[dorlomin]

Oilfinder wasn't any more crazy than pops. Or you. He just irritated folks because he could demonstrate that the claims

What ever happend to his giant catalogue of press releases, how many billions of barrels did he claim to have found in Iran?

What about the bakken, what was it, a new Ghawar when he first started drooling over it?

Look we all know you are a troll, you are here to amuse yourself at our expense. If this was a cornucopian web site, you would be all for peak oil. If this was democrat you would be a pure, full on republican.

You are an often banned troll who has even been caught using sock puppets. I dont know about others but you are not someone to take seriously. So trying to pretend that Oil Finder is anything other that a wild eyed loon forever proclaiming never ending oil from press releases is really just yet another little troll by our friend under the bridge.

[Lore]

Oilfinder wasn't any more crazy than pops. Or you. He just irritated folks because he could demonstrate that the claims

What ever happend to his giant catalogue of press releases, how many billions of barrels did he claim to have found in Iran?

What about the bakken, what was it, a new Ghawar when he first started drooling over it?

Look we all know you are a troll, you are here to amuse yourself at our expense. If this was a cornucopian web site, you would be all for peak oil. If this was democrat you would be a pure, full on republican.

You are an often banned troll who has even been caught using sock puppets. I dont know about others but you are not someone to take seriously. So trying to pretend that Oil Finder is anything other that a wild eyed loon forever proclaiming never ending oil from press releases is really just yet another little troll by our friend under the bridge.

I agree, the post is a strawman with the sole intent to elicit a quick spontaneous negative reaction based on the average user of the forum, i.e., "I wish you'd all just die and go to hell!"

[Rune]

A Post-Oil Man



Don't forget THIS guy; he did a lot of damage early-on.

OMG that is hysterical! Were they REALLY that cracked back then?

"This ain't like that Y2K stuff...." CLASSIC!

There really was a kind of doomer-chic back then - in the years 2004 - 06.

It was not-debatable. Peak oil doom was as plain as the noise on your face. And if you questioned it, you were thoroughly in denial and labelled as such.

Then, (when was it?)... Maybe in 2007 or so, Shannymara (a mod) got tired of the doom denialists and went and started her own doomer website called Malthusia.net.

Each topic category of that site had something to do with doom - like peak oil doom, population doom, pollution doom, global warming doom...

and a whole bunch of erstwhile peakoil.com posters followed her over there to get away from irritating and unproductive denialists. I don't know what happened to Malthusia.net. I just tried it to see if it was still there and it wasn't.

But those folks sure didn't like "Carlhole", my original username from 2004.

I've always been rather a contrarian. And if, say, I am learning about some thesis, I will also look at the anti-thesis and test the thesis with it. Just my style, I guess.

But that didn't help my popularity much. But then, if you are a contrarian, by definition, you don'lt really give much of a shit about popularity. So I certainly would not have been welcome at Malthusia.net.

Does anyone know what happened to everyone who went over there? They were the cream of the doomer crop.

[Rod_Cloutier]

Once oil starts to decline; even a 1% shortfall will cause prices to rise, cripple the economy, and/or lead to shortages. The oil will never run out in our lifetimes.

The peak oil crowd was right!

[John_A]

Oilfinder wasn't any more crazy than pops. Or you. He just irritated folks because he could demonstrate that the claims

What ever happend to his giant catalogue of press releases, how many billions of barrels did he claim to have found in Iran?

Bunches I think.

What about the bakken, what was it, a new Ghawar when he first started drooling over it?

He did get a bit carried away early with the amount of oil available there. But then apparently wildly underestimated the ability of it, and the Eagleford, to increase US oil production faster than at any time in its history, so he gets extra points for that one. It isn't as though anyone else caught the mind boggling magnitude that the unconventional resources could be ramped up to deliver oil.

Look we all know you are a troll, you are here to amuse yourself at our expense. If this was a cornucopian web site, you would be all for peak oil. If this was democrat you would be a pure, full on republican.

I am for peak oil, it is as certain as death (finite resources, given production, etc etc see JD's disclaimer for how this strawman needs handled) and the past warming of the planet. And I'm an independent, so sorry, won't be declaring sides in the Republicrat nonsense anytime soon.

