Joined: Sep 14, 2004 Posts: 6426 Location: Rural Virginia
Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 8:20 pm Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
Now that I know more about the situation in Texas, I agree with you, Shanny, and most of the others that you should keep the Texas place. Having relatives who can keep an eye on it is a huge advantage that helps make that possible. Keep it---it's your fall-back.
I don't really like ideas like a property "swap" or a loan against the property to pay off the IRS. Too complicated and risky. Sounds like things are complicated enough for you as it is. I almost always prefer the simple, clean, straightforward approach (maybe because I'm simple-minded).
Since you have a bug-out property in Texas that can be held in stasis, there is really no urgent need for you to buy property in Oklahoma, is there? In my view this strengthens the case for renting a modest but liveable apartment in Norman near where you work, and focusing on this great new job of yours and strengthening your financial position. Get the IRS off your back and start accumulating a significant pod of money, at least partly in metal form. Once you've lived in OK for a couple of years you'll be in a better position to make a real-estate move there, both financially and knowledge-wise. Now is absolutely the wrong time to buy property there, since you're just getting your feet wet in the new job. It's too early to commit that deeply.
Be patient, Shanny. Don't act out of panic or pressure. You did the right, logical thing to accept the job. Now follow through in a stepwise, logical manner. _________________ "Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog
"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---Me and my brother
Last edited by Heineken on Tue Apr 08, 2008 8:25 pm; edited 1 time in total
Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 8:24 pm Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
Sorry about your dilemma, it's a bit of a doosy isn't it? I don't know what to tell you honestly. If you're keeping your home in Texas, and wanting another in Ok then what does it matter if you own or rent. Having the backup place is what is crucial imo. I own my place outright and I am still scared sh....less about the future. As for the markets, including housing, I think there is still bad news on the horizon. BTW you're lucky with the low taxes in TX; my property tax is 3k a year and that's for a 1600 sqf house!
Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 9:38 pm Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
Dear Shanny,
I extend best wishes to you and yours as you walk this new path. It must be hard to leave your son for several days after being home with him up until you took your dream job.
It would be nice for the family to stay together, so I echo the renting idea. Keep your OK life simple until you do some catching up.
I do know a bit about owing the IRS. Get that damn monkey off your back ASAP.
My now husband struggled with the IRS for about ten years. We hired a lawyer to do an Offer-in-Compromise (after husband's first attempt was denied) and they accepted a lump sum that totaled 1/4 the "owed" amount. The lawyer cost us about $1500. We used a credit line (secured only by our good credit) at 9% to pay for it.
And before anyone gets excited about him/us not paying our fair share of taxes, we most certainly did. Interest and penalties far exceeded what w/he (we were not married and it was his business and until last year he wouldn't let me help him with it) originally owed.
The amount he would have been taxed if he had understood what he should have done was much less than what the IRS received. Those dang penalties and interest are killer.
Break your decisions into small manageable bites. Take the advice offered here by all your wonderful PO buds into consideration as it makes sense to your family.
Big leap there, girlfriend.
In Admiration,
cynthia
Joined: Oct 04, 2004 Posts: 5389 Location: Oklahoma
Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:50 pm Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
Thanks again, all. I feel much better now that I've had all this input from my fellow peak oil aware folks, some of whom I've been corresponding with for years now, and some of whom I've met in person! Having had a few hours to think it through, and having read all your thoughts and suggestions, I feel a lot more comfortable with renting in OK and keeping the TX place as a backup and weekend retreat.
I am trying to get better at the patience thing. _________________ "Every junkie's like a setting sun..." - Neil Young
Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 10:58 pm Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
Shannymara wrote:
Thanks again, all. I feel much better now that I've had all this input from my fellow peak oil aware folks, some of whom I've been corresponding with for years now, and some of whom I've met in person! Having had a few hours to think it through, and having read all your thoughts and suggestions, I feel a lot more comfortable with renting in OK and keeping the TX place as a backup and weekend retreat.
Posted: Tue Apr 08, 2008 11:19 pm Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
I am always in favour of having a own property, for reasons like improvements etc.
I would try to do the following:
- Looking if there are decent jobs in the old place.
