I think this is the beginnings of an economy based on perpetual growth and fossil fuel energy running headlong into geological energy constraints. Basically I see an undulatory downward path for the rest of my life. From here out, I think any rallies in our economic condition are going to be met with spiking commodity prices that knock us right back down.
... the neo-con agenda is a highly defined one that in some respects undermines industrial interests.
Boris,
Would you please give some examples of how the neocon agenda undermines industrial interests? This is not obvious to me. Thanks in advance. I agree with you that their agenda is highly defined.
... the neo-con agenda is a highly defined one that in some respects undermines industrial interests.
Boris,
Would you please give some examples of how the neocon agenda undermines industrial interests? This is not obvious to me. Thanks in advance. I agree with you that their agenda is highly defined.
Shannon
because it isn't that clear. it should be noticed that the neo-con agenda splits the industrial -military complex up by imposing ideology on the US of US power hence it disentangles unintentional the 2 interest groups
The pre Iraq invasion example of the DoS vs the DoD
both these depts had been hijacked by opposing agendas.. the 4 sisters were in with the DoS and the Neo cons where in with the DoD
or so it was claimed. the idiocy of both competing parties is beyond belief as there opposing visions of what was going to happen was so off the mark... this infighting was very prevalent in immediate aftermath when Rumsfeld tried to parachute the Iraqi opposition groups in as a gov in waiting.
this struggle for control of policy was a failure of leadership by Bush and perhaps the white house system of administration... Bush was not in some overcharge position or seemingly capable of controlling his subordinates .
the disruption of the OPEC cartel by the pentagon/neo con plan was not envisaged as beneficial by "big oil"
the perception that the US was in a OPEC stranglehold by the neo cons was not based in reality anyway as we now see OPEC lose control of the price..! iraqi overproduction as a stepping stone to saudi is some what a redundant idea as that peak oil thing and reality catchs up with their "plan".. in a way its a shame really. i wonder how historians are going to view this all in a 100 yrs time
in the end Iraqi internal pressure caused the Iraqi oil industry to stay under state control and not fall into Cheneys mates pockets. that and the miserable failure of Chalabis gov in waiting. Cheney is a shocker as his belief in is own attachment to neo con ideals is suspect IMO.
the dark intent in the corridors of power are locked in there own stupid battles and of course they are made less obvious by uncynical crusaders who attach themselves to either side(s) AND the constant need for any actor not to reveal infighting as it would destroy there own position.
the F 16 story itself the Pakistani alliance of temporary convenience is another case in point ... how can that sit in the neo con intray marked approved.
Condi popping over and proclaim that pakistan is making progress on democracy is a bit weak
in the end the pragmatism of the day tends to win out so the Neo cons have it all to do and to prove there point they need to create a ever expanding sphere of instability! even if its presented a s a democratic revolution ...
the trouble with instability is that its well ... unstable.
moreover the investment potential created by these changes is not always in the US favor and or a incitement to larger forces to start reacting
ie China to protect the sanctity of contracts it made with previous regimes may either act more overtly and or move into the vacuum created by instability in central asia rathe than the US.. the Iranian pipeline is a slap in the face of commercial interests and a negation of the policy adopted on the anti-proliferation ticket... there is always going to be a cost to action at this scale and the trade off has to measured
this would be a real problem... Uzbekistan is left buoyed up US involvement and base building... but thats a new one for the US and they must be working on worming there way out there somehow.
what is actually going on is not decided in some secret meeting behind closed doors somewhere but just a bunch of stuff that happens
personally my view is no one has a bloody clue what they are doing and or what metrics they need to be measuring let alone have some grip on 2nd order effects of destabilizing central asia..
"The Bush administration made plans for war and for Iraq's oil before the 9/11 attacks, sparking a policy battle between neo-cons and Big Oil, BBC's Newsnight has revealed.
