For a minute there I thought I had to get off my couch, when all the while the fact is we don't have to do anything much but keep things afloat for just a few decades more! In fact, we'd best shut up about PO, because if our offspring finds out we knew about it all along, they'll turn and wring our necks come 2036!
Should Uncle Sam Actively Seek Out & Deport Illegals?
Yes
78%
[ 63 ]
No
21%
[ 17 ]
Total Votes : 80
Author
Message
Bas Moderator
Joined: Mar 26, 2005 Posts: 3684 Location: over here
Posted: Mon Oct 08, 2007 10:26 am Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
Plantagenet wrote:
Republicans like illegal immigration because Mexicans are happy to work for low wages.
Democrats like illegal immigration because Hispanics are part of the democratic voting block.
The only people hurt by illegal immigration are poor and working class Americans who see their wages depressed and their jobs taken by Mexicans willing to work for lower wages.
perhaps they should crackdown harder on those employing illigal aliens; ultimately the root cause of illegal immigration is the fact that they CAN find work here. _________________ "The best thing about the future is that it comes only one day at a time."
Joined: Mar 26, 2005 Posts: 3684 Location: over here
Posted: Mon Oct 08, 2007 10:36 am Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
Ayoob wrote:
How do you hippies walk and chew gum at the same time? You honestly think we're on the verge of economic collapse and ecological overshoot and die-off, and you want to IMPORT MORE PEOPLE???
Dumbest f**king bunch of lunatics I've ever heard of.
You should want to GET RID OF AS MANY AS POSSIBLE, PEACEFULLY, before TSHTF.
nobody here said they wanted to import more people ayoob real tighter immigration laws etc and the enforcement of them will probably only happen when the political will is there, and that will only happen after TSHasHTF.
Also the people who talk about ethics here are not so big in the doomer area, though everyone at least believes our current system is unsustainable doesn't mean we should throw out all ethics and human decency....dumbf**k _________________ "The best thing about the future is that it comes only one day at a time."
Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 1:23 pm Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
Bas wrote:
Ayoob wrote:
How do you hippies walk and chew gum at the same time? You honestly think we're on the verge of economic collapse and ecological overshoot and die-off, and you want to IMPORT MORE PEOPLE???
Dumbest f**king bunch of lunatics I've ever heard of.
You should want to GET RID OF AS MANY AS POSSIBLE, PEACEFULLY, before TSHTF.
nobody here said they wanted to import more people ayoob real tighter immigration laws etc and the enforcement of them will probably only happen when the political will is there, and that will only happen after TSHasHTF.
Also the people who talk about ethics here are not so big in the doomer area, though everyone at least believes our current system is unsustainable doesn't mean we should throw out all ethics and human decency....dumbf**k
Take another look at the poll. 80% want deportation. That's what the people want. Any politician that wants to get elected can pick up the baton and run for the finish line.
After TSHTF, there won't be any politicians. It'll just be you and your shelf of beans, and a couple million people that moved in next door to you to have a better life (a share of your beans).
Do you really think that deporting illegal aliens is the end of all ethics and human decency?
You hippies.
Joined: Mar 26, 2005 Posts: 3684 Location: over here
Posted: Tue Oct 09, 2007 2:04 pm Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
that 80% is on this forum Ayoob, hardly representative of the general population. Also I dare say that 80% doesn't expect that society will fail overnight as you suggest in your reasoning; like I said, I expect prolonged economic hardship to produce the support for deportation measures that they don't have now. Not being a hippy, just being realistic. _________________ "The best thing about the future is that it comes only one day at a time."
President Bush made that plan the centerpiece of a re-energized enforcement effort against illegal immigration after the Senate rejected his proposed legislation to overhaul immigration laws this summer. But the ruling -- made at the behest of major American labor, business and farm organizations -- highlighted the chasm that the immigration fight has opened between the Republican Party and its traditional business allies.
The ruling also called attention to the gulf between Washington politicians' rhetoric about the need to curtail illegal immigration and the economic reality of many U.S. employers' reliance on illegal labor, as well as to the government's inability to find adequate tools for identifying illegal workers.
We can talk and debate our heads completely off, but the fact is that the immigrant workers, legal and otherwise, are needed too badly to be eliminated.
