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buzzard
Heavy Crude
Joined: May 31, 2004
Posts: 105
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 Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 2:34 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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| davep wrote: | | patience wrote: | | I truly know little of this, but my daughter, who trains our dogs, is quite accomplished at it. Her results with animals are impressive, producing an animal who is very reliable and easy to live with, yet there is no real force involved of any kind. I'd suggest that if you get a dog, do the obedience training, and apply yourself to it. Very worthwhile. |
We got our Maremma in Italy (where they're from) and took her to obedience training. The first thing the professional dog trainer said was "Good luck, you'll need it". It didn't instil me with too much confidence for the training. He was right. Once the dog understood how to do something, she just wouldn't bother unless she felt like it.
We have since bought her a training collar, and use it sparingly. She's getting better as she gets older. These dogs can take up to two years to grow up, so you can be in for a rough time for quite a while.
On the other hand, my sister-in-law got a fully grown Anatolian sheepdog who was out of control. They employed a dog psychologist (hey, she has more money than sense) and they basically destroyed the dog's independence in order to control it. It responded eventually to the training (which involved a lot of physical reprimanding), but I don't think these dogs should be bought if you're going to try to bend them to your will. They would end up cutting a rather pathetic figure. |
I see that some of you have experience with the sometimes frustrating "independence" of the eastern guard dogs. My wife was always beside herself about Ursula's stubborn refusal to mind. I secretly always admired her confident fearlessness and unflappable focus on the mission.Early training is absolutely essential with these beasts (our large mistake).
dunewalker- "...limitation is numbers."
Hawkcreek- "Get a couple of old guys."
This brings up something which I have thought about often- The safety in numbers concept. When we bought this place I knew that I would not be able to do it alone. But I surged forward anyway with setting this place up trusting in the "if you build it they will come" axiom. Well, now that we're here I see how absolutely necessary it is to have help in so many ways. Large families have an edge on being able to build infrastructure and in day to day operations over individuals.
I find myself in a bit of a bind now that I have begun all of the projects which need doing. Alone I am quickly becoming overwhelmed by it all. Not one day goes by without me fantasizing about having a "boy" to help around the place. Someone like Cato, Robin or Tonto. Without anything else being done, my security would get a major boost if there were more bodies here. Perhaps like Charlie Chan's number one son. 
How to approach this problem of lack of bodies is definitely an important item on my security agenda. So far I have a trusted friend who upon sale of her house  plans to come out and add one more person to our company. Another friend is in that never land of confusion which makes her an unknown quantity. I have always included my brother, sister-in-law and my mother in any SHTF scenario. However, they don't know it.
Soon I must pull this problem out of the abstract and deposit it firmly into reality.
Being partially disabled only complicates things. The mind is willing but the body is weak. By the way, this is one reason why I have not hesitated to even the odds with help from what used to be referred to in the old west as a "Peacemaker". |
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Pops
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Joined: Apr 03, 2004
Posts: 6558
Location: My Grandkids' Farm
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| Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 7:00 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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| buzzard wrote: | | Being partially disabled only complicates things. |
I'm thinking then the best plan is not to try and go it alone, Buzz.
Town has the good and the bad but there are lots of folks between you and Them for the most part and certainly a smaller perimeter to protect.
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dunewalker
Intermediate Crude
Joined: Jun 30, 2005
Posts: 731
Location: northern California
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| Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 7:08 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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My vision of the collapse eventually has desperately hungry folks searching everywhere for a meal. ANY isolated homestead, like Buzzard's, or mine, will eventually be approached, and repeatedly. Think of the old cowboy movies, where the Indians picked off the lone settlers one at a time. Only this time around, no cavalry...
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Pops
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Joined: Apr 03, 2004
Posts: 6558
Location: My Grandkids' Farm
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| Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 7:45 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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| dunewalker wrote: | | Think of the old cowboy movies,... |
How many times did the White Eyes lose in the end?
Buck up or back down is about all I can think of....
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dunewalker
Intermediate Crude
Joined: Jun 30, 2005
Posts: 731
Location: northern California
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| Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 7:49 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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Pops wrote:
"How many times did the White Eyes lose in the end?"
Hayfork used to be a pretty nice place until the White Eyes took it over. Now, it looks as if they are finally going to "lose in the end".
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Pops
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Joined: Apr 03, 2004
Posts: 6558
Location: My Grandkids' Farm
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| Posted: Sun May 04, 2008 8:21 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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| dunewalker wrote: | | Hayfork used to be a pretty nice place until the White Eyes took it over. Now, it looks as if they are finally going to "lose in the end". |
Could be you're right, Dune. I have a hard time planning to go with an empty belly tho...
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PrairieMule
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Joined: Sep 02, 2005
Posts: 2971
Location: In a Nigerian compound surrounded by mighty dignataries
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 10:53 am Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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Lots of good ideas here.
I have to say no to the electric fence as well. At least the ones with blended polythene and metal wire. After 10 years of sunshine I can imagine the plastic degrading.
We get trespassers on our land. On occasion we will deposit a dead feral hog or steer near our front gate. The stink and the buzzards is a good deterant.
