Like the illusion of Wall Street, with its vast and powerful investment banks, now shuttered, China too is an illusion perpetuated by the Globalists that gave us the 15,000 mile Caesar salad, poisoned cat food and lead based paint on babies' pacifiers. Like the illusion that money would come from thin air to always push housing prices higher, China has spent a generation pursuing its illusion. Pursuing an unattainable dream to be like the West, while 6000 years of its carefully shepherded top soil blows into the sea.
Joined: May 10, 2007 Posts: 3317 Location: Resiliency Farm
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 5:51 am Post subject: Re: Housing & Economic Collapse - In Progress - #2
Cloud9 wrote:
Greed tends to produce more than does a general warm fuzzy wish to promote the general welfare. Greed is what drags my sorry butt out of bed every morning and sends it to work. Name one item produced under communism that is not associated with a weapon’s system that improved the human condition.
Which of their weapon's systems "improved the human condition"?
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 6:00 am Post subject: Re: Housing & Economic Collapse - In Progress - #2
That was my point. Communism contributed little to advancing the human condition. Having said that; as I recall, the lift capacity of their rockets exceeds ours. Bigger payloads, bigger satellites. Bigger satellites more T.V channels.
I resisted the temptation to say that 100 million AK 47’s in circulation significantly advanced the bargaining position of the little people.
Although soemtimes Congressman Schumer is plain worng, Schumer is no more responsible for the failure of IndyMac than speculators are responsible for oil closing at $145 Friday.
Yes they have some influence in the long term. But in IndyMac's case, $10 billion was lent to IndyMac in 2007 and earlier by the Federal Home Loan Bank Board - even before losses accumulated. If IndyMac could have borrowed this much otherwise, it would have not went to the FHLBB. It's not even clear that the FHLBB was allowed to lend so much. If I were a Congressperson, I would want to know why Government money was thrown into IndyMac - since it only facilitated more loses the FDIC now has to pay out.
BTW - The same thing happened to Countrywide with FHLBB loans, but in that case, I think the Bank of America is covering up derivavtive losses on contracts with Countrywide - so by taking Countrywide over it does not have to realize those losses on its books. _________________ It's already over, now it's just a matter of adjusting.
FDIC is intended to keep things working under more or less stable economic conditions. It is intended to indemnify depositors against bank failures that occur during normal economic conditions. If economic conditions change such that bank failures become more widespread, FDIC's reserves will be exhausted fairly rapidly. FDIC's reserves were exhausted and it became temporarily insolvent during the savings and loan crisis in the late 80's. _________________ "So while you sit and whistle Dixie with your money and your power.
I can hear the flowers a-growin in the rubble of the towers.
I hear leaders quit their lying
I hear babies quit their crying.
I hear soldiers quit their dying, one and all." - OCMS
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 11:22 am Post subject: Re: Housing & Economic Collapse - In Progress - #2
smallpoxgirl wrote:
FDIC is intended to keep things working under more or less stable economic conditions. It is intended to indemnify depositors against bank failures that occur during normal economic conditions.
This it can do. That is better than nothing. FSCS is not funded to handle even one bank other than a minnow under any conditions. The only reason Northern Rock didn't blow a hole in it, was the government cutting out the middle man, making sure they got loans and eventually nationalising outright. We skipped the insurance stage altogether. Because it is not really there.
In a sense, it was a look at what the US may have to resort to once the FDIC vault is empty. The point I am making is, at least you have some way to go, we are already there. _________________ Volatility. When life isn't exciting enough.
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 12:29 pm Post subject: Re: Housing & Economic Collapse - In Progress - #2
Cloud9 wrote:
Greed tends to produce more than does a general warm fuzzy wish to promote the general welfare. Greed is what drags my sorry butt out of bed every morning and sends it to work. Name one item produced under communism that is not associated with a weapon’s system that improved the human condition.
you just think so because it's a dominant feature of your our culture.
what things have been produced by 'communism'? fire, the wheel, the bow... who knows how many crucial key inventions communal societies have given us from the past.
i am sure you want something more recent from some entity that describes itself as communist. well you were on the right track... satellites, men in space, contributions in mathematics, cosmology, etc.
if we fall off the olduvai cliff, then i don't see how capitalism will have given humankind any sort of net gain in anything. it will instead have been nothing more than the greatest short-sighted criminal enterprise in history.
