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Electric_Economy_2025
Heavy Crude
Joined: Apr 01, 2008
Posts: 143
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 Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 1:59 pm Post subject: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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It appears that we will start to see huge numbers of Li-ion Batteries in the next few years for PHEV's and BEV's
Now Nissan is not only going to make them but they will also introduce their own EV. I just want to know what other members think.
Nissan to mass produce Li-ion Batteries |
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jlw61
Intermediate Crude
Joined: Sep 03, 2007
Posts: 637
Location: Sunny Virginia, USA
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 2:57 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| Electric_Economy_2025 wrote: | It appears that we will start to see huge numbers of Li-ion Batteries in the next few years for PHEV's and BEV's
Now Nissan is not only going to make them but they will also introduce their own EV. I just want to know what other members think.
Nissan to mass produce Li-ion Batteries |
I think 2010 is starting to look like a long ways away. In the mean time I'm ordering my electric bicycle.
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When somebody makes a statement you don't understand, don't tell him he's crazy. Ask him what he means. -- Otto Harkaman, Space Viking |
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kokoda
Heavy Crude
Joined: Aug 24, 2006
Posts: 441
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 3:07 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| Once again the Japanese are ahead of the game while US car companies sit around scratching their asses and wondering why nobody wants to buy there gas guzzlers. |
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Electric_Economy_2025
Heavy Crude
Joined: Apr 01, 2008
Posts: 143
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 3:43 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| jlw61 wrote: | | Electric_Economy_2025 wrote: | It appears that we will start to see huge numbers of Li-ion Batteries in the next few years for PHEV's and BEV's
Now Nissan is not only going to make them but they will also introduce their own EV. I just want to know what other members think.
Nissan to mass produce Li-ion Batteries |
I think 2010 is starting to look like a long ways away. In the mean time I'm ordering my electric bicycle. |
Yes it is a long ways away and I think some bad times will happen before that and even after that but I don't think it will be as bad as the DOOMERs want it to be.
Personally I feel that onces the transition starts people will change and adapted very fast even faster then I think it will happen. I think a power down does'nt mean the end of modern society, it means we will change our personal habits so that life goes on in a sustainable way and I think we can do it without billions of people dying. |
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strider3700
Fission
Joined: Apr 17, 2005
Posts: 2749
Location: Vancouver Island
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 4:37 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| Electric_Economy_2025 wrote: | | I think a power down does'nt mean the end of modern society, it means we will change our personal habits so that life goes on in a sustainable way and I think we can do it without billions of people dying. |
I've taken the time to highlight the flaw in your plan. It is a nice dream though.
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shame on us, doomed from the start
god have mercy on our dirty little hearts |
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Electric_Economy_2025
Heavy Crude
Joined: Apr 01, 2008
Posts: 143
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 5:24 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| strider3700 wrote: | | Electric_Economy_2025 wrote: | | I think a power down does'nt mean the end of modern society, it means we will change our personal habits so that life goes on in a sustainable way and I think we can do it without billions of people dying. |
I've taken the time to highlight the flaw in your plan. It is a nice dream though. |
Until it happens it's not flawed also most of the dieoff unforantely will happen to the worlds poorest if it does happen  |
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americandream
Fission
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Joined: Oct 18, 2004
Posts: 2097
Location: kiwibush
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 5:40 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| Electric_Economy_2025 wrote: | | strider3700 wrote: | | Electric_Economy_2025 wrote: | | I think a power down does'nt mean the end of modern society, it means we will change our personal habits so that life goes on in a sustainable way and I think we can do it without billions of people dying. |
I've taken the time to highlight the flaw in your plan. It is a nice dream though. |
Until it happens it's not flawed also most of the dieoff unforantely will happen to the worlds poorest if it does happen |
I wouldn't be too sure about that. We've a lot further to fall in terms of our energy needs. They on the other hand, already live off the grass growing on the verges.
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Bugger me, I hear oil's runnin out mate! |
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Electric_Economy_2025
Heavy Crude
Joined: Apr 01, 2008
Posts: 143
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 6:31 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| americandream wrote: | | Electric_Economy_2025 wrote: | | strider3700 wrote: | | Electric_Economy_2025 wrote: | | I think a power down does'nt mean the end of modern society, it means we will change our personal habits so that life goes on in a sustainable way and I think we can do it without billions of people dying. |
I've taken the time to highlight the flaw in your plan. It is a nice dream though. |
Until it happens it's not flawed also most of the dieoff unforantely will happen to the worlds poorest if it does happen |
I wouldn't be too sure about that. We've a lot further to fall in terms of our energy needs. They on the other hand, already live off the grass growing on the verges. |
How much oil do we need to keep farming on the scale we farm now ? will there be some problems yes will people dies in America yes but I don't think it will be as bad as in thrid world or some first world countries, we have alot of resources here we can use them to live on and nothing else if needed. I Lived in the Philippines for a few years so I do have first hand experience of how things work in a third world country. They live off of other countries there would be a huge dieoff there if they lost their oil imports. would they rebound into a way of life like it was there in the 1900's faster then a First world yes because there are alot of simple living going on, the problem would be food supply everything else is manageable. |
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The_Toecutter
Light Sweet Crude
Joined: Jun 18, 2005
Posts: 1736
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 8:35 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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About farking time. They probably now have a concept of how grim our situation is.
