[KaiserJeep]

Explain what is wrong and how.

[MD]

Explain what is wrong and how.

Specifically there ARE opportunities for all but they are hardly equal. The best, brightest, most tenacious, and luckiest may escape poverty, but the rest have nearly zero odds of success.

A child born to middle/upper class parents still has many more opportunities for education, employment, and enrichment, by a very wide margin.

The rest of your post has some truth, from certain perspectives.

[KaiserJeep]

I don't think that I had equal opportunities with a rich brat who went to an Ivy League school either.

But I have been paying taxes for 46 years, ever since my first teenaged part time jobs. I paid for "The War On Poverty", new schools, Headstart programs, various jobs programs, "The War On Drugs", Food Banks, counseling of all types, etc. etc. Our tax dollars have paid for endless opportunities that I certainly never had. I was the oldest of six kids in my family, all of whom work for a living.

It seems to me that our society has bent over backwards to help the inner city slums, and that they are worse now than they ever were before. Detroit looks like a war was fought there, St. Louis, Philadelphia, Harlem, Watts, New Orleans, Oakland, etc. are clearly getting worse and worse.

Time to try something different, pouring an endless stream of money into the inner cities is not working. It may not seem so, but I believe that giving things to people is an oppressive act. It is why there are both inner city slums and an endless supply of upper class drones who live on trust funds and never manage to stop using drugs or alcohol and actually earn any income by working. The problem is not Racism, it is economic oppression brought about by an environment where somebody does not have to work to live.

[PrestonSturges]

Time to try something different, pouring an endless stream of money into the inner cities is not working. It may not seem so, but I believe that giving things to people is an oppressive act. It is why there are both inner city slums and an endless supply of upper class drones who live on trust funds and never manage to stop using drugs or alcohol and actually earn any income by working. The problem is not Racism, it is economic oppression brought about by an environment where somebody does not have to work to live.

Why do I have to keep pouring money into the biggest class of the poor: rural whites? All they do is pop pills and smoke meth. Throwing money at poor rural whites hasn't solved poverty. Why are we oppressing them like that? It's just mile after mile of poverty until you get to a gated community or country club, and they are just as dunk and drugged up as their as the folks living in shacks.

[Quinny]

The system is not set up for equal opportunity.

[MD]

Why do I have to keep pouring money into the biggest class of the poor: rural whites? All they do is pop pills and smoke meth. Throwing money at poor rural whites hasn't solved poverty. Why are we oppressing them like that? It's just mile after mile of poverty until you get to a gated community or country club, and they are just as dunk and drugged up as their as the folks living in shacks.

Post demonstrates that you are the wrong kind of racist.

[KaiserJeep]

MD, you made those judgements. Now please explain what the "right" kind of racist is, and how they differ from the "wrong" kind of racist.

[SeaGypsy]

Obviously the tongue in cheek nature of the conversation went over some people's heads...

[Cid_Yama]

The system is set up to provide equal opportunity for all

ROFLMAO!

Living in a bubble, just makes you stupid. Instead of swallowing the platitudes, open your eyes and take a look around for a change.

[KaiserJeep]

I have taken many looks around, I am ready to have a serious discussion about race, which you Yahoos are not. It's more likely that a race war will end our present society than a nuclear war IMHO. Those of you with a serious interest in the topic should start with one of the better-regarded short works which were written in the controversy following the publication of The Bell Curve: Intelligence and Class Structure in American Life in 1994. I'll even link you to a free copy so you have no excuses:

http://www.udel.edu/educ/gottfredson/reprints/2004socialconsequences.pdf

The growing possibility of a race war in America can be understood via an even shorter op ed column by one of the better known black scholars:

http://www.wnd.com/2013/10/black-mobs-and-the-coming-race-war/

While the incidents following the police shooting in Ferguson are best understood by reading a short book published last month:

http://www.amazon.com/Face-Race-Jared-Taylor/dp/0983891028/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1417336916&sr=1-1&keywords=Face+to+Face+with+Race

Before you deliberately banish an unpleasant thought from your mind, reflect that one of the first things to happen when the spiking price of oil makes food very very expensive, is a race riot, pretty much simultaneously from all the inner cities. It's a good enough reason to avoid living in or near cities entirely for the next few decades.

