Oil's energy contribution has declined by about 12% since 1999. The world's economies have also declined by about 12%. (Using conventional metrics, which are time delayed determinations, this will only be seen in hind sight). The massive destruction of asset values now occurring testifies to it happening.
Peak is well behind us, world economies have peaked and will continue to decline.
Posted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 10:31 am Post subject: Re: Bulk food storage options.
This is a silly question, but I'm going to ask anyway. How do you know if rolled oats have gone bad? Is it only if they're moldy or can something else go wrong with them?
This is a silly question, but I'm going to ask anyway. How do you know if rolled oats have gone bad? Is it only if they're moldy or can something else go wrong with them?
I've never heard of them going bad -- they're steamed so technically they're already cooked. Maybe they might go rancid? I don't know. Or bugs/rats could get in them, I guess, if they weren't packaged right.
This is a silly question, but I'm going to ask anyway. How do you know if rolled oats have gone bad? Is it only if they're moldy or can something else go wrong with them?
Rolled oats last a year or two. But I stock whole oats and roll my own as needed.
Yes, over long time they can go rancid or stale some. But, I've never had bad ones, just slightly stale rolled oats.
BTW. Rolled oats cook in 4 or 5 minutes. whole oats take an hour to cook. Angel hair cooks in 2 minutes. Linguine takes 24 minutes.
Oats, or any grain, can get bug infested. The more or less standard answer for that is to gas 'em when you store the grain with some inert gas, be it nitrogen, CO2 (can use dry ice), or in my case, MiG welding gas, which is 75% Argon and 25% CO2. The idea is to eliminate the oxygen and nothing can live in it. I've stored corn, whole oats that way for over 5 years, and wheat for 25 years with no problem whatsoever. NOT rolled oats, however. the grain being cooked by steam and smashed open will have some effect, so I wouldn't go over a year without checking it out.
Afterthoughts: Grain for animal feed is commonly stored in bulk, in simple metal bins. The grain storage elevators douse the stuff with Malathion (did 20 years ago-maybe they use something else now), but farmers just take a bit of loss from mice and bugs, and feed it any way. For people food, I'd want to do better. We use metal barrels with a gasketted lid, and gas it. Pails are fine for smaller quantities, but the stuff is cheap off the farm, so we buy in bulk, and plan to have enough to feed the chickens for a year or more ahead. FWIW, chickens and rabbits store nicely "on the hoof", and provide a few meals worth of meat with no refrigeration needed. That's why all old farmers kept chickens! Well, they liked eggs, too. _________________ Local fix-it guy..
I believe that today's farmer uses cyanide tablets in his grain bin. Drop a couple in and shut the door, they start to dissolve and make gas in a few mintues and kill all the bugs in your grain. Put some in every month or so and you are good to go.
Allenwrench, I just happen to have been looking for food storage containers. Where do you get yours? I perused my local giant supermarket but didn't see any food storage containers in their kitchen section. Wish I knew ceramics---I'd just make my own....
I have started putting food in pails myself, but I have taken a different route. I actually found it here, but I can't seem to locate the link.
1. Don't use any pail that can receive any kind of light. Artificial, natural, etc. Has to be completely non-transparent. I use standard Home Depot/Rona pails. Five bucks for pail and lid. They have to have the rubber gasket. As long as they have the #6 on the bottom for the recycle symbol, food storage is ok.
2. Rubber gasket is key for making the contents AIR TIGHT. This is your FIRST line of defense. Air=evil. Air assists insects, molds, and other bacteria already present in the food (rice, flour, etc.) to possibly propagate.
3. Mylar bags are an absolute must. This is the 2nd line of defense in keeping your food eatable for many years to come. Lack of Mylar bags takes away as much as 80% shelf life. When sealing the bags, make sure as much air is out of the bag before sealing it.
4. Desiccant pouches. This is your FINAL line of defense. You literally place these things in the middle of the food product you're preparing. Only buy the food grade ones. Once they are in and the bag is sealed, the desiccant sucks all of the oxygen out of the bag, which reduces the possibility of any bugs, bacteria, or mold almost to zero.
When all is said and done, desiccant, Mylar bags, and non-transparent buckets with rubber gaskets is the only sure fire combination to insure your food gets maximum storage time. For example, rice stored this way (white, not brown) will have a shelf life of 20+ years. Powdered milk - 10+ years. Etc.
Average cost per setup (bucket, desiccant, Mylar bag) should cost no more than $9.00.
The Deli/Bakery section of my local supermarket sells excess buckets and lids for $1 (for the bucket and the lid). Now with a mylar bag and oxygen absorbers I can, not counting the contents cost, put up food for under $2 per bucket.
The buckets that my local supermarket sells are 4 gallon one and they are #2 HDPE with gasket lids. If I buy wheat/corn from the local farm supply I can pack a 4 gallon bucket for under $4 I believe.
Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 9:46 am Post subject: Re: Bulk food storage options.
I found mylar bags at walmart for 1.49 each. It will hold 30 gallons and I am getting ready to put my food in it. This weekend I plan to go to home depot and get buckets.
Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 10:09 am Post subject: Re: Bulk food storage options.
ki11ercane wrote:
4. Desiccant pouches. This is your FINAL line of defense. You literally place these things in the middle of the food product you're preparing. Only buy the food grade ones. Once they are in and the bag is sealed, the desiccant sucks all of the oxygen out of the bag, which reduces the possibility of any bugs, bacteria, or mold almost to zero.
Just a terminology thing. What you're describing is an oxygen absorber, not a desiccant. Desiccants absorb water not oxygen. I personally would want to include a desiccant packet with my food also, but it seems like most people don't. _________________ "We were standing on the edges
Of a thousand burning bridges
Sifting through the ashes every day
What we thought would never end
Now is nothing more than a memory
The way things were before
I lost my way" - OCMS
Posted: Mon Oct 13, 2008 8:05 pm Post subject: Re: Bulk food storage options.
I got my little bucket setup going today. Starting small, I got 4 food grade buckets with lids, ten gallon type. I will eat and refill one bucket every three months therby rotating the stock. I will probably add more buckets later.
I bought 60lbs of white rice (3-20lbs bags- $12.88 each)
I filled Ziplock gallon freezer bags- about 8 bags - then filled the rest of the buckets up with bags of assorted dried beans and dried spaggetti
I'll watch for bugs and items won't stay more then a year without being rotated out.
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