Iraqi-born Falah Aljibury says US Neo-Conservatives planned to force a coup d'etat in Iraq
Two years ago today - when President George Bush announced US, British and Allied forces would begin to bomb Baghdad - protesters claimed the US had a secret plan for Iraq's oil once Saddam had been conquered."
Joined: Feb 01, 2005 Posts: 162 Location: Devon, UK
Posted: Tue Apr 05, 2005 4:48 am Post subject:
Here’s some more informed opinion on the Neo-cons. It’s an interview with (former) UN weapons inspector Scott Ritter.
He hates the Neo cons and he’s not afraid to show it. Worth a read (even if you’re pro-neo con) for the Iraq Oil, TSHTF and patriot act comments. Full article link.
Quote:
Scott Ritter: Neocons as Parasites
By Larisa Alexandrovna
Raw Story
Friday 01 April 2005
Congressional Catch-22.
Larisa Alexandrovna: Paul Wolfowitz stated prior to the Iraq invasion that Iraqi reconstruction would pay for itself. It seems that Mr. Wolfowitz, now charged with handling the World Bank, miscalculated. What is going on with the oil in Iraq?
Scott Ritter: Paul Wolfowitz was a salesman; his job was to sell a war. He acknowledged this in an interview with Vanity Fair magazine, in which he acknowledged that WMDs and the threat they posed, was nothing more than a vehicle to sell this war to America. Now you [get] to the war itself and selling it to Congress and [the] questions: How long will this take? Or how much will this cost?
Paul Wolfowitz lied to Congress about the costs of war. There is not a responsible member of government who thought this would be quick and cheap. There was nobody who believed that Iraq oil would pay for itself, no one in the oil business thought so.
What about oil companies, were they for the war or against it?
No oil professional in their right mind would support what is happening in Iraq. This isn't part of a grand 'oil' strategy; it is simply pure unadulterated incompetence.
So they are concerned about their bottom lines, and chaos doesn't forward that goal.
Right. Oil company executives are businessmen and they are in a business that requires long-term stability. They love dictators because they bring with them long-term stability. They don't like new democracies because they are messy and unstable. I have not run into a major oil company that is willing to refurbish the Iraq oil fields and invest in oil field exploration and development. These are multi-billion dollar investments that, in order to be profitable, must be played out over decades. And in Iraq today you cannot speak out to projecting any stability in the near to mid-future.
…
Several insiders have expressed concern over possible oil shortage riots. Would the Patriot Act be put to use, in your opinion, to address such riots?
[The Patriot Act] is simply the neocons putting their judicial agenda in place by other means. It was a compilation of all of the conservative initiatives, not neocon initiatives, which the conservative Republicans have been pushing for, including a more conservative law enforcement element.
This is not unhealthy as long is it is done properly, through legislation, proper channels of debate and discourse. A lot of this had been submitted in the past, but was rejected. After 9/11 all of these initiatives were lumped together.
There are some things in the Patriot Act I agree with, but the Patriot Act requires a responsible society. The neocons have no interest in a responsible society; they simply used the conservatives as a vehicle to push an agenda to assault individual civil liberties.
As the Patriot Act is now, how it came about, is entirely un-American. It is extreme legislation that does nothing to address the issues it professes to, but moreover, it is, as an existing law, un-American. What makes it un-American is that no one read it before they voted for it. So the process was un-American, and the motivation behind it was un-American. We cannot have a nation that is governed by fear. The Patriot Act is un-American simply because it exists.
…
We talked about this current social crisis as a closed loop during the second installment. Have you ever seen a loop like this throughout the history of the US? What does this mean?
The American experiment is much too complex to be destroyed by the neocons. In the end, the neocons will lose. It may take ten to twelve more years, and the costs will be horrific, but America will survive. There will be one hell of a mess to clean up, though, after the fall of the neocons.
Where do you see America, should things continue as is, five years from now?
At war, bankrupt morally and fiscally, and in great pain ... and only half-way through the nightmare. Ten to twelve years is what we will have to get through, but we will get through it.
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