Like the illusion of Wall Street, with its vast and powerful investment banks, now shuttered, China too is an illusion perpetuated by the Globalists that gave us the 15,000 mile Caesar salad, poisoned cat food and lead based paint on babies' pacifiers. Like the illusion that money would come from thin air to always push housing prices higher, China has spent a generation pursuing its illusion. Pursuing an unattainable dream to be like the West, while 6000 years of its carefully shepherded top soil blows into the sea.
Joined: Nov 25, 2006 Posts: 1543 Location: New Jersey
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 6:17 pm Post subject: Re: Greening the desert
Ludi wrote:
They were still using pumped irrigation, so it isn't really sustainable, just "more sustainable" than some other practices.
So aqueducts or pipelines of any kind are "unsustainable"? Who makes these rules & who's gonna be the one "post-peak" to tell people they're only allowed to use a small shovel & burn all their drip line? _________________ My PO Amazon store (shameless plug).
Joined: Mar 25, 2008 Posts: 890 Location: Alif Lam Mim
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 6:26 pm Post subject: Re: Greening the desert
Quote:
To a degree. Large areas of forest will often produce clouds with rain, so if you were able to reforest large areas of desertified land, it would possibly rain a bit more there. Areas which had good rainfall have gone dry because of removing the forests. Reforestation is a means known to reverse desertification, but it is a slow process.
It depends greatly on the area in which it's located as well. With local and regional geography and air dynamics playing significant roles, any evapotranspiration can either be pushed away from the intended area or it can remain in that area to a degree. The ME for example has really bad dynamics to allow for positive feedback while Texas, as I've been told in lectures by NASA scientists, can receive positive feedback (you put water into a "closed system" and it will largely stay in that system through evapotranspiration and then rainfall).
But I imagine if you went to a larger degree (many square miles), you'd be able to get a more self-sustaining process as one area would feed into another area and so on. _________________ Riches are not from abundance of worldly goods, but from a contented mind.
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 7:32 pm Post subject: Re: Greening the desert
Don't underestimate the albedo effect of the average desert. Greening it might be quite bad for the planet's climate.
So make sure that your greening effort produces enough highly reflective clouds that bounce back sunlight.
Else, please don't do it. We must use every patch of lightly colored earth intact. The disappearing albedo effect of the melting arctic sea ice is catastrophic enough already. So we must keep the deserts white and yellow to compensate.
On the other hand, the European Union and the African Union are building their 'Green Wall' across the Sahel.
Did you know?
Sunday, December 09, 2007
EU and Africa to build a 'Green Wall' across the Sahara
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 7:42 pm Post subject: Re: Greening the desert
3aidlillahi wrote:
Quote:
To a degree. Large areas of forest will often produce clouds with rain, so if you were able to reforest large areas of desertified land, it would possibly rain a bit more there. Areas which had good rainfall have gone dry because of removing the forests. Reforestation is a means known to reverse desertification, but it is a slow process.
It depends greatly on the area in which it's located as well. With local and regional geography and air dynamics playing significant roles, any evapotranspiration can either be pushed away from the intended area or it can remain in that area to a degree. The ME for example has really bad dynamics to allow for positive feedback while Texas, as I've been told in lectures by NASA scientists, can receive positive feedback (you put water into a "closed system" and it will largely stay in that system through evapotranspiration and then rainfall).
But I imagine if you went to a larger degree (many square miles), you'd be able to get a more self-sustaining process as one area would feed into another area and so on.
Would you by any chance know what the dynamics are like for the Australian outback?
Joined: Dec 27, 2004 Posts: 13191 Location: naive idiot fantasy world
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 8:37 pm Post subject: Re: Greening the desert
3aidlillahi wrote:
But I imagine if you went to a larger degree (many square miles), you'd be able to get a more self-sustaining process as one area would feed into another area and so on.
Yes, it really needs to be done on a large scale to work. If you do just a little patch in the middle of a desert, it's not going to do anything but shrivel up. _________________ "...powerdown so soft and fluffy you'll think you're living in a pillow." - jboogy
Joined: Dec 27, 2004 Posts: 13191 Location: naive idiot fantasy world
Posted: Wed Jul 16, 2008 8:40 pm Post subject: Re: Greening the desert
Narz wrote:
So aqueducts or pipelines of any kind are "unsustainable"? Who makes these rules & who's gonna be the one "post-peak" to tell people they're only allowed to use a small shovel & burn all their drip line?
I don't know if there's really a need to be a jerk about it, Mr. Rolleyes. If they're using unsustainable energy source to pump water from for instance a fossil aquifer or from desalination plants, it's probably not sustainable. There might be some sustainable aqueduct systems.
In my farking opinion. And I don't make the farking rules. _________________ "...powerdown so soft and fluffy you'll think you're living in a pillow." - jboogy
Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 10:47 am Post subject: Re: Greening the desert
I found a house with land and a 500 gallon per minute artesian free flowing well for sale in a high desert area know for potato and barley ....anyone interested? wish i could do it
Joined: Sep 03, 2005 Posts: 75 Location: Germany, State M-V
Posted: Thu Jul 17, 2008 11:18 am Post subject: Re: Greening the desert
I think it is about time to present the most radical weapon. There is quite a good solution to end the fight of man against nature once and for all. No more shelter for houses, cars, streets, fences. It all will be overwhelmed. Desert will only by a myth in about fifty years which the elder people will talk about. This weapon is called:
KUDZU ! ! !
Quote:
One of the truly outstanding candidates for rapidly greening the continents is the Kudzu vine. Since a single plant can grow 100 shoots, each 100 feet long, in one season, and is very difficult to eradicate, this explosively rampant vine is perhaps best described as biological dynamite, and is considered such by many. The Kudzu vine has overwhelmed abandoned cars, fences, tall trees and whole buildings in a veritable explosion of rampant growth.
It's a type of bean, so it can produce it's own fertilizer (nitrogen).
Some more stories of horror (care of your children!) :
Quote:
WANTED ....Kudzu seeds
I am wanting some Kudzu seeds. Anyone have any ?
__________________
Udderly Saanens Farm
....
Wow! We're usually trying to get rid of the stuff down here! Never heard of anyone who actually WANTED it....you do know that once it grows it becomes a civilization unto itself?
__________________
-Christina
...
You ARE kidding, right??? Nobody, but Nobody WANTS kudzu, also known as the "mile-a-minute" vine. That's because it grows a mile in a minute!!!! We had some in east Tn and dh sprayed it, burned it, dug it up, and started all over again the next spring, JUST to keep it from spreading further. It is to the earth, what mouse fleas were to the plagues. Your neighbors will never, ever, speak to you again, if they know you brought it there on purpose!!! So be forewarned!!!!
__________________
Pro Libertate!
...
PLEASE DO NOT PLANT OR ENCOURAGE THE PLANTING OF this frankenstein's monster of a plant!!! Kudzu is actually illegal to plant in many states - including here in Missouri where I live (a man was fined a hefty amount and threatened with jail time for allowing it to grow on his acreage near the town of Nixa a couple of years ago!)
This plant is not native and has no natural enemies to keep it in check. Whatever it's virtues (and I am sure like all things, it has a few) it is not worth the damage it is causing to the native flora of the south. This is the Gypsy Moth of the plant world! Don't plant it, please!!!
This plant is dangerous in populated regions, but in other areas it will suck all the CO2 there is. Cows and goats will go fat and nasty. They just can be transported to the butcher in a few months.
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