Joined: May 06, 2006 Posts: 873 Location: Tustin, CA
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 3:17 am Post subject: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
In the Golden Oldie “Wonderful World” by the late great Sam Cooke, he proclaims “Don’t know what a Slide Rule is for” after admitting he doesn’t know much about Geography, Trigonometry, or Algebra either (he was concerned with something far more important).
I would be willing to bet 95% of the population today could not answer that question either. Young people listening to that song, still popular on “oldie” stations, I’m sure have no idea what he’s referring to.
At 52, I’m probably about as young as you can be and still have learned in school how to use one of these, at least the basic scales! (Thank You Mr Coxey! Lemoore H.S. California).
The image above is a Post Versalog (made by Hemmi of Japan). Arguably one of the finest Slide Rules ever made (there were contestants for that title, K&E, Pickett, and Dietzgen were excellent American rule makers and worthy of consideration. And of course anything else made by Hemmi).
Slide Rules were used for the first half of the 20th Century to help design just about anything you can think of that was accomplished during that period clear up to the Saturn 5 rocket and Men on the Moon!
I lived through the short period of time they lapsed into history (1972-1975). Programmable Scientific Calculators starting with the (expensive) HP 35 in 1972 were the writing on wall. A close high school friend of mine who obtained his Mechanical Engineering degree told me slide rules disappeared in his sophomore year of college , in the spring of 1975, with the introduction of the HP25 (under $200).
I will not argue that slide rules can compete in anyway with scientific calculators for speed and accuracy, the reason they disappeared faster than film cameras are today. But there was an elegance about them (without the batteries), that transcends time.
You could Multiply, Divide, find the Log of a number, find the Square, the Cube, the Square Root, the Cube Root, All the Trig Functions, and frankly a number of things I’m still learning. All to 3 significant places.
Why would anyone in the current world care about any of this? Anymore than they would how to harness a horse? Well this is what this site is about. In the future given what we know will be the energy situation, how will the calculators we have come to take for granted be made? Or the batteries?
A recent visit to EBay showed over a dozen old Versalogs any given week (they stopped making them in 1970). I could find only one listing for the HP25 that was the coffin nail for the Slide Rule, Hmmmm.
For more information on Slide Rules (Batteries Not Included!) Check this site out.
http://www.sliderule.ca/ _________________ Skeptical scrutiny in both Science and Religion is the means by which deep thoughts are winnowed from deep nonsense-Carl Sagan
Last edited by SILENTTODD on Sun Jul 29, 2007 1:50 pm; edited 2 times in total
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 3:39 am Post subject: Re: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
Ahh, memories, my old calculus teacher used to have one, and he even showed us once, how to use it (quickly forgotten by the way). i think actually it may be a good idea to get one, no doubt it will be used when education goes back to this
Joined: May 06, 2006 Posts: 873 Location: Tustin, CA
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 4:56 am Post subject: Re: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
eXpat wrote:
I think actually it may be a good idea to get one, no doubt it will be used when education goes back to this
I would agree. With the magic of EBay you can acquire beautiful Slide Rules for a fraction of the cost (inflation since 1969) they use to be. If only for the intellectual challenge. Get yourself a good Versalog or VersaTrig, or a K&E 4081-3 Log Log Duplex Decitrig. I have gotten excellent examples on EBay for less than $20. Get yourself a cheap one, and then get one of the many books on the Web posted.
Or go to Barnes & Noble “Out of Print” site and just type in “Slide Rule” and see how many books come up! _________________ Skeptical scrutiny in both Science and Religion is the means by which deep thoughts are winnowed from deep nonsense-Carl Sagan
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 6:46 am Post subject: Re: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
How fondly I remember going to Michigan Technological University 35 years ago as an Electrical Engineering major and all of us walked around with those wide yellow Pickett slide rules hanging from belt hooks. I still have a slide rule from Cleveland Institute of Electronics with the normal scales on one side and a bunch of electronics scales on the back - scales calibrated to calculate resonant frequencies, Ohm's Law, inductance, lots of useful stuff - came in very handy during exams for FCC licenses. And two years ago I took a refresher basic physics course at Michigan State and during exams had a slide rule on my desk instead of the fancy programmable graphical display calculators everyone else had. It was so funny, the looks I got! Like a dodo bird or other extinct animal was in the chair next to them.
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 6:50 am Post subject: Re: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
ohanian wrote:
This is all well and good but what do I need a slide ruler for?
I already have a solar cell calculator which works in sunlight.
So even in a MAD MAX universe my calculator would still work.
I hate to rain on your parade, but EMP will turn that thing into a paperweight.
Many portable electronic devices use CMOS chips which are especially susceptible to damage (static or EMP). _________________ Remember: 73.3% of statistics are made up
and the other 23.6% are wrong
Joined: Oct 16, 2004 Posts: 1240 Location: Brisbane, Australia
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 7:06 am Post subject: Re: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
SILENTTODD wrote:
......At 52, I’m probably about as young as you can be and still have learned in school how to use one of these, at least the basic scales! (Thank You Mr Coxey! Lemoore H.S. California).......
Well I'm early 40's and I remember learning how to use them in Grade 8, although it was just as a part of the history of maths. We had to build a very simple slide rule (that worked) as an assignment. I made mine out of cardboard. _________________ Kind regards, Katkinkate
"The ultimate goal of farming is not the growing of crops,
but the cultivation and perfection of human beings."
Masanobu Fukuoka
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 10:07 am Post subject: Re: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
ohanian wrote:
This is all well and good but what do I need a slide ruler for?
I already have a solar cell calculator which works in sunlight.