- Trying to find another lender and or a cheaper place.
- Renting a place and finding a weekender were you can garden, as it is without house it might be lots cheaper.
Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 6:55 am Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
Far be it from me to give anyone advice on this.
But, you have to say that if that farmer is having trouble selling his land to you, he is having trouble selling it to anybody. If you are a little patient (hard to do when you are living out of a suitcase) he will have to drop the price, and that might change the calculation.
Furthermore, I bet if you went in there and said "look Mr. Okie Farmer, we have pretty good credit, and we got rejected, because of all this credit stuff and we think you are going to have trouble selling this place. You would be better off to lease this place to us for a couple of years, then we do the deal when things get a lot better" he will jump on it. Negotiate a lease-purchase where at least some of what you pay him is applied to the selling price. He will probably be delighted to have a few hundred a month coming in.
The piece of information you don't know, and should ask to find out is, if you change some of the numbers, at what point will you qualify? Do you need more downpayment? Is the rate too high? Is the overall mortgage too high? Once you know that, maybe you can work with the farmer to get within that number.
You probably have some kind of slimy real estate person to deal with that will miss out on his commission, so he may resist the deal, but that's business. However, if you do, that could be a source of an additional 3% or so if he will kick in some of his commission to get the deal done. He is probably starving right now too and would rather have half a commission than the whole thing.
You have only been there a few weeks, probably just enough to get good and sleep deprived, and tired of driving back and forth, plus stressed from meeting new people and getting new job duties figured out, so your frame of mind is tired and cranky at this point, so I suggest you wait another week or two and get a little more used to the situation before you do anything.
The benefits of getting the job in the first place, namely a chance to get a little money built up, but more importantly, a chance to grow in your career, are pretty valid reasons for sticking it out awhile longer to see what develops. Sometimes getting out of your comfort zone is good because it will make you more adaptable later on. Plus I am sure you will be delighted to have the income and whatever benefits.
Also, the longer you are in a place, even living out of a suitcase, the more you have a chance to snoop around, after you get into a routine, so you will have a chance to explore the local area for another deal, which might be better.
As for the animals, I am sure they are members of the family to you, and you would no more get rid of them than you would your kids, but you gotta take a long look....If keeping the animals around is also keeping you away from your kids, maybe that choice is worth it. I think the mom-kid bond is the most important.
On the good side, if there is such a thing, you have some quiet time most nights, so get some fresh air. It is not for everybody, and also I understand that you are quite tall, so you might not fit into a bathtub particularly well, but a couple of nice long warm baths per week might get you to relax some. Quit worrying about armageddon, or oilmageddon. You don't know for sure what is going to happen.
The main thing is, keep a positive mental attitude, and look at this as a little adventure, that years from now, you will look back and laugh at.
Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 11:37 am Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
I'm just noticing your post with your problem. I would suggest that you rent if for no other reason than you can look around more before you buy in OK.
When it comes to real estate I've found that careful looking for a period of time is often rewarded with a place that you both like and can get a good deal on as well. In addition, this will allow you to settle into your new job and to make sure it is really the job for you.
As far as buying, sometimes you can get an owner to finance and cut out the bank. If you are looking for a seller who wants a stream of income maybe you can work a deal with one that suits both of you. Of course, after you talk things over get a lawyer to examine your agreement and then to write it up and handle the closing for you. If things are selling slowly you might find a seller who would be motivated to work with you on a deal.
Joined: Sep 19, 2007 Posts: 1311 Location: Land of the Tongva tribe
Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 11:41 am Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
If you do decide to sell you TX property then make sure you severe the mineral rights (if you own them).
joeltrout _________________ ENERGY is the basis of our industrial civilization and sustains our standard of living. It is the foundation stone of our national wealth. A nation starved of energy.....will be a nation of starving people.
Joined: May 18, 2006 Posts: 4329 Location: Minneapolis, MN
Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 11:50 am Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
K-I-S-S.
