Like the illusion of Wall Street, with its vast and powerful investment banks, now shuttered, China too is an illusion perpetuated by the Globalists that gave us the 15,000 mile Caesar salad, poisoned cat food and lead based paint on babies' pacifiers. Like the illusion that money would come from thin air to always push housing prices higher, China has spent a generation pursuing its illusion. Pursuing an unattainable dream to be like the West, while 6000 years of its carefully shepherded top soil blows into the sea.
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 5:46 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
Tyler_JC wrote:
Did anyone look at the source of this editorial?
The Daily Telegraph.
AKA, the Torygraph.
AKA, The Fox New of the United Kingdom.
The Telegraph is the conservative publication of record in one of the most euroskeptical country in all of Europe.
Would it surprise anyone that this publication would have a bias against the Europe Union?
Quite right! I'd like someone to provide me with an example of The Telegraph (or the Daily Mail for that matter) ever having come out in support of the European Union.
zoidberg wrote:
The EU is indeed a direct descendant from Hitler's vision of the Third Reich.
I've also read that the EU is (i) a Jewish conspiracy (ii) socialist and (iii) a plot of greedy global financiers. Sounds like it is all things to all men.
Let's ratify the Lisbon Treaty soon. There's a long list of urgent items waiting, including working towards sustainable supplies of food and energy.
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 7:13 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
I'm one of those UK 'Euroskeptics', aren't we a nasty bunch of fascists for wanting to govern our own country.
Honestly some of the idiots on here don't even know the definitions of the terms they throw around.
Oh yer and nice avoidance of the issue by focusing on the newspaper. _________________ "One minute I held the key, next the walls were closed on me, and I discovered that my castle stands upon pillars of salt and pillars of sand."
Joined: Sep 24, 2007 Posts: 2584 Location: third from the sun
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 7:15 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
Battle_Scarred_Galactico wrote:
Honestly some of the idiots on here don't even know the definitions of the terms they throw around.
Oh yer and nice avoidance of the issue by focusing on the newspaper.
Yeah man. We are all making such an effort to avoid pointing out the personal issues of people like americandream. The UK right wing is in such huge danger of losing some of their privileges because of the EU. No wonder that they spead nationalistic and chauvinistic FUD while completing the transformation of the UK into a panopticon society.
Did you have your DNA fingerprint taken already ? Are you happy being watched everywhere you go at day and night ? Enjoy your safety and security.
_________________ only the paranoid survive
Last edited by btu2012 on Tue Jun 24, 2008 7:32 am; edited 1 time in total
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 7:29 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
You're slightly out of touch, our current Labour government is busy giving away power to the EU, catch up.
And we're such a police state the government recently released a know acciosciate of OBL, thanks to you guessed it, European law.
You seem to have no idea of what is going on here, totally clueless. _________________ "One minute I held the key, next the walls were closed on me, and I discovered that my castle stands upon pillars of salt and pillars of sand."
Joined: Feb 23, 2005 Posts: 513 Location: Winnipeg
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 8:08 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
btu2012 wrote:
zoidberg wrote:
As I've understood the EU is the answer to the old problem, of what do with Germany in the center of Europe.
The EU isn't a German creation. In many ways France has had and has more influence on the EU's construction than Germany. The EU is an answer to the problem of avoiding yet another world war (Europe started two of those if you recall). Given the role played by Germany in WWII, that is hardly a pro-German creation.
Nothing you've said here is technically false. But I would argue its exactly because of Germany's role in WWII that its a German-centric creation. (I dont think I said pro-German). I did say its a descendent of Third Reich policies, but thats because its a union with Germany as the biggest player and involved in all central decisions, and playing a large role in its financial policies as well. I dont mean its a vehicle for German domination but a vehicle to let Germany rise to its natural place in Europe without threatening its neighbours. I dont think they have a influence or power above what their economic strength would indicate, where as if it was a Third Reich type entity they would. I guess its hard to make subtle distinctions when you start throwing in Nazi references. I'll stop that .
I would even argue that as long as power isnt centralized and democracy removed even farther from the people in a Federal union that this is where it'll stay. You start giving more power to fewer people and they're bound to take advantage of it, at least the type of people who seek power will. Those wouldn't take advantage of it wouldn't be as strongly inclined to seize power.
Joined: Sep 24, 2007 Posts: 2584 Location: third from the sun
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 8:13 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
Sure, the EU seeks to integrate Germany peacefully -- and that makes eminent sense. It also functions as defense against nationalism and revanchism, which makes even more sense.
