Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 1:57 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
Quote:
Sweden has very very small ammount of coal...It will destroy those forest in no time to heat their homes "Sweden has long winters"
Yea, Sweden so green burning fossil fuel derived garbage for energy and heat. LOL!
By the way Sweden uses more fossil fuel than ever in its history and it increases every year!
And Poland is using less fossil fuels now than before? I think Poland is far more reliant on fossil fuels than Sweden. Sweden is using more and more electricity from water or nuclear for heating.
Quote:
By far Finland and PO will do better..Poland has some of the best fertile soil in the world, a coal reserve ect...Sweden's farm land is rocky and its seasons are not great "they have crop failers more often"
In famines...do a Wikapedia . You'll be surprised before the oil age in a world of 2 billion look at how often and how many in Western Europe alone List of Famines
In famines people generally stay where they are "I don't support the theory of roving Zombies from the cities to the country side "it will be small scale if it does happen" people during famines generally don't move far from home.
Thus I expect many Swed's to starve death sitting in their homes.
Hmm and Finland has enough farmland? Poland's agriculture is just as dependent on oil as everywhere else. How are they going to support a population of 40 million? I think people are going to try to survive, if that means raiding the countryside to steal farm produce, I think that's what they're going to do. Ever heard of immigration or mass movement of refugees? That is NOT people sitting at home dying of hunger, it's people moving to places that look good. Like Poles mass immigrating to Sweden, that's why they are a significant minority there.
If Poland going to be so well off, well, then that's were people will go. You're basically surrounded by overpopulated land with no strong natural borders, that's gonna be fun, no?
The high crime and corruption in Poland is certainly going to ensure it's going to be horrible there. _________________ "Life is merely an orderly decay of energy states, and survival requires the continual discovery of new energy to pump into the system. He who controls the sources of energy controls the means of survival. "
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 2:00 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
If you consider:
population density
agriculturally productive land per capita
freshwater
biomass, hydro and wind energy reserves
cultural uniformity
respect of law
mass transit
(last but not least) climate change
...Sweden beats most countries in Europe (and elsewhere) hands down.
But Sweden will probably have problems with non-integrated immigrants in biggest cities who may not face the economic crisis with stoic northern patience. And when climate change really hits, it may face a huge influx of refugees from the south.
GeneralGreen wrote:
It will destroy those forest in no time to heat their homes "Sweden has long winters"
With the large forest reserves and nuclear, wind and hydro, Sweden will most certainly stay warm and keep some lights on too for a long time. And winters keep getting shorter and warmer up in the north, faster than the general global warming.
GeneralGreen wrote:
Thus I expect many Swed's to starve death sitting in their homes.
I expect the Swedes to be among the very last to starve in the whole world. The Swedes are usually quite effective in rational cooperation for common goals. Most of them wouldn't mind grabbing a shovel or an axe if an actual famine was coming their way.
DefiledEngine wrote:
Hmm and Finland has enough farmland?
Just enough to produce cereals, dairy products, potatoes and most meat for its citizens. Of course, we'll have to secure our fertilizer supply (some of it is extracted locally). _________________ "A devastating error is to set up a political system based on [individual] desire... the best dictatorship would be one where the government prevents any economical growth."
"Only scarcity and effort make life worth living."
-Pentti Linkola
Last edited by Fredrik on Sat Jul 05, 2008 2:13 am; edited 3 times in total
Joined: Jul 04, 2008 Posts: 181 Location: Europe: European Historian
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 2:00 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
Daphne64 wrote:
I'm guessing only the first question will have an answer in single digits. The last one ... I think the muslims of Sweden will go home or else become stew. Swedes haven't had ALL the viking bred out of them, the aggressiveness is just dormant.
The last time Sweden fought a war was when the USA became a nation.
The Viking blood .....Modern day Swedish men are the most feminized in the world! i don't know how many news paper articles Ive read where Swedish men stand and look a women is raped or mugged..and they do nothing! They are the most pacifist men in the world. The aggressiveness is dormant??? Haa..only time they get aggressive is when they grumble..or if you don't support their ideology "womens rights-feminism-liberalism ect.."
The Muslims won't go home..they'll stay put in Sweden..and likely the native Swedes will kiss their ass even as they starve to death.
