Don’t do a Sir Richard Mottram, the Permanent Secretary at the Department of Transport, who declared: 'We're all Fark. I'm Fark. You're Fark. The whole department's Fark. It's the biggest cock-up ever and we're all completely Fark.'’
Wildwell- That's the funniest thing you've ever posted. I can't stop laughing! hahahahahahahahahahaha _________________ remember-we don't inherit the earth from our parents, we lease it from our children
Posted: Fri Jun 03, 2005 8:00 pm Post subject: Re: Because you do want it to happen
hoplite wrote:
"The truth hurts"
--my father
"Peak Oilers", by and large seem to be a group of depressed, n'er do wells whom, for whatever reason have not succeeded (financially, personally, spiritually whatever) and feel they need a clean slate to make their mark. Total socio ecomic breakdown gives them that clean slate- or level playing field that they believe has been denied them...
Yeah, I have had quite a bit of failure and depression in my life, but the last year-and-a- half I have had a dramatic reversal of fortune and had things work out quite a bit better for me. I had quite a bit of hope for the future. Since I had some free time, and was having to make decisions about long-term investments, I started to look to see what was going on in the financial realm, real estate, etc... The more I looked into things, I was disturbed to say the least. Then, I read about peak oil, maybe unfortunately, maybe fortunately, through LATOC.net. It hit me like baseball hat to the head. Never having considered exactly how oil production works (damn I was ignorant), I had never even considered the idea of "peak" before, but the moment I read about the shape of the curve of production, I didn't need to read the rest to start to become quite concerned. However, I did read the rest, and it scared the crap out of me. Not to be insensitive to anybody that is ill, but it felt like I had been diagnosed with a terminal, fatal disease. It felt like my dreams had died. After researching, I feel that Matt might be kind of excessive on the doom and gloom, but I still don't think that downright catastrophic results are out of the realm of possiblity. I don't think PO will "level the playing field" or give me a new start in anything. If it is coming as soon as some predict (say right now!) then even knowing about it will do me absolutely no good as I am only a person of modest financial means. People who are strong and successful now will probably be able to find a way to prosper, whatever the definition of prosperity becomes, in future. One of my only motivations in telling people about peak oil is so that if and when we face hard times, they will understand the exact reason, and not go on a blaming and finger pointing spree that may ensue. That will only be a waste of time and effort, and we are going to need all the mental stamina we can muster to try to work towards a modified way of life, because it is clear to me that we won't be using energy in the same manner and scale in the future that we do now.
Joined: Dec 02, 2007 Posts: 135 Location: Winnipeg, MB, Canada
Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 2:58 pm Post subject: Re: Because you do want it to happen
hoplite wrote:
"The truth hurts"
--my father
"Peak Oilers", by and large seem to be a group of depressed, n'er do wells whom, for whatever reason have not succeeded (financially, personally, spiritually whatever) and feel they need a clean slate to make their mark. Total socio ecomic breakdown gives them that clean slate- or level playing field that they believe has been denied them...
I don't know about that one. I am financially successful (less than 4 years away from owning my home and it will be before I hit 40). I have been happily married for almost 10 years. I have a beautiful daughter who is happy and healthy. I have money in the bank and are debt free. I don't consider myself "zoned in" on the spiritual side however my moral and ethical compass points true north most of the time. (haven't offed anyone yet) My PO preps are going along "ok." I am not depressed.
However.....
....more than the majority of people in the world are not clued in to reality. They are mesmorized by their trinkets and consumption. No one give a sh-t about the world around them or even their neighbors. At 650a.m., the Walmart parking lot is already full. Don't these people have to get to work?
More than 70% of the people I meet in my daily life are either angry, stupid, ignorant, indifferent, and won't hesitate to tell you off if they even slightly are not getting their way. Just 3 hours ago in front of my store I saw someone almost get into a fist fight with a driver because he cut off a cyclist. Basicially, the world is full of retards, and they have the genetic reproductive advantage over me. (by sheer numbers)
You DEFINITELY don't have to be a Peaker or Doomer to wish a tidal wave will wipe these people away en-mass. However since our Community has seen the writing on the wall for the future, since at one time we were part of the unaware masses, we have a Looking Glass to see through as to how things may become, and that part of our old life sees a sense of vindication in knowing it's more likely the moron that told you off yesteday may be dead along with millions more when TSHTF. For the rest of the unknowing masses, they cannot put a face to their desires because they are ignorant.
