Oil's energy contribution has declined by about 12% since 1999. The world's economies have also declined by about 12%. (Using conventional metrics, which are time delayed determinations, this will only be seen in hind sight). The massive destruction of asset values now occurring testifies to it happening.
Peak is well behind us, world economies have peaked and will continue to decline.
Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:31 pm Post subject: Re: North American Fuel Shortage Reports
"I noticed in another thread the mention of nashville being supplied by BARGES up the tenn river perhaps?
Nashville is on the Cumberland River. The Cumberland and Tennessee Rivers join together near Paducah, KY and they flow into the Ohio River which, in turn, flows into the Mississippi. It's common for large barges to supply liquid fuel to Tennessee from the Gulf via barges up the Mississippi River - going upstream the whole way. TVA gets almost of all its diesel (#2 distillate) for gas turbine fuel and coal plant light-off this way, though I don't know how much gasoline normally takes this watery route.
Posted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:51 pm Post subject: Re: North American Fuel Shortage Reports
Quote:
I noticed in another thread the mention of nashville being supplied by BARGES up the tenn river perhaps?
This is the case from time to time (also true in the Saint Louis metro, etc). That fact is not really germane to the current problem.
It's not that the pipelines aren't functional, with minor complaints. They're okay. Waiting for something in them.
It's that there's insufficient gasoline/distillates going in the other end. Switching to trucks, railcars, barges, or bike messengers, isn't going to fix that.
Now, if we start getting massive finished product shipments from Europe (or wherever), import of that may be impacted by local issues around the Houston Ship Channel. Then, we may have to look into alternative temporary shipping routes.
With an actual supply disruption, solving a localized outage is just going to be whack-a-mole unless there is major pressure for widespread demand destruction. _________________ At 1% annual growth, human bodies will incorporate every gram in the observable universe in approximately 10,170 years.
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 5:56 am Post subject: Re: North American Fuel Shortage Reports
I don't know why an Oklahoma talk radio site is the first to report gas shortages in D.C. but here it is.
Quote:
Hurricanes Ike and Gustav left behind an ugly mess in the form of continuing fuel shortages. Washington, DC is the latest area hit as yellow tape covers many gas pumps. Meanwhile, things have gotten so bad in Atlanta, Georgia, drivers have been following tanker trucks to service stations and camping out next to the pumps. The hurricanes hit hard at Gulf oil platforms and Texas refineries, which have been slow to get back up to full capacity. The problem worsened as anxious motorists topped off their tanks.
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 6:40 am Post subject: Re: North American Fuel Shortage Reports
Speaking of Atlanta, have we heard from Airline_Pilot on this one? I'm hearing some distillate problems, but I assume, from the lack of general media panic, that JetA supply hasn't been a problem at Hartsfeld.
However, for the thousands of random sods: pilots, baggage handlers, TSA, etc, I imagine that personal gasoline shortages are a problem. Good start that ATL is on MARTA, for some. _________________ At 1% annual growth, human bodies will incorporate every gram in the observable universe in approximately 10,170 years.
Joined: Apr 05, 2005 Posts: 2618 Location: South of Atlanta
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 10:22 am Post subject: Re: North American Fuel Shortage Reports
I havent checked my usual sources for the Jet A situation. The gasoline problem is fairly big and we still are encountering widespread random outages and lines when tankers do show up.
In the last few days where I reside (southside of ATL) shortages have been more widespread than last week and it appears the problem is not getting better yet.
I'll see what I can come up with on the Jet fuel situation today and tommorow as I am on a trip presently.
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 6:40 pm Post subject: Re: North American Fuel Shortage Reports
nobodypanic wrote:
still plenty of gas here in the heart of US naval power. no problems yet. strange, huh?
Coastal port cities from Tampa to No'fuk get their refined products largely by shipments from the massive Hovensa refinery in the Virgin Islands. Whatever Euro imports we get would help. I would expect them to be reasonably supplied, but for not much of that gasoline to trickle inland very far. _________________ At 1% annual growth, human bodies will incorporate every gram in the observable universe in approximately 10,170 years.
