Oil's energy contribution has declined by about 12% since 1999. The world's economies have also declined by about 12%. (Using conventional metrics, which are time delayed determinations, this will only be seen in hind sight). The massive destruction of asset values now occurring testifies to it happening.
Peak is well behind us, world economies have peaked and will continue to decline.
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 6:22 am Post subject: THE bailout thread [merged]
Quote:
Two House leaders said Wednesday headway is being made toward getting the $700 billion financial industry rescue bill through Congress, thanks partly to a provision increasing insurance for people's deposits.
"I think the Senate thinks it has the votes and I think it probably will pass," House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, D-Md., said. House Republican Whip Roy Blunt of Missouri agreed that prospects for passage have improved, and he said he was particularly heartened by indications the legislation has become more appealing to constituents back home.
The plan was set for a Senate vote Wednesday night
Joined: Jul 04, 2007 Posts: 2339 Location: The U.S.S.A
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 6:32 am Post subject: Re: Write your Senators: Bailout II up for Senate vote today
hope_full wrote:
Quote:
Two House leaders said Wednesday headway is being made toward getting the $700 billion financial industry rescue bill through Congress, thanks partly to a provision increasing insurance for people's deposits.
"I think the Senate thinks it has the votes and I think it probably will pass," House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, D-Md., said. House Republican Whip Roy Blunt of Missouri agreed that prospects for passage have improved, and he said he was particularly heartened by indications the legislation has become more appealing to constituents back home.
The plan was set for a Senate vote Wednesday night
His constituents back home are his good money the banker
Joined: Dec 27, 2004 Posts: 13196 Location: naive idiot fantasy world
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 7:17 am Post subject: Re: Write your Senators: Bailout II up for Senate vote today
hope_full wrote:
How dare the Senate do this? What part of "NO" do they not understand???
I think they intend to provide some kind of bailout regardless of citizen opinion. _________________ "...powerdown so soft and fluffy you'll think you're living in a pillow." - jboogy
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 8:50 am Post subject: Re: Write your Senators: Bailout II up for Senate vote today
Denninger points out that this bailout won't just bail out the US financial industry. It applies world-wide, even if the bad mortgages are for properties outside the US.
And it's not an oversight. Paulson says the bill will be vetoed if it's taken out.
Newt Gingrich said that if he were still in the House, he would vote for the bailout...very reluctantly. He said it was a terrible plan, and there were lots of other things they could do instead that would be better. But they were non-starters, because Paulson wouldn't go along with anything else.
Er...hello? Isn't the obvious answer to fire Paulson?? _________________ "The problems of today will not be solved by the same thinking that produced the problems in the first place." - Albert Einstein
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 9:00 am Post subject: Re: Write your Senators: Bailout II up for Senate vote today
Leanan wrote:
Er...hello? Isn't the obvious answer to fire Paulson??
How do you fire the guy who holds the Key to the Last Bank left standing?
Put somebody else in his place, you still have the fundamental problem even the last bank is actually bankrupt. Absorb all the assets into one bank, and clearly there are more bad assets than good ones.
Goal here for the bankers is to have one Good Bank with all the good assets in it, and one Bad Bank that the rest of the population is supposed to use, except it is empty. No, less than empty. Hard work couldn't pay off that debt in 3 generations, even if we had oil enough.
As Tanada says though, don't fret over the little things. The biggest bank of all, the Planet Earth, is quite bankrupt.
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 9:20 am Post subject: Re: Write your Senators: Bailout II up for Senate vote today
Ok, so the FDIC starts insuring 250 thousand dollars instead of 100 thousand dollars if this bill passes. How many Americans actually have more than 100 thousand dollars in savings? Or 20 thousand dollars for that matter! Is the real message here far more ominous? Wouldn't the real message be that there are going to be major runs on the banks in spite of the 700 billion dollars, and if we don't insure the rich and business owners who have more than 250 thousand dollars in the bank they are going to pull their money and the world will implode? _________________ We are so screwed.
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 9:21 am Post subject: Re: Write your Senators: Bailout II up for Senate vote today
That's it. I'm taking to the streets. I'm going to be printing thousands of pages detailing the bill, and including contact information for senators and congressmen. I'll be heading to places with people, handing these things out, and asking people to flood their politicians with emails, faxes, phone calls, and letters.
This is it, the endgame. We fight now or fall forever. _________________ "If humans don't control their numbers, nature will." -Pimentel
"There is not enough trash to go around for everyone," said Banrel, one of the participants in the cattle massacre.
"George W. Bush loves poor people. He keeps making more of them." -unkn
Joined: Apr 23, 2008 Posts: 172 Location: Georgia, USA
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 9:47 am Post subject: Re: Write your Senators: Bailout II up for Senate vote today
hope_full wrote:
Quote:
Two House leaders said Wednesday headway is being made toward getting the $700 billion financial industry rescue bill through Congress, thanks partly to a provision increasing insurance for people's deposits.