Sweds will likely go extinct.
Joined: Jul 04, 2008 Posts: 181 Location: Europe: European Historian
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 2:31 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
This topic is on Sweden..not about comparing Poland to Sweden..so I'll stay on topic..
Quote:
population
Most land in Sweden is unlivable and has been unlivable all the way up until the oil age. So population density of SW is mainly situated around its large cities 'Malmo, Stockholm Jongcipping..."
Quote:
Ag land production
..Swedish farmland is not good 'rocky' and the climate is short for growing..and most farmers are highly subsidized and deep in debt "both will fall by the way post peak oil" Swedish farms are also large conglomerate farms. The small farmer of Sweden no long exist.
Quote:
Freshwater
Yes a benifit of Sweden
Quote:
biomass, hydro and wind energy reserves
They still use more fossil fuels then they ever have before and are 100% reliant on imports and exports. "Mainly to the USA"
Quote:
cultural uniformity
As stated, the most individualistic people in the world and have turned into a highly multicultural country. Also they are a Welfare nation. This items ranks at the bottom of the list...I would give people in Zimbabwe more cultural uniformity they I give Sweden.
Quote:
respect of law
Yes most native Sweds..most immigrants no
Quote:
mass transit
Still have a large car culture. mass transit isn't going to help them much in the days ahead.
Quote:
Sweden beats most countries in Europe (and elsewhere) hands down.
If the population was 1-2 million and had 40% small farms maybe...
Quote:
But Sweden will probably have problems will be non-integrated immigrants in biggest cities who may not face the economic crisis with stoic northern patience. And when climate change really hits, it may face a huge influx of refugees from the south.
Not Probably...WILL!
I wouldn't worry too much about climate change that will be the least of your worries in Sweden
GeneralGreen wrote:
It will destroy those forest in no time to heat their homes "Sweden has long winters"
Quote:
With the large forest reserves and nuclear, wind and hydro, Sweden will most certainly stay warm and keep some lights on too for a long time. And winters keep getting shorter and warmer up in the north, faster than the general global warming
All this produces electric power are you telling me Sweds all heat their homes with Electric? Boy that is going to be one EXPENSIVE bill in the winter..and even if all Sweds did....how will they pay their heating bills as the world economy crumbles and no one buys their exports "which are expensive? As unemployment skyrockets how will ave Joe Swed get the money to pay his expensive heating bills? non the less basics...? You fail to see the crisis is full.
Sweds are 100% depended on on time deliveries-trucking and transport as Americans are!
Sweds will be savaging those forest as fast as they can as the economy crashes, and destitution sets in..
GeneralGreen wrote:
Thus I expect many Swed's to starve death sitting in their homes.
Quote:
I expect the Swedes to be among the very last to starve in the whole world. The Swedes are usually quite effective in rational cooperation for common goals. Most of them wouldn't mind grabbing a shovel or an axe if an actual famine was coming their way.
Sweds are the most greedy people in the entire world!Only time a Swed will help out is if it benefits his own ass. They are NOT community minded people..in any way, shape, size,or form! I don't know where you have the idea that Sweds will pull up their trousers and help out..That is a fairy tale!
Joined: Jul 04, 2008 Posts: 181 Location: Europe: European Historian
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 3:06 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
Tyler_JC wrote:
I don't understand why having a large % of the population working on agriculture is an advantage.
Almost everyone in Africa is a farmer, does that make them better off?
In a resource poor world, wouldn't we want to have the most efficient farms possible?
Specialization of labor is a good thing.
Are you new to peak oil? I mean have you even read about the situation in depth?
Most efficient is what you see now..HUGE conglomerate farms, where farmers are highly subsidized by the goverment and are wholly depended on cheap on time oil. also most of these 'efficient farms are deep in debt, and many are already having serve problems with oil at 140 USD bbl "efficient is a byproduct of the oil age.
Heres some cuts by Cattons "Overshoot about the farming situation..