Deal with it. _________________ "Thank you for attending the oil age. We're going to scrape what we can out of these tar pits in Alberta and then shut down the machines and turn out the lights. Goodnight." - seldom_seen
Last edited by Zardoz on Wed Oct 10, 2007 10:20 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: Mar 26, 2005 Posts: 3684 Location: over here
Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 7:29 pm Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
Zardoz wrote:
We can talk and debate our heads completelly off, but the fact is that the immigrant workers, legal and otherwise, are needed too badly to be eliminated.
Deal with it.
Crack down on employers if you want to do something about it (I doubt that your subtle hint got through, Zardoz) _________________ "The best thing about the future is that it comes only one day at a time."
Posted: Wed Oct 10, 2007 7:46 pm Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
Ludi, I roll my eyes, grit my teeth and then I scream, followed by agitated dancing.
We have an interesting situation here in B.C. Canada. Instead of impoverished illegal immigrants, we have offshore money pouring in to real estate, brought in by legal immigrants, or by foreigners just seeking safe shelter for their money, mainly Chinese. Some of this money is legit, but I have a feeling a LOT of it is drug money or proceeds of organized crime, laundered through real estate. It gives me the creeps.
Posted: Thu Oct 11, 2007 1:15 pm Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
For common sense info on illegal/legal immigration numbersusa.com is a great website for info.
Since I am from the NYC area I see that there are just too many illegal/legal immigrants. 40% of people in the NYC area are foreign born and when you factor the illegals in that probably adds another 20%. We are not on the same page . What really shakes me up is the fact that so many are "amazed" that I was actually born here .
A lot are on social services of some type whether it be charity care or free college or whatever .(on tax dollars).
It is almost as if this government wants to "disappear" the American citizens that were born here and erase our history .
Joined: Jun 13, 2007 Posts: 3343 Location: Minniesotuh
Posted: Wed Oct 24, 2007 3:05 pm Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
Scores of illegal immigrants arrested near San Diego since Sunday
SAN DIEGO (CNN) -- Some 200 illegal immigrants trying to cross into the United States from Mexico east of San Diego have been arrested in the mountains as they come up against the flames and smoke of the raging wildfires there, a U.S Customs and Border Protection spokesman told CNN Wednesday.
Spokesman Matthew Johnson said those detained were basically giving up when they realized they were in danger as they approached San Miguel Mountain and the region where the Harris fire was scorching tens of thousands of acres.
Agents have made about 200 arrests since the fires began Sunday, Johnson said.
Two firefighters told CNN that several of the 24 injured in the Harris fire were what they called "international hikers," or illegals crossing the mountains. (Posted 10:51 a.m.)
Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 5:57 pm Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
I was deported on arrival to America the third time I went due to some problems with my work visa. At the time I was pissed, but as I was in Arizona I guess it was a lucky escape in hindsight. Seems being from a country that’s ‘shoulder to shoulder’ with the USA makes little difference. The FBI now has my finger prints, great!
It was kinda amusing, every immigration officer I had to deal with were of Mexican origin and spoke Spanish as their mother tongue. Of course these guys had every right to live and work in the states but it still amused me.
Posted: Sun Mar 23, 2008 6:14 pm Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
Regardless on where you stand on the idea of stopping illegal immigration, these raids are a farce. They're going to spend $10,000 rounding up some dude from McDonald's and shipping him to Mexico. Next week he'll pay a mule $300 to smuggle him back in. The only people that are benefiting at all are the mules, and the companies selling Rambo gear to ICE. _________________ "I was born in a deep forest
I wish I could live here all my life
I am made from stones and roots
My home, these woods and roads
All my life I loved this sound
Of the woods all around
Eagles fly where the winds blow free" -Korpiklaani
Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2008 4:46 pm Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
Kingcoal wrote:
As long as the "illegals" don't file for government bennies or do anything illegal, they have a right to come here to live and work. God knows this country needs lots of workers to do the jobs which are beneath us Natural Born residents.
My ancestors had no Social Security numbers, no Medicare/Medicaid, no free lunch whatsoever. They were completely unknown to the Federal government. Contrary to popular belief (and this belief appears to be strong among some moderators on this board based on posts of mine which have been deleted), you do not need a license to work and live in this country.