Last edited by lawnchair on Mon Sep 29, 2008 7:42 pm; edited 1 time in total
Joined: Oct 23, 2004 Posts: 5928 Location: New Jersey
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 6:58 pm Post subject: Re: North American Fuel Shortage Reports
The DOE reported today that the Centenial, Colonial, Magellan, Explorer and Planatation pipelines were still running at reduced rates. Therefore inland locations hit by shortages may still be at least a week away from returning to normal supplies. _________________ It's already over, now it's just a matter of adjusting.
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 8:41 pm Post subject: Re: North American Fuel Shortage Reports
GoghGoner wrote:
I don't know why an Oklahoma talk radio site is the first to report gas shortages in D.C. but here it is.
Quote:
Hurricanes Ike and Gustav left behind an ugly mess in the form of continuing fuel shortages. Washington, DC is the latest area hit as yellow tape covers many gas pumps. Meanwhile, things have gotten so bad in Atlanta, Georgia, drivers have been following tanker trucks to service stations and camping out next to the pumps. The hurricanes hit hard at Gulf oil platforms and Texas refineries, which have been slow to get back up to full capacity. The problem worsened as anxious motorists topped off their tanks.
Posted: Mon Sep 29, 2008 9:17 pm Post subject: Re: North American Fuel Shortage Reports
lawnchair wrote:
nobodypanic wrote:
still plenty of gas here in the heart of US naval power. no problems yet. strange, huh?
Coastal port cities from Tampa to No'fuk get their refined products largely by shipments from the massive Hovensa refinery in the Virgin Islands. Whatever Euro imports we get would help. I would expect them to be reasonably supplied, but for not much of that gasoline to trickle inland very far.
“At first I was a good sport, but this is getting ridiculous,” said Marsha Lewis, 43, an administrative assistant who lives in Dacula, Ga., and commutes to Atlanta. “I drive an hour to work every day, and looking for gasoline has become my entire life.”
John Temples, 49, a self-employed construction worker, waited 30 minutes to refill his brown GMC van at a Shell station in Decatur, Ga. “This is a friendly town, and right now it’s basically just an annoyance,” he said. “But if there were an emergency and people needed to get out of town, things could get violent.”
Waiting behind five cars at a BP station in Atlanta, Mike Adams, 28, a paralegal, called the shortage “an absolute catastrophe.”
“Every few days they say it’s going to get better,” Mr. Adams said, “but it only seems to get worse.”
However, it was a different story Monday. "I was just in Atlanta Monday. There is no gasoline in Atlanta, in Charlotte, in Chattanooga. It's like a Third World country," former House Speaker Newt Gingrich said Sunday.
Police officers and a security guard were on hand to manage the flow of cars at a downtown Atlanta gas station around midday Monday.
Kathy Burdett, 49, of Forest Park, said the shortage ruined her weekend plans to visit Stone Mountain with out-of-town guests.
"I didn't go anywhere all weekend and we kept close to home," said Burdett, who had to hunt for the gasoline her friends needed to make it home to Tennessee.
_________________ Cogito, ergo non satis bibivi
C'mon man, who're you gonna believe?
Joined: May 30, 2008 Posts: 297 Location: On the highway, or the water somewhere!
Posted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 9:11 pm Post subject: Re: North American Fuel Shortage Reports
from the last quoted article above
Quote:
In a bit of good news, Colonial Pipeline Monday achieved the same flow-rates for gasoline deliveries as the pipeline managed before Hurricanes Gustav and Ike hit the Gulf Coast refining region earlier this month. Colonial said it is making every effort to support its shippers as they try to restore market stability.
_________________ Courtesy and Courage, Sincerity and Self-control, Honor and Loyalty...a Code to Live By!
Where is my wooden pitchfork and torch anyway? I may need them for a visit to the castle soon!
Diesel is reported to be in short supply in the upper Midwest, as the important TEPPCO pipeline in that area is running well below capacity. Some reports state that terminals are running out of diesel supplies, and only getting more after a day or two.
My WAG is that gasoline production was counter-seasonally stepped up at the expense of diesel production at some refineries. _________________ It's already over, now it's just a matter of adjusting.
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