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 12:39 pm Post subject: Re: Housing & Economic Collapse - In Progress - #2
Cloud9 wrote:
That was my point. Communism contributed little to advancing the human condition. Having said that; as I recall, the lift capacity of their rockets exceeds ours. Bigger payloads, bigger satellites. Bigger satellites more T.V channels.
I resisted the temptation to say that 100 million AK 47’s in circulation significantly advanced the bargaining position of the little people.
Actually the most basic and profound discoveries are usually made in an environment that is not "stressed" due to "war" (and that also means our "western way" of living where only the strong survive in capitalism).
It is true that during conflict humans tend to rally to a cause too (but then again, that IS a communal effort), which gave us for example Trinity and similar "discoveries".
There is a huge difference between Trade and the exchange of ideas and what we had in the West the last 30 or so years, the latter one is just as distructive as all out communism where nobody owns anything.
The answer lies in the mix.
And btw, Greed is never a good long term strategy, if all your trading partners feel that you screwed them they will stop trading with you. There is a good reason why Greed alone should not be your guding principle.
Last edited by Snowrunner on Sat Jul 12, 2008 12:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: Dec 27, 2004 Posts: 13124 Location: naive idiot fantasy world
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 12:41 pm Post subject: Re: Housing & Economic Collapse - In Progress - #2
nobodypanic wrote:
what things have been produced by 'communism'? fire, the wheel, the bow... who knows how many crucial key inventions communal societies have given us from the past.
Which definition of "communism" are you all talking about? You seem to be talking about very different things.
A totalitarian system of government is very different from an egalitarian community. _________________ "...powerdown so soft and fluffy you'll think you're living in a pillow." - jboogy
A totalitarian system of government is very different from an egalitarian community.
You seem to be talking about Marxist Lenninsm where as nobodypanic seems to be talking about a wider definition of communal ownership and responsibility.
Joined: Dec 27, 2004 Posts: 13124 Location: naive idiot fantasy world
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 1:47 pm Post subject: Re: Housing & Economic Collapse - In Progress - #2
dorlomin wrote:
You seem to be talking about Marxist Lenninsm where as nobodypanic seems to be talking about a wider definition of communal ownership and responsibility.
I'm not talking about either, personally. "A totalitarian system of government" and "an egalitarian community" are both definitions of the word "communism." That's why I was asking which one folks are talking about, because they are very different. _________________ "...powerdown so soft and fluffy you'll think you're living in a pillow." - jboogy
Posted: Sat Jul 12, 2008 2:36 pm Post subject: Re: Housing & Economic Collapse - In Progress - #2
By my count, Bloomberg TV talked about this news item 23 times on Friday and Saturday.
Quote:
Dow Chemical says it has agreed to buy specialty chemicals maker Rohm and Haas for $78 per share, or more than $15 billion. This is about a $35 a share premium to the closing price on Wednesday. Given the present economic uncertainties, it is difficult to envision a reason to pay this price. Financing for the $15 billion acquisition included a $3 billion equity investment by Berkshire Hathaway and $1 billion from the Kuwait Investment Authority, according to Dow Chemical. Debt financing has been committed by Citi, Merrill Lynch and Morgan Stanley, acting as financial advisors on the transaction.
This item was never mentioned as of 12:30 PM Saturday?
Quote:
IndyMac Bank's assets were seized by federal regulators on Friday after the mortgage lender succumbed to the pressures of tighter credit, tumbling home prices and rising foreclosures.The bank is the largest regulated thrift to fail and the second largest financial institution to close in U.S. history, regulators said.
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