Catton on farming % population>
The fiscal collapse had an even more important implication than this for our ecological understanding of the human predicament. That implication appears in the generalized Depression that followed. Consider the farm population in America. Like almost everyone else, farm families were compelled, by the repercussions of bank failures and the ramifications of general panic, to cut their consumer expenditures. Farmers also often had to allow their land, their buildings, and their equipment to deteriorate for lack of money to pay for maintenance and repairs. Many farms were encumbered by mortgages—mortgages which were foreclosed by banks that now desperately needed the payments farmers could not afford to make. (Bank failures were even more common in rural regions than in major cities.) In spite of all these difficulties, however, the farm population in America ceased declining (as it had been doing) and increased between 1929 and 1933 by more than a million. The long-term trend of movement out of farm niches and into urban niches was reversed during the Great Depression. [6]
Niches everywhere were being constricted by the Depression. However, the urbanizing trend that had been occurring as a result of industrial growth in the cities and from elimination of farm niches by mechanization of agriculture was disrupted by this economic breakdown. At the heart of the reversal was a simple fact: the nature of' farming in the 1930s was still such that, whatever else they had to give up, there was still truth in the cliche that "the farm family can always eat." Other (non-flood-producing) occupational groups that now had to fall back (like the farmers) on carrying capacities of reduced scope could find themselves in much more dire straits.
If we read it rightly, then, we can see the differential impact of the Depression upon farm versus non-farm populations as a cogent indicator of the dependence of the total population on previously achieved enlargements of the scope of application of' Liebig's law With breakdown of the mechanisms of exchange, various segments of a modern nation had to revert as best they could to living on carrying capacities again limited by locally least abundant resources, rather than extended by access to less scarce resources from elsewhere. Although scope reduction hurt everyone, rural folk had local resources to fall back upon; urban people, in contrast, had so detached themselves as to have almost ceased to recognize the indispensability of those resources. For reasons we shall examine in a moment, economic hard times hit the farms sooner than they hit the cities, but in the final scope-reducing crunch the farmers turned out to have an advantage sufficient to interrupt a clear trend of urbanization
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 3:29 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
I just lost a long thread I wrote on Sweden but here is the short version:
Sweden problems:
1 Unproductive immigrants swelling the cities
2 Highly modern unsustainable agriculture
3 Large % imported foods (meat 1/2 imported)
4 Lost arable land to dead tree plantations
5 Modern breeds of animals that are not hardy and sustainable
6 highly urbanized
7 Entitlement attitude
8 Secular Puritain attitude of moral superiority
9 No fossil fuels (the tree plantations will be quickly decimated)
10 Castrated male population
11 Atomized, loney individuals
12 Weak family structure (highest % of single person households in the world)
13 Inflexible people
14 Uncreative people (I call them the Japanese of Europe)
15 Rocky soil
16 Garbage incinirator energy dependent on fossil fuels
17 No USA to flee to this time (1/5 pop. left in 1800's)
18 Strong value on independence thus little neighborliness and little willingness to help others
19 Weak friendship networks. From observing my neighbors and colleagues most Swedes have little or no friends and watch lots of tv and internet. Also, even in the small towns there is little or no community spirit.
Sweden=RIP
Fredrik wrote:
If you consider:
population density
agriculturally productive land per capita
freshwater
biomass, hydro and wind energy reserves
cultural uniformity
respect of law
mass transit
(last but not least) climate change
...Sweden beats most countries in Europe (and elsewhere) hands down.
But Sweden will probably have problems with non-integrated immigrants in biggest cities who may not face the economic crisis with stoic northern patience. And when climate change really hits, it may face a huge influx of refugees from the south.
GeneralGreen wrote:
It will destroy those forest in no time to heat their homes "Sweden has long winters"
With the large forest reserves and nuclear, wind and hydro, Sweden will most certainly stay warm and keep some lights on too for a long time. And winters keep getting shorter and warmer up in the north, faster than the general global warming.
GeneralGreen wrote:
Thus I expect many Swed's to starve death sitting in their homes.
I expect the Swedes to be among the very last to starve in the whole world. The Swedes are usually quite effective in rational cooperation for common goals. Most of them wouldn't mind grabbing a shovel or an axe if an actual famine was coming their way.
DefiledEngine wrote:
Hmm and Finland has enough farmland?
Just enough to produce cereals, dairy products, potatoes and most meat for its citizens. Of course, we'll have to secure our fertilizer supply (some of it is extracted locally).
