Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 5:49 pm Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
FourOfSwords wrote:
WildRose, that would be the Bow river valley, Calgary?
Cheers
Alex
North Saskatchewan River valley, in Edmonton, FourofSwords. It's a beautiful area, lots of parks with trails all along the river as it winds its its way through the city. The parks are great for recreational riding, but there aren't enough trails going north and south to take people to the university area, downtown core and NAIT.
Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 10:29 pm Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
I've been yearning for one like the picture for the longest time and posted about it before. There are others that are a little smaller footprint. Pricey though. I really think I should do it.
Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 12:56 am Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
Kingcoal wrote:
The only problem is that you get off your bicycle at the supermarket, walk inside and find empty shelves. The human machine requires food and unfortunately that is not delivered via bike to the stores.
That could be changed. I regularly drive this cargo-bicycle at work ( i work at a bookshop):
It will take up to 600 pounds of cargo. Don't try and drive it fully loaded up a hill tough... ( you jump off and push)
I commute daily on my bicycle all year ( dont own a car) and i see more and more people doing the same thing... sometimes there is even congestion on the bike lanes during rush hour.
( site of a dutch cargo-bicycle specialist that seems to have some dealers in the USA: http://www.workcycles.com/workbike/index.html )
Joined: May 28, 2008 Posts: 91 Location: Old Dominion
Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 7:36 am Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
Displaying much forethought, a number of cities here in the U.S. have provided great facilities for bikers. Unfortunately, most have not.
One factor here in the U.S. that discourages the use of bicycles for daily transportation is simply how spread-out everything is! Its not at all unusual for employees to travel 50 mi. one way to work each day.
Here where I live, the closest small city (only 4/5 mi. north) is nicknamed "The Hill City", and for good reason. Bike lanes have yet to be created although it is legal to ride a bike on any road with the exception of limited-access highways.
Because of bicycles having to squeeze onto more narrow streets and roads that was built without any provision for bikes, it can be very dangerous of the rider. Each year there are several fatalities locally and many more non fatal injuries to bikers from impacts with autos.
So, bicycles here are used more for recreation than transportation. I doubt I'll see any change soon. There are, however, lots more scooters now than ever before. _________________ "If everything is going well, you obviously overlooked something."
Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 10:09 am Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
WildRose wrote:
I like it, mercurygirl. Can you tell me just how pricey a bike such as this one would be?
$2-3K for the trikes. They have a big selection and bikes too. Even if I didn't buy, the website is fun to browse. Here's a link: Link
Maybe there are more economical versions out there. That cargo-bike looks like fun, dutch.
Joined: Mar 25, 2008 Posts: 696 Location: Alif Lam Mim
Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 1:16 pm Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
If we were very committed as a nation, we could convert to a "cycle" civilization as much as possible. I use the term cycle civilization over bicycle civ. because of the need for tricycles, bike lorries (which have more than 2 wheels, etc.
We could move any supplies over long distances via rail. Then we could take the freight from the stations and warehouses in any given city throughout the city/region (assuming the region is small enough) via lorries and such. The use of multi-person lorries could tug ≈1000 lbs of "stuff" around. These would go to distribution centers and larger stores. Then move stuff to smaller corner stores via the 500 lb capacity bikes shown above. People could then purchase their food and whatnot on trikes. The trikes would provide the ability to move 50-100 lbs (or so) of stuff over several miles.
However, we'd have to ramp up our rail capacity (use is about at capacity and capacity isn't that strong) as well as reduce or even eliminate suburbs and sprawl. Much of cities could be reduced in size once you get rid of the roads. Roads for cars need to be much bigger than roads for bikes. This spreads everything out even more than need be. Thus, we'd help with all of the complaints about it "being too long (of a distance)".
Major benefits would be a society not wasting money on 30 billion barrels of oil a year. Along with that, we wouldn't have that ability to purchase large items (TV's, furniture, etc) whenever we wanted. We'd have to carefully plan all large purchases out which would reduce the desire to get them. Nearly all consumer purchases would be reduced. Who wants to go 5 miles to pick up a toy? Not many. This would help reduce our consumerist society.
In addition, we'd also see a much healthier society. No longer would we be spending $100 bln a year on obesity (that doesn't factor in the extra costs of all other procedures) nor a bunch of money on other problems caused by laziness and inactivity. This would lead to an increase in worker productivity while at work (which would make up for any additional time it takes to get to work). Also, we'd see more students, who have more energy and are healthier, doing well in school. Generally, people that work out and/or exercise are happier as well.
So we could have a smarter, more productive, happier and healthier society with more money if we moved to a cycle society. But it requires stuff like self-sacrifice, hard work, time and money. Oh well... _________________ Riches are not from abundance of worldly goods, but from a contented mind.
Joined: Mar 05, 2006 Posts: 420 Location: East edge of the Milky Way
Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 3:20 pm Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
WildRose wrote:
FourOfSwords wrote:
WildRose, that would be the Bow river valley, Calgary?
Cheers
Alex
North Saskatchewan River valley, in Edmonton, FourofSwords. It's a beautiful area, lots of parks with trails all along the river as it winds its its way through the city. The parks are great for recreational riding, but there aren't enough trails going north and south to take people to the university area, downtown core and NAIT.
Nice to see you posting here lately!