"I think the Senate thinks it has the votes and I think it probably will pass," House Majority Leader Steny Hoyer, D-Md., said. House Republican Whip Roy Blunt of Missouri agreed that prospects for passage have improved, and he said he was particularly heartened by indications the legislation has become more appealing to constituents back home.
The plan was set for a Senate vote Wednesday night
Roy Blunt says he's "particularly heartened" that the legislation has become "more appealing"???? Did I miss something?
Polls are showing that Americans are against this bill 10-to-one and in some places, five-to-one. When did that become "more appealing"?
I was so heartened to read and hear that the House voted this thing down. How dare the Senate do this? What part of "NO" do they not understand???
Hope
This was on Yahoo news just now. It answers your question about how things have suddenly become a lot more appealing:
"Scrambling to revive a package that met with bitter derision among constituents who viewed it as a giveaway to Wall Street, the Senate added a number of sweeteners designed to please rural lawmakers, including disaster aid for hurricane-battered states and money for rural schools. The package was hitching a ride on a popular measure to require health plans for 51 or more employees to give equal treatment to mental health or addiction if they cover such illnesses."
There are concerns that moderate House Democrats known as "Blue Dogs" will be repulsed by the tax breaks, and could vote no because they have been saying they don't want to see the deficit run up even further.
Blunt said one of the reasons he is more optimistic is that lawmakers are hearing less vocal opposition from their districts. He said that calls and e-mails to congressional offices that were running about 90 percent against the measure earlier now are at about "50-50."
_____________________________________________________
WTF does this have to do with the original problem? This version is even worse than the first. So much for our vocal protests. Throw us a piece of candy and we will stop our tantrum, sit down, and shut up.
Joined: May 27, 2007 Posts: 1776 Location: The Post Peak Oil Historian
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:30 am Post subject: Re: Write your Senators: Bailout II up for Senate vote today
Tempers were really high in The House of Representatives about these thieves trying to ram through this bill. It is not going to happen, as the majority in the House would rather burn in hell than vote to buy this toxic debt from these banks and screw the taxpayer.
Also, this is EXTREMELY unpopular among average Americans who have proved smarter than these thieves thought and flooded Congress with demands and threats that they will be voted out of office if they pass this.
Democrats had made a deal with the Republicans that they would be allowed to have 95 Democrats vote no and the rest would be required to vote yes and the Republicans would do the same to get this passed. Instead, there was a rebellion in the Republican ranks as the party split between fiscal conservative 'traditional' Republicans and neo-con wall streeters including Paulson and Bush.
These Republicans realized this was a scam that amounted to a coup of the United States. Therefore, right now you have 'Traditional' Republicans allied with the Democrats, who will all vote no next time as they were betrayed on the vote this time.
Even if they pass it tonight in the Senate, it will never pass in the House of Representatives. So this is just a show.
The House of Representatives have decided to wait and deal with minor problems as they crop up. There is NO WAY IN HELL this 700 Billion package will EVER be passed. Too many people are now pissed off about it. _________________ In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - George Orwell
It riles them to believe that you perceive the webs they weave. - Moody Blues
Last edited by Cid_Yama on Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:24 am; edited 1 time in total
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:56 am Post subject: Re: Write your Senators: Bailout II up for Senate vote today
Cid_Yama wrote:
The House of Representatives have decided to wait and deal with minor problems as they crop up. There is NO WAY IN HELL this 700 Billion package will EVER be passed. Too many people are now pissed off about it.
I hope you're right. But I don't see it playing out that way myself. TPTB are marshaling way too much momentum behind this bill for the plebes to stop it.
I have called and emailed my two senators and congressman every day for the last week, so I'm doing my part.
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 10:59 am Post subject: Re: Write your Senators: Bailout II up for Senate vote today
Cid_Yama wrote:
Tempers were really high in The House of Representatives about these thieves trying to ram through this bill. It is not going to happen, as the majority in the House would rather burn in hell than vote to buy this toxic debt from these banks and screw the taxpayer...
...The House of Representatives have decided to wait and deal with minor problems as they crop up. There is NO WAY IN HELL this 700 Billion package will EVER be passed. Too many people are now pissed off about it.
I really hope that you are right and I am not US citizen btw.
Senate members are fat pigs, so in all probabilities they will pass that.
However Representatives are just a little piglets, so they may act according to nation will.
Time will show.
Joined: Apr 05, 2005 Posts: 2618 Location: South of Atlanta
Posted: Wed Oct 01, 2008 11:31 am Post subject: Bailout Bill?? FOR WHO????
This paragraph from Section 112...
SEC. 112. COORDINATION WITH FOREIGN AUTHORITIES
4 AND CENTRAL BANKS.
5 The Secretary shall coordinate, as appropriate, with
6 foreign financial authorities and central banks to work
toward the establishment of similar programs by such authorities and central banks. To the extent that such foreign financial authorities or banks hold troubled assets as a result of extending financing to financial institutions that have failed or defaulted on such financing, such troubled assets qualify for purchase under section 101.
Rep from California uncovered this to Kudlow yesterday...
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