[SeaGypsy]

The same guy who reckons we all need his reading list. Last time for our beneficial understanding of a future for humanity in orbiting tin cans now so we may truly understand the race issue. One must guess there is something especially worthwhile in these links as it sure doesn't show in any of the posts by KJ.

[KaiserJeep]

SG, I'm still following my policy of failing to exchange insults with you for the good of the forum.

[SeaGypsy]

Giving lists if links is lazy. Tell us what you really think & let people respond to that, leave links until really necessary or demanded. Part of the CoC subtext from my memory, but just decent manners regardless...

[KaiserJeep]

I believe failing to read links is lazy. The first two are free, and the second is so short you only have to hit "page down" twice.

The third is an E-book that will cost you $4.95US and can be read with the free Kindle app.

What I think is that this is a serious matter, and potentially many people will die from race riots before they can starve, after the oil becomes expensive.

[SeaGypsy]

If I read every link I see online I would starve to death long before the oil runs out or race war envelopes society. Come on KJ give us a proper rant please. I promise to take such on merit.

[basil_hayden]

Can we move onto Polock jokes now?

Loves me some good Polock jokes, my state government is full of them.

[basil_hayden]

OK, you're all shy and politically correct so I'll kick off the fun.

How does every Polock joke start?

By looking over your shoulder.

[Cid_Yama]

The Bell Curve: Intelligence and Class Structure in American Life is a book funded and commissioned by the Eugenics group the Pioneer Fund.

For at least twenty-five years, Dr. Herrnstein pretended to be a scientist. The disguise apparently worked. There is no record that the administration of Harvard University, where he worked for so long, ever questioned the pretense. But Herrnstein was not a scientist; he was an apologist for racial inequality and class oppression. In the past, it might have been questioned whether he knew consciously that he was objectively a fascist propagandist. But with the publication of The Bell Curve, little doubt remains. The majority of Herrnstein's sources are the work of a cabal of pseudoscientists whose primary motive appears not to be scientific truth, but the advancement of a white supremacist and fascist agenda. In a 1971 article on the IQ (intelligence quotient), published in the prestigious US magazine, Atlantic Monthly, Herrnstein was already claiming that "the tendency to be unemployed may run in the genes of a family about as certainly as bad teeth do now. . . . As the wealth and complexity of human society grow, there will be precipitated out of the mass of humanity a low-capacity residue that may be unable to master the common occupations. . ."

Simply put, Herrnstein's claim is that the working class tends toward poverty because they are genetically inferior, and the exploiting class tends towards wealth because they are biologically superior. That the wealthiest individuals in industrialized western society are overwhelmingly white does not go unnoticed by Herrnstein: the genes of the upper class are the genes of white people, and so the language of class oppression and racism comes together in classic fascist style.

In the same article, Herrnstein reveals his support for the most naked forms of political reaction: "It is hard to argue that the "class struggle" can be resolved by a redistribution of wealth and capital, if it should turn out that something more than economics distinguishes the contending classes." Not only is Herrnstein scornful of the basis of socialist revolution, he is equally opposed to Jefferson and "the vision of a classless society [that] was the keystone of the Declaration of Independence."

Given this background, it comes as no surprise that The Bell Curve claims that class division is based on genetic differences, that black people are biologically inferior to whites, or that much of the basis for these claims arises from pro-fascist sources. Many of the scientists referred to by Herrnstein as authorities have been connected to a journal called Mankind Quarterly. The founder and editor of this journal, Robert Gayre, was a champion of apartheid and has stated his belief that blacks are worthless. Other prominent scientists associated with the journal have included the anti-Semite and racist Henry Garrett of the White Citizens Council, Corrado Gini, a leading biologist in Mussolini's Italy and author of The Scientific Basis of Fascism, and Ottmar von Verschuer, a mentor of Josef Mengele and a race scientist in Nazi Germany.

