asg70 wrote:BTW, I saw a video today that China is already plowing ahead with battery swaps. They can do this because they have a car platform out there with a standardized battery form-factor. Expect to see a lot MORE innovation taking place in China than elsewhere just because when they decide to do something they just rush ahead and do it.
evilgenius wrote:The future looks electric. When will charging everything locally become important enough for the nation's (the US) electrical infrastructure to undergo a bulking up? Won't that bulking up, coming as it will along with all of the new technologies, change the very nature of the way we build?
It is, if the new lines were extra burly. They'll need to be able to carry more current, if everyone is going to be recharging their electric cars at home. Which makes me wonder how many local governments will bury vs. run that much more mess on poles? Some places could look a real mess, in the coming decades.EdwinSm wrote:Maybe not quite what the OP had in mind, but the country side were I am is looking less cluttered as the major electricity cables have been buried. It will, however, take time for the forest to grow up under where the old power lines used to be.
ROCKMAN wrote:Don't mean to sound mean: but energy "revolution"? Obviously some one has never been involved in a true revolution. We haven't even seen a serious protest let alone a "revolution" IMHO.
As far as the Chinese battery swap outs that would truly be great...if they still weren't so heavily dependent on burning coal to produce electricity. More then half their power comes from coal fired plants with 43 GW built since the start of 2018 and another 121 GW currently under construction. And according to a state run agency another 1,200 to 1,400 needed for long term supply stability. The only big energy "revolution" in China is replacing old coal fired plants with new more efficient plants...that all still burn COAL.
Outcast_Searcher wrote:Can they safely be rapidly swapped with some sort of damaging occurring only VERY rarely?
asg70 wrote:Outcast_Searcher wrote:Can they safely be rapidly swapped with some sort of damaging occurring only VERY rarely?
One of the big benefits of battery-swaps is you no longer own any one battery. It's just a service. You're guaranteed a good battery. If the batteries wear out or break, then the company doing the swaps assumes responsibility for taking the old batteries out of service. On the flipside, if you own a car and its battery pack wears out (presumably out of warranty) it effectively destroys the entire car's value.
I'm not saying swaps are a panacea or anything, but that it offers more than just convenience.
Nissan has a program now for replacing old Leaf packs at a relatively affordable price. Obviously it's expensive but it provides an avenue to extend the lifecycle of older cars (despite the fact they don't have active thermal management and therefore wear out packs quickly). As EVs start aging and as battery chemistries keep improving I really do think there should be a way to replace packs. Car ownership is very much wrapped up in depreciation and resale value. The depreciation of EVs due to pack degradation is the dirty little secret of BEV ownership vs. ICE. So much is written about how EVs save money on no maintenance while ignoring pack degradation. If the automakers had a program from the start to repurpose/recycle/replace spent packs in a way that didn't place the entire financial burden on car buyers it would really help.
This is also, by extension, why some carmakers are proposing simply renting the car via a subscription plan rather than owning it.
evilgenius wrote: I wonder if car battery packs near end stage are useful for a business purpose? There could develop a market, based upon that need. If the service model can keep up with that, it could be seamless to keep a good battery in your car.
asg70 wrote:Outcast_Searcher wrote:Can they safely be rapidly swapped with some sort of damaging occurring only VERY rarely?
One of the big benefits of battery-swaps is you no longer own any one battery. It's just a service. You're guaranteed a good battery. If the batteries wear out or break, then the company doing the swaps assumes responsibility for taking the old batteries out of service. On the flipside, if you own a car and its battery pack wears out (presumably out of warranty) it effectively destroys the entire car's value.
I'm not saying swaps are a panacea or anything, but that it offers more than just convenience.
Nissan has a program now for replacing old Leaf packs at a relatively affordable price. Obviously it's expensive but it provides an avenue to extend the lifecycle of older cars (despite the fact they don't have active thermal management and therefore wear out packs quickly). As EVs start aging and as battery chemistries keep improving I really do think there should be a way to replace packs. Car ownership is very much wrapped up in depreciation and resale value. The depreciation of EVs due to pack degradation is the dirty little secret of BEV ownership vs. ICE. So much is written about how EVs save money on no maintenance while ignoring pack degradation. If the automakers had a program from the start to repurpose/recycle/replace spent packs in a way that didn't place the entire financial burden on car buyers it would really help.
This is also, by extension, why some carmakers are proposing simply renting the car via a subscription plan rather than owning it.
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