The Lisbon treaty actually devolves some power away from the European Comission to the European parliament. It's meant to make the EU more democratic and not less. _________________ only the paranoid survive
Joined: Feb 23, 2005 Posts: 513 Location: Winnipeg
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 8:19 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
btu2012 wrote:
Sure, the EU seeks to integrate Germany peacefully -- and that makes eminent sense. It also functions as defense against nationalism and revanchism, which makes even more sense.
The Lisbon treaty actually devolves some power away from the European Comission to the European parliament. It's meant to make the EU more democratic and not less.
Well then I guess we agree. Maybe when I have some free time I'll take a look at the Lisbon treaty(or the coles notes version). I could be wrong about it I suppose, I honestly didnt read it, just picking up vibes from news headlines.
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 8:51 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
All those measures, CCTV etc. that you like to put up pictures of btu, have been brought in by the current labour government, the worst ever, who are PRO Europe.
You don't seem to get this, which country do you live in btu ? _________________ "One minute I held the key, next the walls were closed on me, and I discovered that my castle stands upon pillars of salt and pillars of sand."
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 9:02 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
It is you who needs to get a grip, anything you seem to dislike just gets blamed on 'right-wingers', no matter who is in power. _________________ "One minute I held the key, next the walls were closed on me, and I discovered that my castle stands upon pillars of salt and pillars of sand."
Joined: Sep 25, 2004 Posts: 4722 Location: Boston, MA
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 10:05 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
Btu, if I'm ever in your area, I need to buy you a beer. A GERMAN beer.
As for americandream and company:
The amount of irrational paranoia with regards to Germany is incredible.
Germany has paid for an enourmously large share of the EU's programs and continues to overpay relative to its size. Germany is under-represented in the EU Parliament and every other institution.
Germany's economic strength pulled Europe out of the ruins of WW2 (granted, they also caused those ruins but that was 60 years ago but that doesn't change the fact that Germany's economic miracle benefited all of Europe)
Haven't the German people worn your crown of thorns for long enough?
Haven't they paid their dues?
60 years after the civil war, Americans had mostly forgiven their southern countrymen. Isn't it time for Europeans to do the same? _________________ "www.peakoil.com is the Myspace of the Apocalypse."
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 10:15 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
btu2012 wrote:
Miss Dream, I have a few questions for you:
1. Is there anyone in Europe whom you don't hate ? I can see from the above that you hate the Germans and despise the French
2. Did you personally have anything to do with "fighting the buggers" ?
3. If you are a NI loyalist (since you claim that "you" fought the buggers), then what the heck were your family and friends doing on Irish land ?
4. If you are a NI republican, then please let me know how "you" fought the buggers. I though that Ireland was neutral throughout WWII.
I am going to interject here as I have been reading a lot of vitriole in the past few days. I am of "Northern Irish Stock", as Americandream says he/she/it is; but my ancestors were of the kind who left, discriminated against by outsiders who had been given land which was not their own.
AmericanDream, you are one of the most bigoted people I have ever come across on an internet forum. Do you talk like this when you are in public, or is this all bravery because you cannot see anyone?
Northern Ireland is still a bitter, divided yet beautiful place: You can have it now as it's ruined by people like you. _________________ formerly Taizy and Taizy8 - having problems with the cookies.
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 10:34 am Post subject: Re: Elites fail as Europe wakes up to the fascist threat
Tyler_JC wrote:
Btu, if I'm ever in your area, I need to buy you a beer. A GERMAN beer.
As for americandream and company:
The amount of irrational paranoia with regards to Germany is incredible.
Germany has paid for an enourmously large share of the EU's programs and continues to overpay relative to its size. Germany is under-represented in the EU Parliament and every other institution.
Germany's economic strength pulled Europe out of the ruins of WW2 (granted, they also caused those ruins but that was 60 years ago but that doesn't change the fact that Germany's economic miracle benefited all of Europe)
Haven't the German people worn your crown of thorns for long enough?
Haven't they paid their dues?
60 years after the civil war, Americans had mostly forgiven their southern countrymen. Isn't it time for Europeans to do the same?
What history did you not study. It was America that created the 'economic miracle' and don't for a minute think and some don't still have strong feeling about the American civil war. Europe hasn't been able to defend itself, or had to pay the cost of defending itself since the Second War. As far as I remember, Germany hasn't paid any of the 'dues', all were forgiven so they could have their 'miracle'. _________________ HOLDING THE CENTER
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