[John_A]

Once oil starts to decline; even a 1% shortfall will cause prices to rise, cripple the economy, and/or lead to shortages. The oil will never run out in our lifetimes.

The peak oil crowd was right!

But of course they are. The only problem with your scenario is that oil declined during the early 80's, and by far more than 1%, and it didn't cause prices to rise, and it didn't cripple the economy. Didn't lead to shortages either. So in terms of precedent, it sure can't be assumed that a drop in production will do any of the things you mentioned.

[John_A]

"This ain't like that Y2K stuff...." CLASSIC!

There really was a kind of doomer-chic back then - in the years 2004 - 06.

It was not-debatable. Peak oil doom was as plain as the noise on your face. And if you questioned it, you were thoroughly in denial and labelled as such.

and booted off the forums as well! The bannings came fast and furious back then, dare to not nod as fast as the poster beside you at whatever the doom de jure and POW you were excommunicated.

Then, (when was it?)... Maybe in 2007 or so, Shannymara (a mod) got tired of the doom denialists and went and started her own doomer website called Malthusia.net.

Each topic category of that site had something to do with doom - like peak oil doom, population doom, pollution doom, global warming doom...

and a whole bunch of erstwhile peakoil.com posters followed her over there to get away from irritating and unproductive denialists. I don't know what happened to Malthusia.net. I just tried it to see if it was still there and it wasn't.

http://malthusia.com/index.php

My bet is they are still living it up "good ol' days" style, bunkers, ammo, gold, the whole enchilada.

But those folks sure didn't like "Carlhole", my original username from 2004.

I understand the feeling.

But that didn't help my popularity much. But then, if you are a contrarian, by definition, you don'lt really give much of a shit about popularity. So I certainly would not have been welcome at Malthusia.net.

Does anyone know what happened to everyone who went over there? They were the cream of the doomer crop.

They were still there a year ago when last I checked in, yucking it up over the coming collapse which just never seems to arrive. Shanny was in the midst of some existential crisis or another over immediate family and a raging desire to be rid of them. Any parent probably understands that urge, no Doom required to want the kids and hubby to just LEAVE at some point during the "raise the kids" time of life.

[Ibon]

I would choose none of the above. The relevant question is why so many credible folks miscalculated.

Here is my answer. Many folks saw the ideological war of conservation being lost after Reagan. It was full speed ahead consumption. whether you were an environmentalist looking for a catalyst that would change this or a Mormon republican seeing a precious resource being squandered the Peak Oil story made logical sense as it fit into a narrative that puts resource limits as the catalyst to drive change. After watching 40 years of nothing else working to question the status quo.

That has been certainly true in my case. From an ecological perspective when the resource base that enables overshoot goes into decline that is when an intractable status quo has to move.

Many felt very compelled by this argument. Many miscalculated the geology and the rise of alternative non conventional fossil fuels because they were being held by this narrative.

It is a similar narrative that can be found in the climate change community. In fact, both peak oil and climate change were often debated together and depending on which one of the two at any given moment was perceived as better fitting the above narrative, (which of the two perceived as more immanent) representing a game changer.

Deferred rather than disprove Peak Oil is what all these new non conventional fossil fuels have done.

The underlying narrative is still compelling.

[Loki]

More strawmen from the trolls. Yay.

Recent history according to PO.com trolls:

(1) Great Recession? Never happened.
(2) Apparently permanent spike in oil price? Never happened.
(3) Coincidence that oil price spiked at the same time as the worst economic crash since the 1930s? Not a problem. See #1 and 2.
(4) Drag of high oil prices on the flaccid “recovery”? Not a problem. See #1 and 2.

I love counterfactual history. What might have been had what was not happened?

[Rune]

Well we sure ain't drinking our piss and scraping the flesh off rabbit hide with broken CDs.

[SeaGypsy]

Kudos John

[dorlomin]

Look we all know you are a troll, you are here to amuse yourself at our expense. If this was a cornucopian web site, you would be all for peak oil. If this was democrat you would be a pure, full on republican.