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 3:53 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
The modern economy will crash everywhere (except in countries that have already bit the dust). The economy will have to be rebuilt everywhere, to correspond to the new post-cheap-oil situation. The question is, what physical assets a country has to feed and warm its citizens as this reform, slowly and painfully, takes place?
As for industrial agriculture vs. subsistence farming, this Oil Drum article is a good concise presentation.
Quote:
However, there is nothing in high energy costs that will make it [farm size growth] reverse - it will still be beneficial to spread the non-energy costs over more acreage. Thus although the trend of increasing farm size may slow, there is nothing to put it into reverse.
As long as there is just enough energy to power tractors and harvesters (they can be modified to run on wood, with wood gasifiers attached to the engine), and to produce pesticides and fertilizer (small fractions of energy use), there's no economically valid reason to suppose that the current model would disappear, unless the government decides otherwise. _________________ "A devastating error is to set up a political system based on [individual] desire... the best dictatorship would be one where the government prevents any economical growth."
"Only scarcity and effort make life worth living."
-Pentti Linkola
Last edited by Fredrik on Sat Jul 05, 2008 4:35 am; edited 1 time in total
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 5:28 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
Fredrick,
If you keep the current model then you still need loads of petroleum based products to hold up the system. Trucks to bring the milk from Skane to Norrland, the ugly plastic wrapped hay bails that Swedish farmers are addicted to, the closed environment high energy farms for swine and poultry, etc.....
Now Sweden because it does not prodouce its own must import all its petroleum needs and it thus must buy these products on the world market. Since the price will be going through the roof, how will sweden continue with the current model?
It cannot and will not and I really love it when Scandinavians go on and on about their great forest. Maybe compard to Western Europe it looks like a lot. The tree plantations (they are not forest) will be decimated quickly. There just isn't as much bio mass in Scandinavia or on earth as some people like to imagine.
I live in Smaland and the forest here were decimated to make wood coal. And that was when the pop. was much lower. Think, for example, if they try to (and they will) to heat Stockholm with wood. The woods would diseapper in a heart beat!
Now also consider that the tree plantations aka forrest are privately owned, business investments (often the owners being large corporations or even the Swedish Church). They will want the highest price they can get and that means selling on the international market. So as the demand for wood soars worldwide, nations with greater buying power and less trees, say Germany or France, will want Sweden’s wood. Is Sweden and Scandinavia going to provide the biomass for Europe?
This reminds me of a story I read in the book Born Fighting by James Webb. His aunt’s family or somehow related family during the Great Depression would poach wood at night in the forests of Arkansas and sell it to local folks for heating and cooking fuel. It is rumoured that his aunt had to screw the only guy around with a truck so they could borrow it on their poaching trips. Now, why did they need to steal wood in a state covered in forest? Because it was a privately owned natural resource just like in Sweden. Where I live in Sweden I cannot just go out and fetch wood though I am surrounded by woods.
Sweden’s Tree Plantations= R.I.P.
Ha det sa trevlight
Fredrik wrote:
The modern economy will crash everywhere (except in countries that have already bit the dust). The economy will have to be rebuilt everywhere, to correspond to the new post-cheap-oil situation. The question is, what physical assets a country has to feed and warm its citizens as this reform, slowly and painfully, takes place?
As for industrial agriculture vs. subsistence farming, this Oil Drum article is a good concise presentation.
Quote:
However, there is nothing in high energy costs that will make it [farm size growth] reverse - it will still be beneficial to spread the non-energy costs over more acreage. Thus although the trend of increasing farm size may slow, there is nothing to put it into reverse.
As long as there is just enough energy to power tractors and harvesters (they can be modified to run on wood, with wood gasifiers attached to the engine), and to produce pesticides and fertilizer (small fractions of energy use), there's no economically valid reason to suppose that the current model would disappear, unless the government decides otherwise.
Joined: Dec 07, 2005 Posts: 1856 Location: Australia
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 6:06 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
Quote:
Sweds are the most greedy people in the entire world!Only time a Swed will help out is if it benefits his own ass. They are NOT community minded people..in any way, shape, size,or form! I don't know where you have the idea that Sweds will pull up their trousers and help out..That is a fairy tale!
Generally I agree with most of what GG says but then he throws out something like this that leads me to believe he carries with him some subjective personal experience(s).
