Hoarding is exactly what the government is doing right now by filling the SPR, and frankly it's the best thing that could happen. It drives prices up. High prices encourage demand destruction. They also finance new well development. The hoarded oil gives us a buffer to fall back on once shortages become more prevalent. High prices are what we need in order to adapt to what's coming, and the sooner they happen, the better.
Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 11:29 am Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
Neocon swine John Bolton, thinks US will bomb Iran link
Fox host Martha McCallum asked, “Can you imagine a scenario where President Bush would do that before the end of his term?” Bolton responded, “I think so, definitely.” He added later, “This is entirely responsible on our part.” _________________ Stocking up on popcorn
Joined: Dec 08, 2004 Posts: 1496 Location: Nez Perce Nation
Posted: Fri May 09, 2008 12:23 pm Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
Iran is in the grip of a group of religious zealots who are ideologically inflexible and bent of dominance of the entire area and possibly beyond. It is their stated goal to eliminate Israel.
Of course there will be a confrontation. It is inevitable. If not the US then Israel will certainly destroy or cripple Iran's military. _________________ "Modern Agriculture is the use of land to convert petroleum into food."
-- Albert Bartlett
"It will be a dark time. But for those who survive, I suspect it will be rather exciting."
-- James Lovelock
Joined: Oct 15, 2004 Posts: 2018 Location: Arkansas
Posted: Sat May 10, 2008 6:45 pm Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
American Conservative Magazine reports that "war with Iran may be closer than you think."
Quote:
War With Iran Might Be Closer Than You Think
Posted on May 9th, 2008 by Philip Giraldi
There is considerable speculation and buzz in Washington today suggesting that the National Security Council has agreed in principle to proceed with plans to attack an Iranian al-Qods-run camp that is believed to be training Iraqi militants. The camp that will be targeted is one of several located near Tehran. Secretary of Defense Robert Gates was the only senior official urging delay in taking any offensive action. The decision to go ahead with plans to attack Iran is the direct result of concerns being expressed over the deteriorating situation in Lebanon, where Iranian ally Hezbollah appears to have gained the upper hand against government forces and might be able to dominate the fractious political situation. The White House contacted the Iranian government directly yesterday through a channel provided by the leadership of the Kurdish region in Iraq, which has traditionally had close ties to Tehran. The US demanded that Iran admit that it has been interfering in Iraq and also commit itself to taking steps to end the support of various militant groups. There was also a warning about interfering in Lebanon. The Iranian government reportedly responded quickly, restating its position that it would not discuss the matter until the US ceases its own meddling employing Iranian dissident groups. The perceived Iranian intransigence coupled with the Lebanese situation convinced the White House that some sort of unambiguous signal has to be sent to the Iranian leadership, presumably in the form of cruise missiles. It is to be presumed that the attack will be as “pinpoint” and limited as possible, intended to target only al-Qods and avoid civilian casualties. The decision to proceed with plans for an attack is not final. The President will still have to give the order to launch after all preparations are made.
Joined: Oct 15, 2004 Posts: 2018 Location: Arkansas
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 7:51 am Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
Iran using the oil weapon? Oil prices rose to their highest level ever yesterday after it was reported Iran may cut their production and further reports that Iran is holding some oil, not shipping it. News story here:
Iran has long threatened to play "the oil card" in its stand off with the West, but why play it now? One possibility is its in response to recent comments by U.S. Sec of Defense Gates and US Chairman of of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, Mullen, keeping all options on the table, but it seems more is going on here, and I can't put my finger on it.
"The Zionist (Israeli) regime is dying," said Ahmadinejad during a speech in northern Iran. "The criminals assume that by holding celebrations ... they can save the sinister Zionist regime from death and annihilation."
Ahmadinejad used an Arabic word, ismihlal, that can also be translated as destruction, death and collapse.
Quote:
"Nations of the region hate this criminal fabricated regime (Israel) and will uproot this fabricated regime if the smallest and shortest opportunity is given to them," Ahmadinejad said Wednesday in an address broadcast live on state television.
Then again, this report is repeating the "wiped off the map" translation which was wrong if I recall correctly.
Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 370 Location: The Canada of America
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 12:26 pm Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
RSB wrote:
"The Zionist (Israeli) regime is dying," said Ahmadinejad during a speech in northern Iran. "The criminals assume that by holding celebrations ... they can save the sinister Zionist regime from death and annihilation."