If only they did it 8 years ago...
In any event, once they do this, EVs will be very cheap to run. 18650s at only 500 cycles to 100%, could give cost parity at under $3/gallon gas if EVs are mass produced to bring pack costs down to $250/kWh. The Li Ion in development are far better than that! Li Ion in the Triumph GT6 would be awesome.
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The unnecessary felling of a tree, perhaps the old growth of centuries, seems to me a crime little short of murder. ~Thomas Jefferson |
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ANewHuman
Heavy Crude
Joined: Oct 14, 2007
Posts: 169
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 9:59 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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Funny when people go "We can powerdown". Oh really, if we do "power down", ie become less wasteful, say goodbye to like 40+% of the jobs people currently do.
Capitalism only works on constant growth also, doesn't matter if we "become more efficient" now because within a few years the same problem will be back again thanks to the growth needed to keep capitalism alive...
No we truly are Fark.
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Introducing the human evolution. |
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Electric_Economy_2025
Heavy Crude
Joined: Apr 01, 2008
Posts: 143
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 10:38 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| ANewHuman wrote: | Funny when people go "We can powerdown". Oh really, if we do "power down", ie become less wasteful, say goodbye to like 40+% of the jobs people currently do.
Capitalism only works on constant growth also, doesn't matter if we "become more efficient" now because within a few years the same problem will be back again thanks to the growth needed to keep capitalism alive...
No we truly are Fark. |
Really? power down does'nt mean growth will stop but instead with a sustainable energy source growth won't be of of control like it has been for about 60 to 70 years.
Say good bye to 40% of the jobs ? go ahead and break that one down for me please I got to hear this one.
So constant growth has to be what ? 5% ,10% ,15 % a year ?
what if growth was .5% a year or 1% would everything fall apart and stop working ?
Electricity can have sustainable growth for a long time unlike oil, (hundreds if not thousands of years before we come to its limits on this planet)
Perhaps you don't understand what would happen when we tranistion to a sustainable energy source. maybe you lack the vision or perhaps your just to much of a DOOMER to really see it.
Btw I never said it will be a painless or easy process to make the transition.
To power down abit is hardly the end of things. Also if you have a sustainable energy source how will you get out of control growth, the growth only happens as the power grows. You can't just make 1 gigawatt of energy it takes time unlike just finding oil in the ground or perhaps you still don't get it.
P.S. batteries are recyclable is gas ? |
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Denny
Light Sweet Crude
Joined: Jul 10, 2004
Posts: 1693
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 10:44 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| kokoda wrote: | | Once again the Japanese are ahead of the game while US car companies sit around scratching their asses and wondering why nobody wants to buy there gas guzzlers. |
Even as late as last fall, GM was touting their updated trucks and SUV's. Then, the big Detroit car show with their Camaro clone car. Chrysler its new minivan, now only in extended length. These outfits really have blown it big time. |
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Eli
Fusion
Joined: Jun 18, 2005
Posts: 3964
Location: In a van down by the river
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| Posted: Tue May 20, 2008 10:54 pm Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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Yup they should have done what toe cutter had said.
Just think where they would be sitting if just one of these numb nuts had an EV/gas vehicle that could go 40 miles on a charge. |
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Judgie
Heavy Crude
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Joined: May 07, 2007
Posts: 434
Location: Adelaide, South Australia
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| Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 1:47 am Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| Electric_Economy_2025 wrote: | | ANewHuman wrote: | Funny when people go "We can powerdown". Oh really, if we do "power down", ie become less wasteful, say goodbye to like 40+% of the jobs people currently do.
Capitalism only works on constant growth also, doesn't matter if we "become more efficient" now because within a few years the same problem will be back again thanks to the growth needed to keep capitalism alive...
No we truly are Fark. |
Really? power down does'nt mean growth will stop but instead with a sustainable energy source growth won't be of of control like it has been for about 60 to 70 years.
Say good bye to 40% of the jobs ? go ahead and break that one down for me please I got to hear this one.
