Klein/Brown's/HHO Gas

RMForbes · Tar Sands Joined: May 05, 2008 Posts: 55

Let's not be too hard on the naysayers. We need them to keep us grounded. It's easy to become too enthusiastic about the posiblities and overstate the successes and/or downplay the problems. We need them to help keep the forum honest so we all can profit from everyones true experiences.

mhuppertz · Coal Joined: Jun 28, 2008 Posts: 1

I think I am going to give it a try, since it's a cheap build. Who knows until you try it right? Hey, bumble bees cannot fly according to the math, and I'm willing to put a little work into it to see for myself.

JRP3 · Heavy Crude Joined: Oct 23, 2006 Posts: 396

bobtomato · Coal Joined: Jul 02, 2008 Posts: 5

JRP3...gnm... guys...

I spent the better half of today reading this post. Having great time. Wish everybody was here. Am I to believe that all this time you thought the ... ahem... "HHO Fanboys" were assuming that water might provide us with anything other than a catalyst?

Wow. To have the day back. I'd do something useful.

All the vitriol, name-calling and general middle-school behavior. Over an ridiculous misunderstanding, I think.

Tell you what: I have assemble two versions of the Smack. If you don't know what it is, google it. It seems to be of a very robust and sensible construction. Not glass Ball jars with a wire. I have installed one on my 95 Accord VTEC and begun testing. Last night I ran two carefully controlled tests, identical 100-mile loops, same driver, same gas stations, constant speeds, identical environmental conditions and traffic (I even tallied traffic lights). My results?

1. Marginal fuel economy improvement. from 31 mpg to 34 mpg. I used my version of the Smack, distilled water, Sodium Hydroxide at about 18-20 amps.

2. Dramatically enhanced driving experience. Less pedal, more pick-up, smoother acceleration. I have my master's in experimental Psychology. Don't even try to tell me about self-fulfilling prophecy.
You don't know me. Don't insult me.

My conclusions from test 1? my economy didn't decrease, as those who have suggested might happen if hydrogen "implodes" (!) My economy did increase, albeit only slightly, but please note: I have yet to do anything about my MAP, MAF, or O2 sensor inputs to my ECU. I believe that this adjustment will enable the catalyzing process to become more evident in my fuel economy in short order.

I know I'm far from the first to introduce this novel idea, but, in the beautiful, pear-shaped tones of the lovely and gracious Rodney King, "Can't we all just get along"? I'm kidding about lovely and gracious. And though he IS pear-shaped, his tones are not... But seriously! We really are here for the same reason, I think: To upset the balance of world power as best we can. To tell those "Holy War" terrorist bastards to keep their effing oil and for us to figure something out for ourselves. Eggheads, listen to those with the balls to at least TRY this. Balls-Boys, the eggheads are not stupid: just socially inept. Give then space and grace.

I will report as events unfold.

Peace out

mos6507 · Posted: Wed Jul 02, 2008 5:07 pm Post subject: Re: Klein/HHO Gas

mark · Posted: Thu Jul 03, 2008 8:10 am Post subject: Brown's gas?

Anyone have any experience with this.

Various sites say it can be used in conjunction with gasoline to increase mileage and performance.

I've no knowledge of automotive workings so I'm not qualified to judge. Hope someone on the board can enlighten me.

thanks
_________________
Who is John Galt?

RMForbes · Tar Sands Joined: May 05, 2008 Posts: 55

Bob,

My results have been slightly better than yours, but I was dealing with a bad injector or two. The HHO gas seemed to help reduce the effect of the problem. I will replace my injectors this weekend and I expect my results to actually go down to the levels you are experiencing. I am convinced that I need to add a EFIE device to get large savings in gas mileage. Zerofossilfuels has a simple design for one that I think I'll try.
My operating temperature is much lower with the unit operating. Does you temp gauge read much lower too?

Mark,

If you are not familar with the basic operation of your car, I would not recommend you try this. I have heard of people damaging their cars because they didn't understand how things worked. This is double true for vehicles with onboard engine control computers. If you still want to try, do some research about your vehicle and the designs and safety of the HHO units. Zerofossilfuels and Smacks have good information and they are not out to sell you anything.

bobtomato · Coal Joined: Jul 02, 2008 Posts: 5

Mark: I'll probably see you in Galt's Gulch by the end of the year... The way things are going. . .

bobtomato · Coal Joined: Jul 02, 2008 Posts: 5

RM.

I hadn't noticed any temperature change, but to be honest, I wasn't looking. What is your test car? Do you plan to fiddle with the 02, the MAP, or the MAF? On all of the above? How do you plan to monitor AFM? I would about kill for a forum or any resource that could help match up specific vehicles with the appropriate electrical mods.

And on a different note, what is your personal opinion as to why the naysayers are so doggoned... pissy!

bobtomato · Coal Joined: Jul 02, 2008 Posts: 5

M0S:

Excellent post... I retract: you DO know me.

JRP3 · Heavy Crude Joined: Oct 23, 2006 Posts: 396

bobtomato · Coal Joined: Jul 02, 2008 Posts: 5

JRP... That buggy is about as cool as grits!

Point noted and understood. I happen to agree. I'm interested simply in getting as much out of my camel juice as I possibly can. If a lot of people do it, and succeed, well, I just don't see where it can hurt.

racer88 · Coal Joined: Jun 06, 2008 Posts: 15

My new booster ( sorta like smacks ) seams to be giving me almost 27 mpg in town, 17 without booster, I tryed ox sensor spacer ( 18 mm spark anti fouler driled out to 1/2 in.) Did not work, I think this just puts computer in default mode which will run car in a richer than normal mode. Un pluging sensor will do same thing. I did try wraping outside of ox senser with several layers of aluminum foil, This seams to work ( don;t have a clue why) Highway milage seamed to not improve more than a couple mpg. Think I will some how half to electronicaly controle map or ox sensor to get more mpg on 84 vett. Today ( 4th of july ) I got to talk to my dads friend ( a retired nuclear phisisist ) He says a ice is only 24% efficent. & oxygen would be the catalist that makes this process work. Sorta like what the guy from Bulgarin said. My dads frind has a toyota pries & has learnd how to coast it on hy by holding gas pedal between power on and the point when you let off gas & car uses deaceleration to charge battery He gets 69 mpg at 55 on hy. WOW !

RMForbes · Tar Sands Joined: May 05, 2008 Posts: 55

Bob,

I have units on two vehicles now, '71 Chev Van with 5.7 liter (runs great but need to fix brakes before road testing) and '93 Lexus ES300 with 3.0 liter ODBI controled. I am going to add the O2 adjuster that is detailed on Zerofossilfuels site. I built all my radio equipment when I was a Ham radio operator (wow, forty years ago --- getting old) so I think I can handle this simple little curcuit. I am using a variable reduced vacuum from the intake manifold to control the HHO distribution to the engine. When at idle the gas is injected directly into the intake thru the vacuum port. I added a valve to be able to reduce the vacuum to about the max output of the electrolysis unit, so not to lower the boiling point of the electrolyte too much. When at highway speed the vacuum drops to zero and the gas is then injected to the air intake just in front of butterfly valves. Both feed lines have a one way check valve to prevent backfire and to route gas to the highest vacuum source closing off the low side. I have not seen a need to mess with the MAP sensor or the MAF sensor, except to make sure that the gas is injected after the Mass air flow sensor because it uses a heated wire and may ignite the gas if it comes into contact with it.