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skyemoor
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Joined: Oct 16, 2004
Posts: 1425
Location: Appalachian Foothills of Virginia
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 5:00 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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| buzzard wrote: |
I see that some of you have experience with the sometimes frustrating "independence" of the eastern guard dogs... Early training is absolutely essential with these beasts (our large mistake).
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The dogs mentioned are intended to be livestock guard dogs, which would actually have little interaction with humans, staying with the livestock and bonding with them. Getting them early and immersing them into the flock/herd is vitally important for a successful bond. Anatolian Shepherds tend to work best in pairs, where one will investigate, while the other stays with the livestock. If one wants a guard dog to obey people commands, then other breeds would be better.
We have an English Shepherd that can both herd and guard (a rare trait, which is one reason we chose this breed); the the latter job is primarily focused on 'watchdog' alerts, though if strays or coyotes come around, she would go after them.
http://www.skyemoorfarm.com
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Pops
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Joined: Apr 03, 2004
Posts: 6558
Location: My Grandkids' Farm
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| Posted: Mon May 05, 2008 7:14 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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| skyemoor wrote: | | The dogs mentioned are intended to be livestock guard dogs, which would actually have little interaction with humans, staying with the livestock and bonding with them. |
Hence the name of course, but we (mostly) all know not to talk bad about another's favorite dog...
Hang on, the response is coming and the thread topic might as well be changed to "Dogs" right now...
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buzzard
Heavy Crude
Joined: May 31, 2004
Posts: 105
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| Posted: Tue May 06, 2008 2:16 am Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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Not on your life, pops. If I want to think about dogs all I have to do is watch that tear jerker of an ad by the ASPCA a hundred more times. My wife walks out of the room when it comes on now.
Pops, I am allergic to towns. When I said that I couldn't do it alone, it didn't mean that I would move. Just that they will find my decaying bones holding a shovel in one hand and a hammer in the other. If I don't solve the problem of numbers then I will die in my attempt to do it alone. I know that I am doing the right thing. All that will happen is I might fail. But, then I might fail to wake up tomorrow too. I'm on borrowed time. Spend it in an apartment listening to the traffic go by? I think not.
And since this thread has degenerated into what they always do I have decided to just use my own ingenuity and creativity to construct my own security system. To hell with it. I was talking about real stuff here. When I get it set up I'll tell you guys all about it- not. |
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dunewalker
Intermediate Crude
Joined: Jun 30, 2005
Posts: 731
Location: northern California
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| Posted: Tue May 06, 2008 9:27 am Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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Buzzard, on today's (Tuesday, May 6th, 2008) SurvivalBlog by James Wesley Rawles is an article on homestead security--it's a pretty good overview.
http://www.survivalblog.com/
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"When men yield up the privilege of thinking, the last shadow of liberty quits the horizon."
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Pops
Moderator
Joined: Apr 03, 2004
Posts: 6558
Location: My Grandkids' Farm
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| Posted: Tue May 06, 2008 9:39 am Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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| PrairieMule wrote: | | I have to say no to the electric fence as well. |
Polywire is great for temporary grazing but no for long term - it will burn through just from shorting on a weed.
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WisJim
Expert
Joined: Jan 03, 2005
Posts: 1185
Location: western Wisconsin
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| Posted: Tue May 06, 2008 2:11 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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| I don't think that "security" lights that are on all night are a good idea, unless they are lighting up the only dark spot in a neighborhood, which is very unlikely in a rural or small town setting. Out in the country, we call them "burglar lights" as the purpose seems to be to light up your place so the burglars can find what they want without waking you up or hurting themselves. I prefer it dark, with some lights that I can control if I want some illumination in the night. |
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Ludi
NeoMaster
Joined: Dec 27, 2004
Posts: 12552
Location: zombie horde wonderland
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| Posted: Tue May 06, 2008 2:49 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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| WisJim wrote: | | we call them "burglar lights" as the purpose seems to be to light up your place so the burglars can find what they want without waking you up or hurting themselves. I prefer it dark, with some lights that I can control if I want some illumination in the night. |
Same here. You'd never know there was a place to burgle except for those darn "security lights."
We have no exterior illumination at night; we use flashlights. (We don't use the light over the front door because it disturbs the nesting Phoebes).
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buzzard
Heavy Crude
Joined: May 31, 2004
Posts: 105
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| Posted: Tue May 06, 2008 6:52 pm Post subject: Re: Homestead Security |
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| dunewalker wrote: | Buzzard, on today's (Tuesday, May 6th, 2008) SurvivalBlog by James Wesley Rawles is an article on homestead security--it's a pretty good overview.
http://www.survivalblog.com/ |
Thanks dunewalker, I have read the article. I am now in the process of going back through the archives on the SurvivalBlog to read further into it. I know that they have discussed that topic in depth. I also own Rawles book, "Patriots, Surviving the Coming Collapse." I have just finished reading it for the second time. That book and "Lights Out" seem to be the definitive works in that genre.
I am beginning with some basic simple things and plan to add depth of security when it seems feasible. |
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