Do I want "it" to happen, of course no. But history itself proves the most effective way to "start anew" usually is preceeded by a major global disaster. (war, disease, natural disaster)
Will the end of this society and the beginning of another by the very things set in motion by all of us be any different?
I don't need a clean slate to make my mark. I'll have made it before then, which is why I'll survive and people who don't make their mark won't.
Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:01 pm Post subject: Re: You Want it to Happen!
Ludi wrote:
Hw do you respond to people who say you "want it to happen" just because you believe PO is a fact?
Personally, it makes me want to cry....
I tell them they are correct. I do want it to happen. I want billions to die. I want to watch the distended bellies of dying third world children while I enjoy hot buttered popcorn.
Joined: Dec 18, 2004 Posts: 4467 Location: One Mile From the Columbia River
Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 3:05 pm Post subject: Re: You Want it to Happen!
Jack wrote:
Ludi wrote:
Hw do you respond to people who say you "want it to happen" just because you believe PO is a fact?
Personally, it makes me want to cry....
I tell them they are correct. I do want it to happen. I want billions to die. I want to watch the distended bellies of dying third world children while I enjoy hot buttered popcorn.
There will be no censorship when this boat arrives. It will be a complete freedom lovers paradise, that's for sure. No more rules at all. Except within a couple of hundred meters of my scope and that one rule will be GET OUT! _________________ Got Dharma?
Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 4:54 pm Post subject: Re: You Want it to Happen!
I think a lot of people have an unresolved existential angst regarding modern life. This curious, trapped sort of depression is not new -- it was an issue during Victorian times as well.
For an interesting read, google "How to live your life in 24 hours." You should be able to track down an e-text of a self-help book written in either the late 1800s or early 1900s (can't remember).
The book deals with the problem of finding contentment in the modern world. The author describes a world where for the first time, people confront deep sadness in the everyday routine of hopping a train and pushing papers around at a desk all day. He calls this new class of men the "salarymen." Today, the terms du jour are "wage slave" and "cube farms."
He points out how much unhappier they tend to be than the old-fashioned, real craftsmen -- that is, men who build things from start to finish and have a sense of control over and pride in their work. The author's advice to combating the trapped feeling of living a regimented, by the clock modern existence lies within the book's title.
He suggests that no matter how busy the modern person is, they can find a little time on a regular basis for reading, intellectual stimulation, or some kind of craftsmen-like hobby.
The book is a fascinating read, if only for the realization that the "modern" malaise has been with us for quite some time. In today's society, unlike the times the author wrote in, we have added a large layer of seeking happiness-through-consumerism into this mix. And when we've bought our last trinket, and it fails to please -- well, we've got a slew of psychotropic drugs to run through, don't we?
Now, to bring this back to the issue of those who seem to wish "Mad Max" to come true. I think a lot of these people are going through this modern, existential angst themselves. In the past, a lot of these men would have found new adventure and challenge by heading forever West. As Westerners, the discontent among us have been heading West for 400 odd years now.
Well the West has now been won, and if the adventurous man heads West he'll just find the same old Walmarts, the same old McDonalds, the same old disconnected robotic work, the same old subdivisions with names that could do double duty with old age homes: "Whispering Pines," "Woodhaven," etc. etc. etc... we name our communities with words which mean absolutely nothing to us at all, and we live in homes which are architecturally uninspiring.
The upshot to all this is a fact that we all know -- if adventure is what one wants, it is still out there to be found. The community one lives in does not need to collapse for you to find challenge and meaning in your life -- but, yes, you may just have to strike out and take the risk of finding that change for yourself.
