Like the illusion of Wall Street, with its vast and powerful investment banks, now shuttered, China too is an illusion perpetuated by the Globalists that gave us the 15,000 mile Caesar salad, poisoned cat food and lead based paint on babies' pacifiers. Like the illusion that money would come from thin air to always push housing prices higher, China has spent a generation pursuing its illusion. Pursuing an unattainable dream to be like the West, while 6000 years of its carefully shepherded top soil blows into the sea.
Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:25 am Post subject: 6 billion too many
Amazing to read all about how to reduce global warming, people wringing hands, much discussion and scratching of heads. Look at the facts:
1. 6 billion+ people on the planet, many wanting all the plastic gadgets/toys/trash etc swilling around in the west at the moment.
2. Greedy Entrepreneurs will ensure the above, weak politicians not stopping them.
3. 6 billion with appetites for anything and everything and, therefore, backsides producing methane to match.
enjoy the ride whilst you can everyone, as we are all doomed; we are just slightly unsure of the exact timing of our demise. shame about the rest of God's creatures though, nothing deserved us.
Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 10:42 am Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
yep, yep, and yep.
I do take exception to your statement that "we are ALL doomed" however. Many of the people who participate here are determined to beat the odds. Learn from us and you may too.
Welcome to the forum. _________________ "The future power is manpower"
Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 11:03 am Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
arkwriter wrote:
Amazing to read all about how to reduce global warming, people wringing hands, much discussion and scratching of heads. Look at the facts:
1. 6 billion+ people on the planet, many wanting all the plastic gadgets/toys/trash etc swilling around in the west at the moment.
2. Greedy Entrepreneurs will ensure the above, weak politicians not stopping them.
3. 6 billion with appetites for anything and everything and, therefore, backsides producing methane to match.
enjoy the ride whilst you can everyone, as we are all doomed; we are just slightly unsure of the exact timing of our demise. shame about the rest of God's creatures though, nothing deserved us
Agree on all counts save G-d's other creatures. Screw them.
They'd have done no different if they had had the means. _________________ Massive Human Dieoff must occur as a result of Peak Oil. Many more than half will die. It will occur everywhere, including where you live. If you fail to recognize this, then your odds of living move toward the "going to die" group.
Joined: Jul 02, 2008 Posts: 595 Location: Canterbury, UK
Posted: Mon Aug 18, 2008 11:08 am Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
arkwriter, welcome aboard.
What have you done recently to ensure your impact upon planet Earth, and all of God's creatures, diminishes? It's not a rhetorical question - there are plenty of "what have you done since you found PO" threads around here. Have a bit of faith - if that's you cup of tea - on people too, will you? _________________ Environmental News and Clippings:
http://www.google.co.uk/reader/shared/10279555364898696533
Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 11:49 pm Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
Cashmere wrote:
They'd have done no different if they had had the means.
I don't know if that's true. The behavior that got us to this point seems to be a one-in-a-million social anomaly.
Its learned behavior, not inherent. Most people who haven't learned it or were taught differently have trouble even understanding it.
Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 11:52 pm Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
You're absolutely right, Kvel. If you look at behavioral theory to blame it is a lot about learning. Perhaps conditioning will take care of our problem, eh?
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 2:12 am Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
Kristen wrote:
You're absolutely right, Kvel. If you look at behavioral theory to blame it is a lot about learning. Perhaps conditioning will take care of our problem, eh?
The behavior itself tends to involve being very narrow minded. It's extremely ethnocentric, and doesn't allow for anything 'outside'.
It's well ingrained over hundreds or even thousands of years in many cultures, so many people assume "that's just how it is". They can't see outside the bubble.
Reconditioning is definitely something to look at, but I don't think it's going to get through to most people, and it will take a long time to make such a major change.
Joined: May 27, 2007 Posts: 1769 Location: The Post Peak Oil Historian
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 4:52 am Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
Arkwriter, You can see Cashmere has never learned the lesson about first impressions. But this one is correct. He believes the free market should be free to destroy the planet as long as it's profitable monitarily.
This Ferengi mentallity might work if we had warp capable starships and other civilized planets to live on.
Since we don't he seems to have this mental block which prevents him from seeing his perspective results in him fraking himself along with the entire planet.
Yeah, that's it. Let's fill the planet with sewage and live in it. _________________ In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - George Orwell
It riles them to believe that you perceive the webs they weave. - Moody Blues
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 1:43 pm Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
Cid_Yama wrote:
Arkwriter, You can see Cashmere has never learned the lesson about first impressions. But this one is correct. He believes the free market should be free to destroy the planet as long as it's profitable monitarily.
This Ferengi mentallity might work if we had warp capable starships and other civilized planets to live on.
Since we don't he seems to have this mental block which prevents him from seeing his perspective results in him fraking himself along with the entire planet.
Yeah, that's it. Let's fill the planet with sewage and live in it.
So who gets to decide allocation of scarce resources?
Joined: Jul 02, 2008 Posts: 595 Location: Canterbury, UK
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 2:32 pm Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
Kveldulf wrote:
Kristen wrote:
You're absolutely right, Kvel. If you look at behavioral theory to blame it is a lot about learning. Perhaps conditioning will take care of our problem, eh?