Quote:
The KISS principle (acronym for "Keep It Simple, Stupid") states that design simplicity should be a key goal and unnecessary complexity avoided. It serves as a useful principle in a wide array of disciplines, such as software development, animation, photography, engineering, and strategic planning. Common variants of the acronym include: "Keep It Sweet & Simple", and "Keep It Short & Simple". The form "Keep It Simple, Silly" is sometimes used in situations (for example, explaining the phrase to children) where "stupid" may be perceived as being too harsh.[citation needed]
Complexity should be avoided—simplicity is a goal in itself. Extra features are not needed; an approach that seems "too easy to be true" is in fact the best way. A very straightforward approach may seem less glamorous and less dramatic, but the trivial approach should indeed be taken. Surprisingly, the very obvious approach is often the best.
Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 6:02 pm Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
Each of our rural properties has been bough with owner financing. Banks generally don't like to loan on the kind of properties we like to buy, lots of bare land with an old house. Doesn't meet FHA standards, etc.
These days people may be happy to get an investment that pays 6-7 percent. Our first farm was done on a 10-year note, amortized over 30 years with the balance due at the end of 10. Lots of ways to structure it to make it more appealing to the seller, but if you're in farm country it's pretty common.
Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 9:55 pm Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
Heineken wrote:
Shannymara wrote:
2-3 years is a long time.
This could be an error in your thinking. I sense too much "panic"
going on in you, and that's never a good basis for a decision,
especially a major decision like this one.
I bet you could get a 2-BR apartment pretty cheap. One bedroom
for your husband's office, one bedroom for you and your husband,
and a cozy little cubby in the living room for your son.
I don't know what to say about the Texas property, then. What
was your original plan regarding it when you took the Oklahoma
job? The issue as I see it is that it dilutes your energy and funds
and makes it harder to make the OK option actually work.
I'm with Heineken on this, don't panic.
Rule 1: Don't panic
Rule 2: Look to history
You are maybe in:
* moving mode
* rush mode
* show everyone your stuff mode
* get it done mode
* ...
Don't Panic
Possibly you feel some panic too, who doesn't worry when so much
is changing! And knowing what we know, it hard not to have concern
about the immediate timing of things. But the trouble with feelings
of uncertainty is they can egg us on to make rash decisions.
Regarding the mortgage thing, they banks may have new residency
rules / employment rules. So sure, you may have to work and rent
for a year. And when you apply again, maybe you will be magically
eligible! I don't know the details, but I'm just saying what the
banker tells you the rules are and the rules that they actually are
following, they may not be the same. My experience anyway, is that
often things are not as absolute as some people say they are. A
realestate lawyer might be able to give some advice as might an
investments adviser. Plus hey, in a few years you might be able to
buy a place for the price of the scap copper in the pipes.
So maybe try to relax a little. You should know from my posts there
are always options and laughing is a good option too...
In the collapse of the soviet union, many people did pretty well
living in an apartment and visiting their vegetable garden a few
times a year in the country. Your garden would be far out, but your
current property holdings should give you a great deal of security.
It's true your land would be without livestock for a while, but you
still have a lot going for you. You could keep your Texas farm or not,
either way I think at this point you should do pretty well, as long as
you don't rush into trouble.
And finally speaking of history, think of all the trials and tribulations
that have gone on though out the history of the universe and how
small and meaningless our present troubles really are. So...
Posted: Wed Apr 09, 2008 10:02 pm Post subject: Re: Requesting your input...
Shannymara wrote:
Thanks again, all. I feel much better now that I've had all this input from my fellow peak oil aware folks, some of whom I've been corresponding with for years now, and some of whom I've met in person! Having had a few hours to think it through, and having read all your thoughts and suggestions, I feel a lot more comfortable with renting in OK and keeping the TX place as a backup and weekend retreat.
I am trying to get better at the patience thing.
Like reading though all the posts before posting, it ain't easy...
Forget Tumbleweed Tiny Homes if you are actually considering this. They cost too much.
Red Head Log Cabins would be a much better bet since there is a Bass Pro Shops in Oklahoma City which as you know is 20 miles North of Norman.
joeltrout _________________ ENERGY is the basis of our industrial civilization and sustains our standard of living. It is the foundation stone of our national wealth. A nation starved of energy.....will be a nation of starving people.
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