And that's the rub. By the time this existential angst overwhelms a man, he is very likely in his middle age, where a growing sense of caution (not to mention familial responsibilities) tends to preclude the risk-taking that real change requires.
The man who feels too trapped yet understandably too cautious to seek change -- it is this sort of man who subconsciously wishes for change to come to him, and thereby force his hand.
Joined: May 20, 2008 Posts: 316 Location: Tennessee
Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:31 pm Post subject: Re: You Want it to Happen!
hoplite hasn't been hanging out on the Christian perspective thread on Peak Oil. I don't want bad things to happen to anyone. I do believe that alot of the mainstays of this web site are not a bunch of "depressed" doomer failures of society, but people who are willing not to live in our society's fake little bubbles, but are trying to deal with the reality of the world around us. Most of you guys are a hoot and I enjoy reading and learning here!
Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:16 am Post subject: Re: You Want it to Happen!
First, someone discovers Peak Oil, and makes the incredibly unlikely step of realizing what a massive event it will be.
They then think 'wow everyone needs to know about this', so society can make changes now to prevent it being a monumental disaster.
Then over the course of 2 -3 years they become disillusioned with society's lack of response, or ability to even understand the issue.
At this point, the person often gets bitter at society, and concludes that they f**king deserve the worst case scenario, as it looks more and more likely.
And then they start to look forward to it, and wanting it to happen.
So the 'wanting it to happen' is a state of mind that evolves as a person becomes aware of the truth: the society they live in sucks ass. Sure life is (excessively) comfortable, but thats all its got going for it.
Face it, the countries us westerners live in are totally unsustainable in their current form. If you want to ENJOY peak oil, start to see it as a natural process, and something totally and utterly deserved. Learn to laugh at the suffering of fools, people who don't insist on having their wisest people as their leaders, instead choosing clueless clowns, like themselves.
As I grew older, I recognized all these dreams of guns and survival and conquest and escape for the adolescent fantasies they were. But that doesn't mean that they entirely lost their hold on me. Indeed, in some odd way, the more I found out about how barely the world was held together, the more deeply some part of myself cherished the idea that I could insulate myself emotionally from all of this because, I, at least, was a survivor.
And sitting there by the slack and dirty water, I had one of those moments of scorching self-vision. I realized that I'd been hiding underneath the skirts of the apocalypse for decades now. I'd daydreamed disasters as a way of not wanting too much, not caring too much; keeping safe from the fear too much knowledge of current events tends to tattoo on your brain.
But real apocalypses are sordid, banal, insane. If things do come unraveled, they present not a golden opportunity for lone wolves and well-armed geeks, but a reality of babies with diarrhea, of bugs and weird weather and dust everywhere, of never enough to eat, of famine and starving, hollow-eyed people, of drunken soldiers full of boredom and self-hate, of random murder and rape and wars which accomplish nothing, of many fine things lost for no reason and nothing of any value gained.
Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:10 pm Post subject: Re: You Want it to Happen!
Jack wrote:
Ludi wrote:
Hw do you respond to people who say you "want it to happen" just because you believe PO is a fact?
Personally, it makes me want to cry....
I tell them they are correct. I do want it to happen. I want billions to die. I want to watch the distended bellies of dying third world children while I enjoy hot buttered popcorn.
You should really have your moderator status revoked.
Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 9:26 pm Post subject: Re: You Want it to Happen!
There's a gas station I pass on a daily basis - today regular unleaded gas was $4.35. I can look about a mile up the road and see E-85 for $3.99, and sometimes I do the math in my head trying to decide if the cheaper stuff is worth the hit I'll take in gas milage to fill up that day. I have a lot of time to think about it - usually I'm stuck in traffic there in my tiny car. Crammed between SUVs and trucks, it's hard to see the signs. Sometimes I have to wait a while for one SUV to move just right so the gaps line up. On the radio some talking head blabs about 0% financing on new trucks, and how the real-estate market is "highly localized" and this is "a great time to buy."
Sometimes I have to admit that I find myself wishing the price would ratchet up a little quicker so people would "get it."
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