The behavior itself tends to involve being very narrow minded. It's extremely ethnocentric, and doesn't allow for anything 'outside'.
It's well ingrained over hundreds or even thousands of years in many cultures, so many people assume "that's just how it is". They can't see outside the bubble.
Reconditioning is definitely something to look at, but I don't think it's going to get through to most people, and it will take a long time to make such a major change.
A couple of years ago I graduated in Psychology, so I know a couple of things about behavioural methods. The first (technical) thing you need to know is that the carrot (reward) is mightier than the stick (punishment) - and I can't see you getting enough juicy carrots for everyone. The second thing is that behavioural "black box" methods work while there's the expectation of reward. The third is that their scope of changeable behavioural is a bit limited, no matter what Skinner says.
I suggest a night at the movies: A Clockwork Orange, by Kubrik, will set you off. Drop the popcorn, you won't eat them. And then, a bit of 1984 and Atlas Shrugged, just to show what a totalitarian, bent on "re-education" and violent state can do for you and the environment. _________________ Environmental News and Clippings:
http://www.google.co.uk/reader/shared/10279555364898696533
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 2:46 pm Post subject: Re: 6 billion too many
Well the rise in price at the pump would be the punishment of driving as the behavior. People drive less so the price goes down (reward). I know two sentences isn't enough to explain something so complex.
Joined: Sep 29, 2004 Posts: 2330 Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 3:12 pm Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
CarlosFerreira wrote:
Kveldulf wrote:
Kristen wrote:
You're absolutely right, Kvel. If you look at behavioral theory to blame it is a lot about learning. Perhaps conditioning will take care of our problem, eh?
The behavior itself tends to involve being very narrow minded. It's extremely ethnocentric, and doesn't allow for anything 'outside'.
It's well ingrained over hundreds or even thousands of years in many cultures, so many people assume "that's just how it is". They can't see outside the bubble.
Reconditioning is definitely something to look at, but I don't think it's going to get through to most people, and it will take a long time to make such a major change.
A couple of years ago I graduated in Psychology, so I know a couple of things about behavioural methods. The first (technical) thing you need to know is that the carrot (reward) is mightier than the stick (punishment) - and I can't see you getting enough juicy carrots for everyone. The second thing is that behavioural "black box" methods work while there's the expectation of reward. The third is that their scope of changeable behavioural is a bit limited, no matter what Skinner says.
I suggest a night at the movies: A Clockwork Orange, by Kubrik, will set you off. Drop the popcorn, you won't eat them. And then, a bit of 1984 and Atlas Shrugged, just to show what a totalitarian, bent on "re-education" and violent state can do for you and the environment.
Well spoken; you should post more often.
The carrot is mighty; the Romans knew that well. They spared no expense in entertaining as well as demonstrating their power in the arena. The great unwashed masses are always the biggest threat to the power brokers for the simple reason that the power is, and always has been, with the people. Like the founding fathers of the USA pondered, the question always is this; can the masses handle the truth? The Utopian idea of self imposed rule of law is always an arms reach away. People are so incredibly easy to scare, however; the temptation is generally to great for those at the top to continue maintaining illusions and building grander illusions. Those at the very top understand very well something that is hidden, even occult, to the general population; belief is EVERYTHING. They are reality salesmen and the ones with the best dog and pony shows win out over the others. The masses are both the actors on stage and the audience, though the actors are generally a little more aware than the crowd.
We are at a crossroads with our planet now. The way it looks at this time is that she will impose her natural law on us because we don't seem to be getting our act together. Who knows? I feel that the self imposed prison of fear the general population keeps themselves in is unraveling. That fear takes many forms depending on where you live and what position on the social ladder you are. For some it is the fear of losing what they have - their positions, their "power." For others, it is the fear of the great illusionary boggy men lurking out there waiting to strike when the limitations of personal freedom are lifted.
Population control must be a voluntary choice otherwise it will no doubt be involuntary. Mindlessly bringing babies into the world with no means of support is the greatest problem mankind has right now. Perhaps this is because for most of our existence, the majority of children died before reaching adulthood. As Einstein once said "problems can't be solved with the ways of thinking that created them." _________________ "That's the problem with mercy, kid... It just ain't professional" - Fast Eddie, The Color of Money
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 5:44 pm Post subject: Re: 6 billion too many
Only 6 billion people on the planet but it feels like 12 billion people R trying to cram into Calif*. _________________ People first, then things, then dollars.
There will be enslavement, cannibalism, & zombie invasions.
Posted: Thu Aug 21, 2008 8:12 pm Post subject: Re: 6 billion to many
CarlosFerreira wrote:
I suggest a night at the movies: A Clockwork Orange, by Kubrik, will set you off. Drop the popcorn, you won't eat them. And then, a bit of 1984 and Atlas Shrugged, just to show what a totalitarian, bent on "re-education" and violent state can do for you and the environment.
I'm well aware of the dangers of "re-education" controlled by the 'powers that be'. I was more so pointing out that we aren't inherently self destructive.
By "reconditioning" I was talking about on a personal level. People look at what they're doing, and how they are thinking and try to change it.
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