Even more significantly, Mankind Quarterly has been controlled by Roger Pearson for the last 25 years. Pearson was a leader of the pro-fascist Northern League, which included a number of former Nazi SS officials, and a member of the World Anti-Communist League, described by former member Geoffrey Stewart-Smith as a collection of "nazis, fascists, anti-Semites, and vicious racists."

The link between The Bell Curve and the racist and fascist group surrounding Mankind Quarterly is not accidental. Murray and Herrnstein acknowledge the guidance and literature of Richard Lynn, a professor of psychology in Northern Ireland. Lynn is an associate editor of Mankind Quarterly, whose work is cited in The Bell Curve no less than twenty-four times. Murray and Herrnstein note Lynn's assertion that the IQ of blacks in Africa is 70, at the low end of what is considered educably retarded. Although Lynn maintains that an IQ of 70 is a valid approximation of black IQ throughout Africa, it is based on a single 1989 study of 1000 sixteen-year-olds using the South African Junior Aptitude Test.

Furthermore, the actual author of this 1989 study was not Lynn but Dr. Ken Owen, who maintained explicitly that the results in no way suggested a biological inferiority of black people, but were the result of poorer education of black children under the racist system of apartheid. Yet both Lynn, and Murray and Herrnstein, insist on drawing racist implications from the Owen study, and from other such reports conducted under apartheid.

The Bell Curve serves neither truth nor the people. Who then does it serve? Part of the answer lies in the fact that Mankind Quarterly is funded by the Pioneer Fund, established in 1937 by the U.S. millionaire Wickliffe Draper and other supporters of Nazi Germany. In the 1950s and '60s, the Pioneer Fund aligned itself with white racists opposed to education desegregation. Its leaders sat on the notorious House Un-American Activities Committee. Pioneer Fund money has supported such psychologists as Arthur Jensen and, in Canada, Philippe Rushton, both of whom claim that black people are genetically inferior to whites in intelligence, and the racist physicist William Shockley, who proposed a scheme to pay black people to have themselves voluntarily sterilized.

From the beginnings of the Pioneer Fund in the 1930s, to the publication of Murray and Herrnstein's present book, the message is the same: white people are the intellectual master race, America must be kept free of the genetic pollution of the Third World. The Bell Curve, and the vigorous marketing campaign that has made it somewhat of a bestseller, is an attempt to legitimize the social policies that make fascism possible.

link

This mailbox service in Manhattan is the official address for the Pioneer Fund. There is no office. The fund's president and four directors avoid publicity and rarely talk to journalists. Ever since 1937, the Pioneer Fund has promoted the study of racial purity as a an ideal. Over the past 10 years, according to public documents, the Pioneer Fund contributed $3.5 million to researchers cited in The Bell Curve.

Psychologist Arthur Jensen received $1.1 million from the Pioneer Fund. Twenty five years ago, he started writing that blacks may be genetically less intelligent than whites. Psychologist Philippe Rushton received $656,000. He says his researchers show small genitalia may be a sign of superior intelligence. Psychologist Richard Lynn, $325,000 from the fund. He has written that incompetent cultures should be phased out. Close to half the footnotes citing authors who support The Bell Curve's most controversial chapter that suggests some races are naturally smarter than others, refer to Pioneer Fund recipients.

link

KaiserJeep, you are not only a racist, you are posting links to Eugenics propaganda.

[Quinny]

Sea Gypsy & Cid - I love the way you're just so much quicker off the mark than me. It's really nice there is intelligent life out there in the forumosphere!

[KaiserJeep]

I understand what the Politically Correct answers are. I was taught them in school like everyone else. But now you are touching upon the reason that the results of R&D on human intelligence have been suppressed ever since about 2001 when preliminary results from the Human Genome Project were published.

The suppressed research involving genetics and intelligence survived the peer review process, it did not survive the PC police.

If you don't believe in the R&D but do believe in anything published by a Democratic PAC like People's Voice, then I question YOUR intelligence.

