Like the illusion of Wall Street, with its vast and powerful investment banks, now shuttered, China too is an illusion perpetuated by the Globalists that gave us the 15,000 mile Caesar salad, poisoned cat food and lead based paint on babies' pacifiers. Like the illusion that money would come from thin air to always push housing prices higher, China has spent a generation pursuing its illusion. Pursuing an unattainable dream to be like the West, while 6000 years of its carefully shepherded top soil blows into the sea.
Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 1:35 pm Post subject: Re: Klein/Brown's/HHO Gas
JRP3 wrote:
I can certainly understand how almost dying could get one stirred up, no need to apologize. While I appreciate the offer of a free trip with a cash bonus all I'd really like to see is a true independent third party test of the system. When someone on the internet claims to be able to double the gas mileage of their vehicle I don't automatically believe their claims.
Your description of the possible mechanism of action of your setup is somewhat reasonable, however I don't think mixing gases together in any manner actually
Quote:
causes the tiny atoms of hydrogen to 'break' up the molecular valence bond or chain of molecules of the gasoline
I'd like to see some credible science to back that statement up.
I am with you 100% on that one. I would love to have an actual explanation of what is really happening. I have wondered too if the water vapor that is being sucked into the engine might also be contributing to the better fuel economy. I do replace water more often than the systems with the wire in the mason jar (pet rock) technology.
Some people have asked how much HHO my system is producing. I have no way of making an intelligent measurement of the output. I suppose if you do what the mason jar people do and let it bubble up into a water filled liter jar until it is void of water as a reference then that could show what kind of output on a comparison. I have one of the 'wire in a jar' device and it gives a slow bubble like a 'baby fart in a tub' and I can't imagine how that could improve anything.
On my tank, I use a half inch reinforced tube (from Lowes) and when I tested it into a bucket of water it appeared as if the bucket was 'boiling'. I made the stupid mistake of lighting a bubble to see it pop like they show on YouTube and I wound up getting just about the whole bucket splattered all over me. That would have made a great video. I was soaked.
I used a one liter bottle filled with water, inverted in the bucket and I stuck the tube up into the inverted bottle. we turned on the system and timed it. One time it took about 6 seconds. another time about 12 seconds. I really never got any consistent measurements. Letting it run for a long period of time and testing occasionally I got readings anywhere from 35 seconds to fill it down to the 6 seconds best time.
so how much gas? I can't really say. But I know for some reason it works for me.
Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 11:35 am Post subject: Re: Klein/Brown's/HHO Gas
Hydrogen injection works because it greatly increases the speed of combustion. It has nothing to do with the added energy or BTU's. Because hydrogen ignites easier and burns many times faster than gasoline, when added to the combustion chamber it causes the gasoline to ignite faster and burn completely. Without hydrogen injection gasoline is ignited by the sparkplug about 10 degrees before the beginning of the combustion stroke and is still burning when the piston reaches the bottom of the combustion stroke. The remaining unburnt fuel is then sent through the exhaust to the EGR system to be recycled or to the catalytic converter to be reburnt (wasted). With hydrogen injection the combustion starts much faster, this is why you need to retard your initial timing when using it. When the hydrogen is ignited it burns very fast and in turn ignites the gasoline from all sides at once. The pressure wave created by the combution has a shorter duration pulse and is more energetic because of this faster complete burn. Since the all of the energy is released when the piston is near the top of the combustion stroke more energy is absorbed by the piston and captured as work energy. Less energy is lost as heat in the exhaust. There is no unburnt fuel so EGR systems and catalytic converters are not needed. This is why when adding a hydrogen injection system you notice more power and you need less pedal to get the same results.
The truly sad thing is that JPL and NASA did major studies back in the '70s that revealed this process. This information was available to the EPA, congress and the auto industry but instead we got catalytic converters and laws the prohibit the modification of exhaust or smog systems even if the modification reduces emissions and increases milage. Inovation has been stiffled ever since.
Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 1:51 pm Post subject: Re: Klein/Brown's/HHO Gas
That's fine but you may want to recopy, I just fixed a spelling error and some grammer. If you want some very good information about hydrogen injection, fuel reforming and other fuel saving systems. I suggest you visit the Panacea University website at http://www.panaceauniversity.org/
Posted: Sat Aug 30, 2008 4:13 pm Post subject: Re: Klein/Brown's/HHO Gas
bbloise
After visiting your website, I have to commend you. You are not just doing hydrogen injection you are using the hydrogen and oxygen gas from your electrolysis unit to reform the gasoline prior to being sent to combustion chamber. I wish I could use that process on my vehicle. By bubbling the HHO gas through the fuel it is being chemically enhanced. The process of on-board fuel reforming is another process that has been around for many years and can also be used to reform other lower quality fuels into a usable form. Most of the reformers that are in current use are using the waste heat from the engine exhaust to inhance the process.