Just to share my own subjective experiences;
I lived in Sydney Australia for a year and ws told it was supposed to be the friendliest place in the world. Well for me, after having worked and travelled in all out continents (except Antarctica) my impression was that Sydney was the unfriendliest place I've ever been to. Having just moved from Sweden to Australia I was shocked at how hostile they were in traffic, unfrienfly and lazy in business and totally un-social at work. The friendliest people I worked with were......drum roll.....the Mexicans.
What d'ya know.
I personally disagree with your comments on Swede's being particularly greedy. People I've mixed with weren't even stingy.
(One of the reasons I decided to work overseas for a while was becasue I couldn't seem to save a krona. There was always so much social stuff going on and as you may know Sweden isn't exactly a cheap place.)
Unfortunately the individual independendce has come at a cost to the family. Extended families getting together ala mediterranian style hardly happens at all. (Normally just weedings and funerals.)
Were I partly agree again is however when it comes so civil courage. And I blame this again on the mental molding the swedes have gone through. And stupid laws. Like if you catch a burglar and he gets a bruise on his arm, you are in more trouble than he is.
And when Swedes finally get pissed off, do they do like the French farmers that block the streets and dump manure in the city?
No
Do the youth run amoc and torch cars?
No
They send a letter to the local paper column.
I'll illustrate it here;
ATTEMPTED TRANSLATION:
Don't let MC Donalds in
This is serious!
How can you council politicians in Ludvika even consider letting MC Donalds into the middle of town.
You obviously have no idea what issues MC-clubs caused.
In other cities they are doing everything to get them out of the city centres but in Ludvika they are going to be allowed to build a premise at Sockenstugeparken. A precedent in that case.
Then I guess MC Bandidos will be here soon as well.
No there is only one place suitable and that is the industrial area at Gonasvagen.
Signed: You just don't get it!
_________________ Lets take a ride, and run with the dogs tonight
In suburbia
You cant hide, run with the dogs tonight
In suburbia
- Pet Shop Boys
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 6:35 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
Swedes are stingy! THe most stingy people on Earth but I don't blame them, this was a part of Protestantism.
Maybe you being a Swede don't notice how if someone gives you a lift that it is stingy to expect the lifter to pay for gas or that when you go out for a drink or to eat that everyone pedantically must count out what they owe down to the last ore. Or that parents expect their kids to pay when they go out to eat with them. Or buying wine in a box to save 10 kroner. Or buying all their furniture at the walmart of furniture IKEA. Or that cutting in line selfish. Or that elbowing people at a bar is rude. Or that complaining that everything is not up to standard is rude, especailly while in foreign countries. Or that police that will never understand if you do something as simple as crosswalk is symptomatic of people without human empathy. Or that men treating men without respect and honour is behaviour that will lead to a fight in a culture that values honour and pride over rules. SWEDES ARE STINGY AND GREEDY! And extemely socially inept.
I remember talking to a Polish lady who told me when she first moved to Sweden she asked the neighbor for some salt and the neighbor pointed towards the shop and told her to go buy some.
What does this have to do with peak oil? Swedes will devour themselves come hard times becasue of their lack of heart, their lack of humanness. I met a Englishman once who posed the question; "IS the Swede human?"
And GG is right on that come hard times, the Swede will go far left, communistic. And his tendency to follow the rules (Uncle Tom is that attitude) will allow for his complete enslavement. With the coming storm people who do NOT follow the rules will do the best. THose who follow order will be slaves.
Welcome to Scandislavia!
Micki wrote:
Quote:
Sweds are the most greedy people in the entire world!Only time a Swed will help out is if it benefits his own ass. They are NOT community minded people..in any way, shape, size,or form! I don't know where you have the idea that Sweds will pull up their trousers and help out..That is a fairy tale!
Generally I agree with most of what GG says but then he throws out something like this that leads me to believe he carries with him some subjective personal experience(s).
Just to share my own subjective experiences;
I lived in Sydney Australia for a year and ws told it was supposed to be the friendliest place in the world. Well for me, after having worked and travelled in all out continents (except Antarctica) my impression was that Sydney was the unfriendliest place I've ever been to. Having just moved from Sweden to Australia I was shocked at how hostile they were in traffic, unfrienfly and lazy in business and totally un-social at work. The friendliest people I worked with were......drum roll.....the Mexicans.