Better yet, dig up some published and peer reviewed papers that do demonstrate no differences in intelligence based upon the new understandings of race. I'll read them, because I am not prejudiced, I like to examine both sides of an issue. But I'm not holding my breath for such material, as I believe it does not exist.

The latest research shows that the center of each racial intelligence bell curve are converging upon a central number, by the way. The HGP told us why: when DNA was interpreted based upon the decade the donor was born in, there were greater numbers of hybrids and less genetic diversity in younger subjects. Which information is not very useful, because at least another 4000 years will be needed before there are no noticeable morphological differences between human races. We don't have enough oil for that much travel, the process will never be complete.

Of the countless explanations given for the poor performance and poor behavior of blacks in the US, one of them dares not speak its name: Low intelligence.

Yet it fits all the evidence. It explains why Africa never built cities, why it did not invent writing, why there was no African Fifth-Century Athens. It explains why Rhodesia, prosperous and an exporter of food when run by whites, fell immediately into hunger and barbarism when whites left. It explains the dysfunction of black societies from Africa to Haiti to Detroit. It explains why blacks invariably score far below whites and Asians on tests of IQ, on the SATs, GREs, on entrance and promotion exams for fire and police departments.

It explains the need for affirmative action and for departments of Black Studies in universities when black students can’t handle real courses. It explains why the gap in academic achievement never closes. It explains the criminality, the violence, the poor impulse control, the dependency on welfare, the unemployment, and the inability to integrate themselves into a high-tech society. It explains the constant scandals involving teachers in black schools giving students the answers on standardized tests.

Further, it explains why none of the programs intended to raise performance of blacks in the schools ever work. Head Start didn’t work. Integrated schools didn’t work, nor segregated schools, nor black schools with white teachers nor black schools with black teachers. Expensive laboratories and free computers didn't work. Schools run entirely by blacks with very high per-student expenditure (Washington, DC for example) didn’t work. There is no indication that anything at all will ever work. Low intelligence is the obvious explanation. There is precious little counterevidence.

Endless evasions seek to avoid the unavoidable. Tests are biased, all tests without exception. Africa is primitive because of colonialism, or for geographic reasons, or because the natives liked hunting and gathering. Detroit is largely illiterate because of slavery, or low self-esteem, or institutional racism, which seems to mean undetectable racism. On and on.

If the consequences didn’t affect others, it would be needless, even cruel, to mention cognitive deficits. But they do affect society, very damagingly. They result in the enstuipidation of schools to which the bright go, and cripple the high-end brains upon which the prosperity of the United States depends. They result in Fergusons.

Among people who study intelligence, the racial disparity is not debated. It is evident, accepted. I suspect that it is evident also to many thoughtful liberals who fear the question: If we admit the obvious, what now? And would they be invited to any more cocktail parties of the politically correct?

And so, if psychometrists state the truth publicly, they are shouted down and said to be racists, bigots, and “pseudo-scientists.” They are not. Rather they are highly intelligent and competent statisticians, far more aware than the public of possible sources of error. The achievements of blacks closely fit the predictions that come out of psychometrics.

http://www.fredoneverything.net/Ferguson2.shtml

I'll share with you the gist of the HGP intelligence R&D, from a researcher who recognized 23 distinct human races based upon unique DNA sequences: the Ashkenazi Jews of Europe topped the human intelligence scale, and the next three racial groups in order of declining intelligence were all three Asian. Then there was a mixed bag of Asian, Caucasian, and Black races. Bringing up the bottom were the Australian Aborigines, a full half standard deviation (8 IQ points) below the Africans who were one standard deviation (15 IQ points) below the various European and Asian races.

Anybody who has ever bred dogs for intelligence - which is a common practice in many breeds - understands that genetics and intelligence are related. It is simply not PC to discuss it when the topic is humans and not dogs. But I would rather have a dialogue, no matter how controversial, than a Race War.

Don't some of you have enough backbone to discuss this? Or will you too label me a racist, and then slink away?