On the other hand, if you want to come here and commit crimes and/or get free crap from the government without first going through the process of Naturalization, you deserve to be arrested and deported.
Thought I'd play devil's advocate and vote against the majority which at this point is 79% for actively looking for illegal immigrants...
IMHO no one is looking at the big picture, which is to some degree the reason the USA has thrived in the past is because we have embraced immigration and free trade... But by looking to close down trade and immigration, the USA is very quickly being Balkanized! Therefore I feel it is important to have have some kind of program similar to the old Works Progress Administration (WPA) that builds up public infrastructure and public community.
So how about take an "undocumented economic refugee" and make them serve time in their own community to improve public infrastructure. For example here in southern california, for the past couple of years before the subprime mess put an end to the real estate boom, it seemed like most of the guys doing construction where mexicans. Chances are some of them were just "undocumented economic refugees" just trying to make a living, cause there were no economic opportunities in their home country. My pragmatic approach would be to draft these individuals who have some skills, and draft them to improve infrastructure in run down communites, by painting out graffiti, fixing up roads and side walks (all this stuff would improve property values), and I would make this kind of public service in addition to the other requirements of learning the language and american history a prerequisite for US citizenship.
If I were king, I'd even go further a public service draft program (similar to the old military draft).
The program would be run akin to the "peace corps" but for a short time period of something like 4 months so that it is not all much of an inconvenience or as disruptive as a 4 year tour in the military, but the time needs to be long enough to actually get some work done. The objective of the "public service draft" would be to improve the basic infrastructure of a country, which would be geared toward having long term economic and environmental benefits.
For example say a type "a" college bound student get their number called up who has been exposed to all the benefits of a wealth suburban lifestyle, such as all the college prep classes, soccer camp, connections to classmastes from higher social economic levels. What I think would be an eye opener for an individual such as this brought up in a pretty affluent life style would be to have this person tutor under-privileged elementary aged school kids. That way both groups gain some benefit and insight.
Another example, I think would be kind of a learning experence is take inner city youth who have never seen or experenced the great outdoors and give them an opportunity to learn a skill such as maintaining buildings in a national park. I think this would be a win/win situation, because youth never exposed to the out doors get a chance to gain working skills out doors and public park infrastructure is maintained, something like
For the most part people tend to stick to their own kind (weather its an economic or ethnic class) and have very little intereaction with dissimilar social or economic groups. A solid public infrastructure allows the enconomy to thrive, so I feel a public service draft would be a long term investment in the future of this country... _________________ "I'm 100% sure that unsustainable conspicuous consumption of natural basic resources will eventually lead to a proverbial hell on earth for those people who get stuck with the mismanagement mess of mankind not being stewards of the environment!"
Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 9:18 pm Post subject: Re: Uncle Sam says "No Sopa Para Usted" to illegal
dude
i dont like illegals more than the next person. But in there defense
you guys bought them here. im cuban so i can comment anyway i like on this. cause i got racial immunity almost. What gets me is that you white guys bought them here. to build your stupid houses and work here. You attracted them with work. And never did anything to stop this in the 1980's not even a thing. You guys who critisize this so much didnt do one thing to stop it.?
so millions came in.
nt only did i find it incredible that you guys ( anglo americans ) didnt do anything about it. What i find amazing. Is that now that its to late Is when you guys want them out of here.
I mean im not going to give you any talking points cause we are familiar with all of them.
But holly crap.
it makes me
think you guys want them out of here. Not cause you give a crap about your country. but becuase all the houses have been built All the food has been eaten. All the grass has been cut. All the children have been nanied. All the products have been sold. etc,.
it makes me think Or if i didnt know better. You want them out of here. Cause the economy slowed down. Or the houses are built. It makes me think that if the economy heated up again.
theyd be the greatest thing since slice bread. I mean they ( illegals ) where the greatest thing since slice bread. when the boom was on. Now theyre public enemy number one.
So what is it. You guys want them out of here. Becuase these jobs go to americans. Or you want them out of here because theres nothing left for them to do.?
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real tighter immigration laws etc and the enforcement of them will probably only happen when the political will is there, and that will only happen after TSHasHTF.
