows for sure how much longer they might keep working. There are PVs available that should keep working for 150 years.

I feel that almost every part of the country should require solar hot water technology to be used for heating at least part of the domestic hot water load. In many situations it can easily provide almost all of the domestic hot water and most of the heat for a reasonable home, if the house is built well and properly insulated. PVs are capable of provided a good portion of the electrictiy required, not the power "wanted", in the same home. I'm of the opinion that if government subsidies were removed from the entire energy business, that PVs and in some areas wind generated power, would be in the long run even more cost effective than they are now. The involvement of the government in subsidizing gas and oil and nuclear power makes figuring real costs too difficult for me.

peak · Tar Sands Joined: Aug 21, 2005 Posts: 79

I think the point is not getting across here-

Why use solar panels going to charge electric cars when coal or nuclear power can be used?

There is a reason why a lot of electricity is being produced by coal power plants and not solar power. The sun isn't out 24 hours a day and there are clouds in the sky.

Tyler_JC

peak · Tar Sands Joined: Aug 21, 2005 Posts: 79

Bas

the expectation of global warming measures may be a large factor as well as that we may see solar become cheaper than coal in the future.

smallpoxgirl · Moderator Joined: Nov 08, 2004 Posts: 5212

The EREOI for solar panels sucks, so I sure wouldn't look to them as any sort of peak oil solution.

They, like biofuels, are a feel-good, green wash, pseudo-solution. Liberals are willing to pay a lot of money to anyone that will help them pretend that their lifestyle is sustainable.
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I wish I could live here all my life
I am made from stones and roots
My home, these woods and roads

All my life I loved this sound
Of the woods all around
Eagles fly where the winds blow free" -Korpiklaani

Bas

Revi · Fusion Joined: Apr 25, 2005 Posts: 3112 Location: Maine

Say what you want about solar, smallpoxgirl. Right now, in November, our water is hot because of solar, we are listening to the radio, and the stored solar (wood) is keeping us warm. Feel good, you bet.

We are those "liberals" that you berate. We save over $2650 per year from the changes we've made in our household's energy consumption. Solar is a big part of it. We use half the fossil fuel we used to.

We're also working on a solar car that can make it's own motive power. Check out Nelson Cole's youtube movie.

www.sunnev.com

The reason that solar is going up? People are beginning to see the peak oil writing on the wall. Solar works. It's one of the very few things that does. A solar panel is like money in the bank, only the solar panel doesn't depreciate like the dollar has lately.
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smallpoxgirl · Moderator Joined: Nov 08, 2004 Posts: 5212