Since the 60's the auto industry has bought hundreds of patents for fuel reforming systems but has yet to produce a single commercially available unit. Like with hydrogen injection systems we have to make it ourselves. For more information about fuel reforming do a web search for fuel reforming, steam reforming, or GEET.
I hope your incident will not stop your experimenting, you are on to something very important.
Posted: Sun Aug 31, 2008 10:36 am Post subject: Re: Klein/Brown's/HHO Gas
RMForbes wrote:
bbloise
After visiting your website, I have to commend ...snip...snip...I hope your incident will not stop your experimenting, you are on to something very important.
thanks... I WILL continue to experiment. One thing I learned in the military is that you NEVER stop fighting.
I appreciate the links and information, that will be very useful. I am looking into performing the same thing on my Jeep GC, however, the fuel pump is in the fuel tank and runs at approximately 65 psi. I need to crack some books and study fluid dynamics to figure a way to SAFELY inject the HHO directly into the fuel flow. I wouldn't want to create a bomb out of my vehicle.
Posted: Sun Aug 31, 2008 1:41 pm Post subject: Re: Klein/Brown's/HHO Gas
I am struggling with the same problem. On fuel injection motors liquid fuel is injected directly into the intake manifold (throttle body) or into each cylinder (multi-point). To accomplish our goal it would require some fairly sophisticated engineering skills. Reformed fuel is mostly gasous, with the fuel already fully atomized. I don't see a way of using the reformed fuel without changing to LPG carberation equipment. There is no off the shelf equipment available for my car because I do not believe that my motor was ever available in a LPG fuel version. I would need to modify six LPG injectors and then create a electronic module that would translate the signal from the exsisting ECU to control these modified injectors. I'm sure this is posible but requires more resources than I have.
I have a '71 Chev Van with a 5.7 liter engine that I use for experimenting. It's much easier to experiment on these older carberated vehicles. I have been working on a pulsed resonance electrolysis unit for the van that would produce at least six liters of HHO gas per minute. But I am starting to rethink my approach, I may use a smaller brute force electrolysis unit like I have on my fuel injected car with a fuel reforming system instead.
What is the status of the Porcshe? Is it completely totaled or can it be repaired?
Posted: Sun Aug 31, 2008 2:30 pm Post subject: Re: Klein/Brown's/HHO Gas
RMForbes wrote:
What is the status of the Porcshe? Is it completely totaled or can it be repaired?
yes, I was contacted by the president of Automobile Atlanta and he stated that from the pictures, it looks very repairable. I, of course, will probably need tol find some kind of work to make up the costs that will be needed to rebuild. I am a disabled viet nam veteran and age discrimination is alive and well in the job market.
I hold a degree in Electronics Engineering, I hold the highest commercial FCC license and I am a state certified instructor of electronics. For the past 15 years I have worked as a network engineer. I am cisco certified and also an EC-Council CEH. Long story, but I had an ISP business and accepted a politician for a partner. I wound up losing everything. Health problems from being exposed to agent orange in viet nam makes it difficult for me to work. But I will find something to do if it means sweeping floors or greeting people at Walmart to make the repairs.
Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 10:11 am Post subject: Re: Klein/Brown's/HHO Gas
HHOking- Promoting a website does not make one serious about anything. If you are serious about reducing dependence on foreign oil, then share your experiences, designs, successes, and failures with us on the forum. Check out the multitude of forums where we are already sharing and join us. We don't need any more sales pitches.
Posted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 9:17 pm Post subject: Re: Klein/Brown's/HHO Gas
RMForbes wrote:
HHOking- Promoting a website does not make one serious about anything. If you are serious about reducing dependence on foreign oil, then share your experiences, designs, successes, and failures with us on the forum. Check out the multitude of forums where we are already sharing and join us. We don't need any more sales pitches.
I agree with you. Keep an eye on my website, I will be posting my test results and a complete set of plans of how to build the system that I use. My project for now is to develop a way to inject the hydrogen directly into the fuel delivery system of the fuel injection system and to inject the oxygen portion of the generator into the air intake. My website is http://www.bloisetek.com/
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all I'd really like to see is a true independent third party test of the system. When someone on the internet claims to be able to double the gas mileage of their vehicle I don't automatically believe their claims.
I was soaked.
Health problems from being exposed to agent orange in viet nam makes it difficult for me to work. But I will find something to do if it means sweeping floors or greeting people at Walmart to make the repairs.