I don't speak Arabic, so I have no way of knowing what was actually said or how it was nuanced. But if this is anything like accurate, I can see where it's coming from. It looks to me as though he's talking about an Israel predicated on being a Jewish state. Think about it for a second. Aren't we always highly, highly critical of countries that establish themselves as Muslim states, even when they let Christians and Jews go about their business pretty much as they want? Why, then, is it okay to found a state on Judaism? It seems to me hypocritical to say it's wrong to found a state on one kind of theocracy but fine if it's another. Either we're for pluralism, or we're not. And if we're not, it's time to stop criticizing Muslim countries for doing this.
It seems to me that what's being said here is that Israel can't survive as a "Jewish" country; that it has to be the country of its Muslim people, too. The Palestinians, to put it bluntly. In all honesty, I can't see any way around that in the long term that doesn't involve either an Apartheid system (which, to a large extent, is already in place in Israel), or an outright holocaust of the Palestinian people. Israel can be a free democracy, or a 'Jewish' state. It can't be both.
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 12:39 pm Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
Nickel wrote:
Aren't we always highly, highly critical of countries that establish themselves as Muslim states, even when they let Christians and Jews go about their business pretty much as they want?
Most of them don't. After the creation of Israel, the Jews' lives were made so uncomfortable that they were pretty much forced to move to Israel. Those that stayed are pretty much treated like pariahs and do not enjoy nearly as many rights as Israeli arabs. Not only that, but palestinian refugess haven't exactly been welcomed with open arms by their muslim brothers, despite these countries using them as political pawns.
Nickel wrote:
Why, then, is it okay to found a state on Judaism?
It's a sanctuary state founded after the holocaust. Jews have been the ethnic scapegoat of humanity at least as far back as the time of Moses. The same is not true of Muslims.
Nickel wrote:
It seems to me that what's being said here is that Israel can't survive as a "Jewish" country; that it has to be the country of its Muslim people, too.
So the muslims, the same ones who voted in Hamas, can "vote" to send Jews back into the gas chamber or become humiliating "Dhimmis"? Democracy only works when you have a voting public that accepts basic human rights. Otherwise the majority will oppress the minority.
Last edited by mos6507 on Wed May 14, 2008 12:48 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: Jun 18, 2004 Posts: 687 Location: Western North Carolina
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 12:44 pm Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
Israel is doomed if you believe Peak Oil is real, and you understand the effects that a diminishing supply of cheap energy will have on the US.
Maybe Ahmedinijad is letting the cat out of the bag, in a roundabout way?
The day that Israel stops getting aid from the US is the beginning of the end for them. They have alienated their neighbors (revenge minded, honor killing, not afraid to die Muslims) to the point that real reconciliation would be very difficult if not impossible.
However, the veracity of Ahmedinijad's words aside, Iran is playing with fire here. The US and Israel are still militarily capable of inflicting great damage on the Iranian nation.
I hope our leaders here find the wisdom to learn to live with the "Iranian Threat" rather than using our military to solve the problem.
The consequences of a military first-strike against Iran would reverberate for years, and could finish off the US as a world power.
But what do I know? I'm just some arm chair strategist on the internet.
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 1:23 pm Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
Roy wrote:
Maybe Ahmedinijad is letting the cat out of the bag, in a roundabout way?
I don't know why so much effort is spent trying to figure out whether his speeches are being translated correctly, as if Ahmedinijad was really saying he wanted to sit down for tea with Olmert. It seems like almost every middle eastern country has regular group chants of "death to Israel". All these countries would love to annihilate Israel. They just don't have the opportunity. Iran would, if it had nukes.
Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 370 Location: The Canada of America
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 2:54 pm Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
mos6507 wrote:
After the creation of Israel, the Jews' lives were made so uncomfortable that they were pretty much forced to move to Israel.
I think "after the creation of Israel" is the operative phrase here. Most people tend to react to invasion and annexation in a, well, typically negative fashion.
mos6507 wrote:
It's a sanctuary state founded after the holocaust. Jews have been the ethnic scapegoat of humanity at least as far back as the time of Moses. The same is not true of Muslims.
How many states does the US plan to cede to the blacks for five centuries of slavery, then? Is one of them yours? Will you be picking up and moving without compensation happily, squatting on somebody's lawn in Sausalito and actually wondering why they're not pleased to see you there?
Regardless, why is the penalty for the Holocaust the burden of the Arabs, rather than the Germans? How about the Italians? The Diaspora was the doing of the Romans, after all. Why isn't, say, Lombard the new Israel?
mos6507 wrote:
So the muslims, the same ones who voted in Hamas, can "vote" to send Jews back into the gas chamber or become humiliating "Dhimmis"? Democracy only works when you have a voting public that accepts basic human rights. Otherwise the majority will oppress the minority.