So even in a MAD MAX universe my calculator would still work.
Problems with modern calculators
Calculators don't last long. They are damaged by heat, cold, moisture, they are shock sensitive. Try taking one camping... Through mass mining of exotic materials and mass production calculators are cheap. But don't expect them to stay cheap forever. Batteries use exotic materials like silver and mercury and are damaged by cold and non-functional in cold weather. Also solar doesn't work well by candle light, when burning the midnight oil so to speak.
Where calculators fear to tread
Living in Ukraine, I have seen with my own eyes people choosing not to use calculators for these reasons. In open markets, calculators are replaced by mental arithmetic and for long bills the old fashioned abacus. Calculators are cheap but in the winter, in the evening and night markets; modern cash registers cannot be used. Parts freeze up, calculator batteries die and dim lighting isn't enough for solar calculators. And good luck using a calculator wearing gloves.
The European Abacus
It's just rows of ten beads. You add in tens and can add up a list of groceries faster then a cash register. I have one. People choose this simply because it's the best tool for the job. It's fast, flexible and trusted because the customer can see what is being added up. I imagine if the big warm chain stores break down in this country and we have open markets (like what is presently happening in Detroit), this is a device you may see.
By the way, in Ukraine I also liked how they sold vegetables in the open winter markets. They used a wood box with a glass side that opened and the box was lit with a candle that also kept the vegetables warm. The night markets made it possible for people to get food after working all day, and they were beautiful to see full of candles and dim lights on the crisp winter nights.
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 10:20 am Post subject: Re: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
I have some nice sliderules (they're still in Arkansas). I think they're an elegant technology though I haven't used them much. In fact one of my math teachers in college was shocked (not impressed) I had one. Also in college besides requiring graphing calculators they tried to teach everything with mathlab software. It was comical. Mathlab software may be useful in the work world and is excellent for making presentations. But as a learning tool it has negative value. You spend the regular amount of time learning the math and the equations, then you have to add onto that extra hours learning to program in this software. Plus the teachers have to spend half their time teaching the software. So you have the same math, with half the teaching time and more material to learn.
Call me my thinking archaic, but that doesn't sound like a good deal to me. And I have a similar opinion of hooking kids at an early age on computers. I mean a stick is a great tool for poking the ground, but when you teach all the kids to use a stick as crutch that's going too far. The irony of it all is, with all the money we spend on computers our students can't compete with the rest of the world.
In a Global Test of Math Skills, U.S. Students Behind the Curve
"American high school students have a poorer mastery of basic math concepts than their counterparts in most other leading industrialized nations, according to a major international survey released yesterday."
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A41278-2004Dec6.html
Hey, maybe we should use computers and calculators more? Well sadly we probably will. The US spends it's money on wars not teachers, and in high schools I think computers are the new substitute teacher. And considering how "evil liberal educators" are considered the most awful thing by too many politicians, well I get the impression that the US power structure wants a poorly educated public. So even if we could go back to an older system that worked and was easier, that's not what's going to happen. Personally, I think everything about the old system was easier. Teaching someone to slide a rule up and down is a lot easier then teaching them how to program a calculator or learn a whole programming language (just to do some math).
Oh and the great irony of this rant is, I'm a programmer!
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 10:55 am Post subject: Re: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
steam_cannon wrote:
the teachers have to spend half their time teaching the software. So you have the same math, with half the teaching time and more material to learn.
Also, this is a lot like spelling in the United States. With the Russian language, most spelling is phonetic. If you want to spell something you say it slowly. So there aren't spelling bee's in Russia. But in the United States, children waste their time every night memorizing word lists. Kids could be learning a second language or playing, it's so dumb!
And it's the same thing with math, by diluting math with programming rules and dependence on a calculator, I think we are making it harder then it actually is.
Joined: May 06, 2006 Posts: 873 Location: Tustin, CA
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 1:56 pm Post subject: Re: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
steam_cannon wrote:
ohanian wrote:
This is all well and good but what do I need a slide ruler for?
I already have a solar cell calculator which works in sunlight.
So even in a MAD MAX universe my calculator would still work.
Problems with modern calculators
Calculators don't last long. They are damaged by heat, cold, moisture, they are shock sensitive. Try taking one camping... Through mass mining of exotic materials and mass production calculators are cheap. But don't expect them to stay cheap forever. Batteries use exotic materials like silver and mercury and are damaged by cold and non-functional in cold weather. Also solar doesn't work well by candle light, when burning the midnight oil so to speak.
My point exactly steam_cannon. I don't begrudge calculators; I have several including a graphing TI-83. But I don’t have one that’s 30 years old, the point I was making in trying to find an HP-25 from the 70’s. There aren’t that many of them still working!
I’ve started collecting slide rules out of my own personal interest, and with the advent of EBay excellent ones are easily available at reasonable prices. Same with the books giving detailed instruction. You can find loads of them at the Barnes&Noble “Out of Print Books” link on their web site.
I have acquired several excellent K&E slide rules that date from the 30’s and 40’s that still work as well as the day they were manufactured. Will any hand calculator you have today still be functioning that long? Maybe, but I wouldn’t bet on it.
I personally don’t think at my age I will outlive solar powered calculators still being around. But my son who’s 26 may. _________________ Skeptical scrutiny in both Science and Religion is the means by which deep thoughts are winnowed from deep nonsense-Carl Sagan
Posted: Sat Jul 28, 2007 3:51 pm Post subject: Re: Don't know what a Slide Rule is for?
If you could find a very old slide rule on eBay, you could make a pretty good piece of decor just by mounting it in a frame behind glass. _________________ "May you live in interesting times"
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