What d'ya know.
I personally disagree with your comments on Swede's being particularly greedy. People I've mixed with weren't even stingy.
(One of the reasons I decided to work overseas for a while was becasue I couldn't seem to save a krona. There was always so much social stuff going on and as you may know Sweden isn't exactly a cheap place.)
Unfortunately the individual independendce has come at a cost to the family. Extended families getting together ala mediterranian style hardly happens at all. (Normally just weedings and funerals.)
Were I partly agree again is however when it comes so civil courage. And I blame this again on the mental molding the swedes have gone through. And stupid laws. Like if you catch a burglar and he gets a bruise on his arm, you are in more trouble than he is.
And when Swedes finally get pissed off, do they do like the French farmers that block the streets and dump manure in the city?
No
Do the youth run amoc and torch cars?
No
They send a letter to the local paper column.
I'll illustrate it here;
ATTEMPTED TRANSLATION:
Don't let MC Donalds in
This is serious!
How can you council politicians in Ludvika even consider letting MC Donalds into the middle of town.
You obviously have no idea what issues MC-clubs caused.
In other cities they are doing everything to get them out of the city centres but in Ludvika they are going to be allowed to build a premise at Sockenstugeparken. A precedent in that case.
Then I guess MC Bandidos will be here soon as well.
No there is only one place suitable and that is the industrial area at Gonasvagen.
Signed: You just don't get it!
Joined: May 27, 2008 Posts: 70 Location: middle of the USA
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 9:15 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
I should probably back off my earlier speculation about how many people would resort to murder/cannibalism. Stories about China and ancient or primitive societies are perhaps not too applicable to the modern world. Christian societies will have low levels of murder for cannibalistic purposes, and much as I despise Islam, they do prohibit murder of their own children.
Just eating people who have already died to avoid starvation is something different, though.
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 9:39 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
Wow! Some people really hate Swedes, I see. Well, being not related at all with Swedes, and focusing on energy matters, I've found something pretty interesting about the "dying" Swedish forests:
So, they are increasing their wood production overtime, but at the same time the quantity of wood in their forests is also increasing... How on earth they are doing it? Well the answer is probably this:
I doubt a lot than in 19th century that way of forest explotaition was used. Looking back in history is OK but has some flaws if you try to guess the future with it, mainly the technology/knowledge its not the same so you'll have better productivities and better efficiencies in resouces uses (modern wood boilers are more efficient, for instance).
Finally, something that it's not on BP Stats and that shows how fast is growing biomass energy use:
Joined: May 27, 2008 Posts: 70 Location: middle of the USA
Posted: Sat Jul 05, 2008 10:10 am Post subject: Re: Why Sweden will be One of the Worse EU nations Post Peak
GeneralGreen wrote:
The Viking blood .....Modern day Swedish men are the most feminized in the world! i don't know how many news paper articles Ive read where Swedish men stand and look a women is raped or mugged..and they do nothing! They are the most pacifist men in the world. The aggressiveness is dormant??? Haa..only time they get aggressive is when they grumble..or if you don't support their ideology "womens rights-feminism-liberalism ect.."
As an american with 100% Swedish blood let me say I would love the opportunity to fight for Sweden's life.
The viking genes are still there. There has been no mass mingling or genes or dieoff to get rid of or dilute them. I may be indulging in wishful thinking, but time will tell.
I have to agree with most of the posters, sweden will do at least as well as other countries once it takes care of it's muslim problem. Population density, average IQ, a law abiding ethos, and possibly improved growing seasons due to global warming will work to their advantage.
Mind you, I believe in fairly serious population dieoff. Sweden could lose 90% of it's population and still be doing better than an average european country.
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The last time Sweden fought a war was when the USA became a nation.
.....Modern day Swedish men are the most feminized in the world! i don't know how many news paper articles Ive read where Swedish men stand and look a women is raped or mugged..and they do nothing! They are the most pacifist men in the world. The aggressiveness is dormant??? Haa..only time they get aggressive is when they grumble..or if you don't support their ideology "womens rights-feminism-liberalism ect.."