So constant growth has to be what ? 5% ,10% ,15 % a year ?
what if growth was .5% a year or 1% would everything fall apart and stop working ?
Electricity can have sustainable growth for a long time unlike oil, (hundreds if not thousands of years before we come to its limits on this planet)
Perhaps you don't understand what would happen when we tranistion to a sustainable energy source. maybe you lack the vision or perhaps your just to much of a DOOMER to really see it.
Btw I never said it will be a painless or easy process to make the transition.
To power down abit is hardly the end of things. Also if you have a sustainable energy source how will you get out of control growth, the growth only happens as the power grows. You can't just make 1 gigawatt of energy it takes time unlike just finding oil in the ground or perhaps you still don't get it.
P.S. batteries are recyclable is gas ? |
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
THIS GUY IS NEW. SOMEONE FETCH THE LONG LIST OF MUST READ THREADS.
Electric Economy, please go research the term E.R.O.E.I. and it's implications for your arguments and the various renewable energy resources. There are many experts on here who have a much greater understanding than you do, and everything you're asking has been done to death in past threads. Theres plenty of reading to do, and most newcomers do it before beginning to discuss issues here. Use the SEARCH FUNCTION. Keep in mind that Even renewables, Nuclear Power Plants and Coal Power Plants rely on fossifuels, particularly oil in many ways from transport of equipment and raw materials to backup facilities. It is not as easy as you think. Personally I think you're in the denial and fear phases (Tip: Use the Search Function).
Cheers.
Mike
_________________
"That the cream cannot help but always rise up to the top, well I say, <censored by peakoil.com> floats"
Jarvis Cocker - "Running the World" |
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Electric_Economy_2025
Heavy Crude
Joined: Apr 01, 2008
Posts: 143
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| Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 2:25 am Post subject: Re: Nissan To Mass Produce Li-ion Batteries... |
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| Judgie wrote: | | Electric_Economy_2025 wrote: | | ANewHuman wrote: | Funny when people go "We can powerdown". Oh really, if we do "power down", ie become less wasteful, say goodbye to like 40+% of the jobs people currently do.
Capitalism only works on constant growth also, doesn't matter if we "become more efficient" now because within a few years the same problem will be back again thanks to the growth needed to keep capitalism alive...
No we truly are Fark. |
Really? power down does'nt mean growth will stop but instead with a sustainable energy source growth won't be of of control like it has been for about 60 to 70 years.
Say good bye to 40% of the jobs ? go ahead and break that one down for me please I got to hear this one.
So constant growth has to be what ? 5% ,10% ,15 % a year ?
what if growth was .5% a year or 1% would everything fall apart and stop working ?
Electricity can have sustainable growth for a long time unlike oil, (hundreds if not thousands of years before we come to its limits on this planet)
Perhaps you don't understand what would happen when we tranistion to a sustainable energy source. maybe you lack the vision or perhaps your just to much of a DOOMER to really see it.
Btw I never said it will be a painless or easy process to make the transition.
To power down abit is hardly the end of things. Also if you have a sustainable energy source how will you get out of control growth, the growth only happens as the power grows. You can't just make 1 gigawatt of energy it takes time unlike just finding oil in the ground or perhaps you still don't get it.
P.S. batteries are recyclable is gas ? |
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
THIS GUY IS NEW. SOMEONE FETCH THE LONG LIST OF MUST READ THREADS.
Electric Economy, please go research the term E.R.O.E.I. and it's implications for your arguments and the various renewable energy resources. There are many experts on here who have a much greater understanding than you do, and everything you're asking has been done to death in past threads. Theres plenty of reading to do, and most newcomers do it before beginning to discuss issues here. Use the SEARCH FUNCTION. Keep in mind that Even renewables, Nuclear Power Plants and Coal Power Plants rely on fossifuels, particularly oil in many ways from transport of equipment and raw materials to backup facilities. It is not as easy as you think. Personally I think you're in the denial and fear phases (Tip: Use the Search Function).
Cheers.
Mike |
LOL denial of what the end of this way of life ? hardly I am more then prepared for anything why? not because I think it will happen but just in case it happens, also I live in earthquake country.
You lack the vision to see how things can be and that money is'nt always the answer as for newclear Hmmm yeah some FF are consumed in the making and mining but compared what you get in return its nothing. As for coal Im not sure I mentioned that but if I did if its burned clean then the impact is limitted also most part coal mining is electric.
Strange how you did'nt mention anything about wind,solar,geothermal or wave energy.
As we transition at a certain point FF will not be needed anymore in these energy sources to be made or uses.
Like I said it won't be painless and there will be many bumps mostly small but from time to time a large one will pop up.
P.S. Batteries are recyclable is FF ? |
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