Thanks Rose. I haven't been in Edmonton for almost 30 years, probably wouldnt recognize the place...that goes for Calgary too.
I hear the economy is chugging along, and hope you and yours are benefitting from it.
My claim to fame in Alberta(not counting all the drinking parties, and line dancing) was the bridge that crosses the Red Deer river between Edmonton and Calgary...I helped build that one in my youth. I dont know if it's still standing, or has been replaced, but I carved my initials and the date(1972?, not sure) in the wet concrete, overhanging one of the trusses facing the east(where I came from)...gotta get back there some day in my travels to see if I can see'em. Will be biking around Canada when I retire and my daughter is grown up, so I'll do my bit for the 'bicycle civilization'
Cheers
Alex _________________ The bigger you build the bonfire, the more darkness is revealed."
- Terence McKenna
Last edited by FourOfSwords on Wed Jun 25, 2008 4:03 pm; edited 1 time in total
Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 3:34 pm Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
Dont forget water transport: it is very energy efficient. You can move thousnds of pounds over water with just a 5 hp engine. Just not very fast.. In Holland we used to have a transport system that used man- and horse- drawn boats. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horse-drawn_boat
Joined: May 06, 2006 Posts: 873 Location: Tustin, CA
Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 9:10 pm Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
3aidlillahi wrote:
If we were very committed as a nation, we could convert to a "cycle" civilization as much as possible. I use the term cycle civilization over bicycle civ. because of the need for tricycles, bike lorries (which have more than 2 wheels, etc.
We could move any supplies over long distances via rail. Then we could take the freight from the stations and warehouses in any given city throughout the city/region (assuming the region is small enough) via lorries and such. The use of multi-person lorries could tug ≈1000 lbs of "stuff" around. These would go to distribution centers and larger stores. Then move stuff to smaller corner stores via the 500 lb capacity bikes shown above. People could then purchase their food and whatnot on trikes. The trikes would provide the ability to move 50-100 lbs (or so) of stuff over several miles.
However, we'd have to ramp up our rail capacity (use is about at capacity and capacity isn't that strong) as well as reduce or even eliminate suburbs and sprawl. Much of cities could be reduced in size once you get rid of the roads. Roads for cars need to be much bigger than roads for bikes. This spreads everything out even more than need be. Thus, we'd help with all of the complaints about it "being too long (of a distance)".
Major benefits would be a society not wasting money on 30 billion barrels of oil a year. Along with that, we wouldn't have that ability to purchase large items (TV's, furniture, etc) whenever we wanted. We'd have to carefully plan all large purchases out which would reduce the desire to get them. Nearly all consumer purchases would be reduced. Who wants to go 5 miles to pick up a toy? Not many. This would help reduce our consumerist society.
In addition, we'd also see a much healthier society. No longer would we be spending $100 bln a year on obesity (that doesn't factor in the extra costs of all other procedures) nor a bunch of money on other problems caused by laziness and inactivity. This would lead to an increase in worker productivity while at work (which would make up for any additional time it takes to get to work). Also, we'd see more students, who have more energy and are healthier, doing well in school. Generally, people that work out and/or exercise are happier as well.
So we could have a smarter, more productive, happier and healthier society with more money if we moved to a cycle society. But it requires stuff like self-sacrifice, hard work, time and money. Oh well...
I like everyone glued to politics in 1972 saw a China, when Nixon first traveled there, that showed it could be done. Even then it was under the weight of almost a billion people. Any one who watched the news at that time saw the streets of Beijing filled with bicycles and only the occasional truck or car (I don't remember seeing more that 3 trucks or cars on any street!)
Unfortunately, they chose to be like us, instead of we like them! _________________ Skeptical scrutiny in both Science and Religion is the means by which deep thoughts are winnowed from deep nonsense-Carl Sagan
Joined: May 28, 2008 Posts: 91 Location: Old Dominion
Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2008 7:09 am Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
Seldom is anything in life simple. Only after we begin to craft a new society would we see the reality and difficulty of such a project.
Lesson consumerism? Reduce or eliminate the streets? If you have a job producing something, who's going to buy it? There would still be need of large emergency apparattus that would respond to fires, rescues, and other emergency incidents.
I don't intend riducule. I only point out how attached dissimular issues can be and the cascading effects that will occur. One seemingly positive change can suddenly present a host of unforseen negative consequences.
If left alone and hot fiddled with by the fed govt., natural change will happen on it's own as people begin making adjustments voluntarily. It will take decades. I don't believe there will ever be a utopian society here on earth, but we will learn and adjust to make a life...as we always have in the past. _________________ "If everything is going well, you obviously overlooked something."
Posted: Thu Jun 26, 2008 9:21 am Post subject: Re: Bicycle civilization
I just want the noise to stop.
Woke up this morning ...not to the gentle sound of tweeting birds, but to the sound of lawnmowers, strimmers and blowers.
I notice a lot of overweight people using sit on top lawnmowers. Is there such a thing as a bicycle lawnmower? _________________ formerly Taizy and Taizy8 - having problems with the cookies.
All times are GMT - 6 Hours Goto page Previous1, 2, 3Next
Page 2 of 3
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot vote in polls in this forum
News
Discussions
Resources
Members
Forum FAQ
Search
Usergroups
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
I haven't been in Edmonton for almost 30 years, probably wouldnt recognize the place...that goes for Calgary too.