As opposed to the Israelis, who've voted the Palestinians "Arabushim" and made it stick, you mean? But be that as it may... and is...
Supporting basic human rights would seem to require that the Palestinians had the same voting rights as Jews in Israel, and that their choices not be assumed and thus disqualified. Of course they voted for Hamas. After all, don't Israelis vote for parties that support their interests, like settlements beyond the pre-1967 borders, bulldozing the homes of Palestinians, herding them into new version of the Warsaw Ghetto where they can be refused work, medicine, water, communication with and transit to the outside world? Why I am, as a Westerner, being asked to support policies that were considered genocidal in WWII, just because they're now being perpetrated by people descended from the victims of those policies? Good Lord, Israel should be the last country on Earth to do things like these. The hypocrisy is stomach-churning.
Last edited by Nickel on Wed May 14, 2008 5:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 370 Location: The Canada of America
Posted: Wed May 14, 2008 3:06 pm Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
mos6507 wrote:
I don't know why so much effort is spent trying to figure out whether his speeches are being translated correctly
No, it's easier to just go on utterly misrepresenting them so that these people can be completely demonized, dehumanized, and eventually evaporated as their nation is turned to a sea of trinitite glass, isn't it, in a holocaust ten times the scale of the one Hitler took a decade to commit by conventional means.
Maybe we'd like to hear what the man actually said so we can judge for ourselves if eventually murdering 70 million Iranians (presumably to save 7 million Israelis) is justified.
Joined: Oct 15, 2004 Posts: 2018 Location: Arkansas
Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 8:08 am Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
Israel says it and the U.S. see need for "tangible" action on Iran, meaning, something in addition to diplomacy.
Quote:
Israel: US sees need for "tangible action" on Iran
Fri May 16, 2008 4:10pm IST
JERUSALEM (Reuters) - The United States and Israel agree on the need for "tangible action" to prevent Iran from developing nuclear weapons, Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert's spokesman said after a visit by U.S. President George W. Bush.
"We are on the same page. We both see the threat ... And we both understand that tangible action is required to prevent the Iranians from moving forward on a nuclear weapon," Olmert spokesman Mark Regev said on Friday.
Regev described diplomatic efforts so far to exert pressure on Iran as "positive", but added: "It is clearly not sufficient and it's clear that additional steps will have to be taken".
Asked about the option of using military force, Regev said: "Leaders of many countries have talked about many options being on the table and, of course, Israel agrees with that."
Bush ratcheted up his rhetoric toward Tehran in a speech to Israel's Knesset on Thursday, saying critics' calls for talks with Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad were comparable to the "appeasement" of Adolf Hitler before World War Two.
Bush vowed that Washington would stand with Israel in opposing Iran's nuclear ambitions, saying it would be "unforgivable" if Tehran were allowed to get the bomb.
Iran has said it will not stop uranium enrichment, which it says is for generating electricity only. In a separate development on Friday, the United States said it would sign an agreement with Saudi Arabia to help the kingdom develop peaceful nuclear energy.
Joined: Jun 26, 2007 Posts: 370 Location: The Canada of America
Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 8:26 am Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
seahorse wrote:
Bush ratcheted up his rhetoric toward Tehran in a speech to Israel's Knesset on Thursday, saying critics' calls for talks with Iranian President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad were comparable to the "appeasement" of Adolf Hitler before World War Two.
Wouldn't that require Iran to actually be invading other countries or something? Putting large sections of populations in prison and concentration camps?
Oh, yes, the world is definitely guilty of appeasing aggressors once again. But the beneficiary is hardly Iran. And I think we have to look a little closer to home to find the blithe, self-righteous Hitlers. _________________ I can has cheezburger?
Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 9:49 am Post subject: Re: Iran- Latest News
Its funny when facts are being reported, people always start making value judgments about what those reports mean. When I link a story saying what the current political situation is, I'm not doing that to justify anything, right or wrong. Its merely a report of what the current situation is, so that people like you and I can take appropriate action, whatever that is.
In the end, it doesn't matter what any of us posting here think, we are caught in the ebb and flow of the big macro picture. All I'm trying to determine, is which way the current is flowing and how fast. I cannot "will" the current to flow a different direction.
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
News
Discussions
Resources
Members
Forum FAQ
Search
Usergroups
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