I am for peak oil, it is as certain as death (finite resources, given production, etc etc see JD's disclaimer for how this strawman needs handled) and the past warming of the planet. And I'm an independent, so sorry, won't be declaring sides in the Republicrat nonsense anytime soon.

I love the faux innocent face of the highlighted bit. A grown adult that needs to resort to sock puppet accounts then tries to be the voice of reason.

Some people got peak oil wrong. Lots and lots of people got 'abundance' wrong. Having a one eyed laugh at the extreme end of one side while ignoring that your mates on this thread made some pretty big howlers themselves shows up everything we need to know about you.

[Rod_Cloutier]

Shanny was in the midst of some existential crisis or another over immediate family and a raging desire to be rid of them. Any parent probably understands that urge, no Doom required to want the kids and hubby to just LEAVE at some point during the "raise the kids" time of life

Unfair- Shannon ie 'General doom' of Malthusia.com does not even post here anymore. She's going through a painful separation from her husband, this is an attack on her character not on her arguments.

The consequences of peak oil were never anticipated to occur until we started down the down slope of production, which has not occurred yet. If there was a misunderstanding by people prior to the 2008/2009 global economic collapse, it was that the consequences of peak oil would be sudden, short term, and terminal, not long term, slow and permanent as we have observed already still in the production plateau. There will be more action to this issue as production starts falling, and cannot be hidden anymore within the next 4-5 years.

(Malthusia.com is still up and running- it is a members only forum; you have to be logged in as a member to view content)

[ralfy]

None of them, as demand was offset by economic recession, with the elite using bailout money to play in the stock markets.

[Ibon]

(Malthusia.com is still up and running- it is a members only forum; you have to be logged in as a member to view content)

If guests can't view content how do they attract new members? Maybe like Malthus they are aware of the dangers of exponential growth and are practicing a steady state population

[vision-master]

With gas prices dropping below $3 gal, there is NO Credibility of Peak Oil Doomers!

[John_A]

Well we sure ain't drinking our piss and scraping the flesh off rabbit hide with broken CDs.

and the Walmart trucks keep rumbling down the road...ocean liners keep moving...asphalt roads are still here, and the one thing we would all LOVE to see killed off by peak oil....wasn't.

[dsula]

Well we sure ain't drinking our piss and scraping the flesh off rabbit hide with broken CDs.

and the Walmart trucks keep rumbling down the road...ocean liners keep moving...asphalt roads are still here, and the one thing we would all LOVE to see killed off by peak oil....wasn't.

That's true. What a sad reality for cornies & Rune types. As I was promised flying cars, colony on mars, free electricity, household-chore-robots and many more such things.
Stuck in box with 4 wheels, for 100 years now?

[John_A]

With gas prices dropping below $3 gal, there is NO Credibility of Peak Oil Doomers!

If that were true, TOD would have folded in shame during the fall of 2008.

But to continue the thought, if we got back to the heyday of $0.50/gal gasoline in America, then we could certainly talk.

[Pops]

LOL, this is like picking the player of the game at halftime, hard to know who was the Doomer and who the Corny before decline sets in.

Maybe Bardi and Collapsnik are the Cornies? Or maybe Yergin is the Doomer?

--
I think the most mistaken predictions on either side are about "Ability to Pay".

Overnight Armageddonists say the price could go to some astronomical level overnight and stay there, causing collapse. Unicorn Worshipers actually make the same mistake, believing supply will always rise even as the increasing difficulty of production continuously raises prices, causing utopia. There are variations, doomers think substitution, conservation are bad while Cornies see them only as good, etc.

But what both ignore is that [ability to pay] is not unlimited and in fact is dependant on the built infrastructure of easy oil. The price/utility ratio isn't unlimited so it can neither collapse the economy overnight nor continue fossil fuel utopia forever.

--
In fact, my *prediction that the price would not continue to rise but increasingly fluctuate while averaging less has been a pretty good guess so far if I do say so myself... *(it actually started out as just a devil's advocate argument to drum up some posts but hey, LOL)