[patience]

I'm in the southern Indiana hills and I love it. Lived here for a long time, and I ain't going anywhere. I know my way around, know all the people, and yes, we have our share of stinkers, like everywhere else. But with fewer people than cities, it's a lot easier to sort 'em out!

My firm belief has always been to find your bugout spot, and make your home there, for good.

[BigTex]

It was like today pretty much from about 1978-1982.

I don't know what everyone's complaining about.

[VMarcHart]

When will you know it's time to blow this popsicle stand and abandon your job and happy home and grab your groceries and head for the hills?

When the National Guard knocks on my door with a loaded automatic weapon and handcuffs.

[charliebrownout]

We couldn't head for the hills if we wanted to right now.

I will say, should the economy hold up, I'm seriously investigating the possibility of saving toward the purchase of what some call a "hobby farm".

If we EVER pull out of debt, and if we EVER manage to purchase land of any sort it will be land to facilitate our (and our children's) freedom from the system.

If I can pull it off (which I doubt) my children will become the sort of adults who can cover their needs (food, shelter, hygene) without boatloads of help from a world like the one we have now.

[Quagmire]

Does anyone know of any research done on the Jews in the '30's? Who left and why? What made them leave when others stayed? Maybe there is an answer there?

Yes. I just read "No Time To Mourn" for this very reason. The answers were haunting to say the least. There was massive denial, even though some of those who climbed out of the death pits made their way back to the towns to warn the others. They were not believed, except by a few. These were the ones who left, or chose to stay in the ghettos and figured out how to smuggle in arms and create a resistance from within.
After all, the truth was just too awful to be believed by the vast majority. Most could not comprehend the enormity and gravity of the situation.... "Just be a good citizen, do what you're told, co-operate, and things will eventually get better."
This book was written by one of the few who chose to flee to the forests and fight.

snippet of review:
"The author was the only one of his immediate family to escape the Holocaust, his accounts are moving and more than once did I find myself having to reread a paragraph or two to realize that what I'm reading is actually written there. Details of life under German occupation and in a German ghetto, running away from a ghetto and stumbling into the forests in seek of rumored Partisans. Finding them and other groups of entire families as they try to make the best of the situation as they struggle to survive in the forests and wilderness of Eastern Europe while the Germans and their collaborators keep an ever watchful eye out for them. Joining a Partisan group and giving battle to the Germans and those who are helping them by betraying their former friends and neighbors, all of this is recounted with the utmost feeling and, in my opinion, honesty."

and

"It is estimated that there were approximately twenty-five thousand Jews that escaped to the forests during the Holocaust.
The True Story of a Jewish Partisan Fighter states that many historians dismiss the plight of Jewish partisan resistance as inconsequential due to the fact that there were small numbers who survived as compared to the millions who were murdered in the Holocaust. However, these historians fail to understand the enormity of their struggle. As he most appropriately asserts: "The question should not be, why did more Jews not resist, but rather, how, under the circumstances, was any resistance possible at all?"

Take heed and learn from the past, folks. This should be required reading. Also the DVD "The Partisans of Vilna" deals with the same subject. Very moving documentary.
Quag

[BigTex]

While we're on the subject of doomer literature and history, for anyone who hasn't read Cormac McCarthy's "The Road", it's like putting a couple of big donuts on your doomer bat while you're getting loose in the on-deck circle.

After reading it, you'll feel like you're ready for anything, though you'll be tempted to drive straight to the grocery store to see if it's still open and if it is you will want to buy everything they have.

[Pops]

After reading it, you'll feel like you're ready for anything, though you'll be tempted to drive straight to the grocery store to see if it's still open and if it is you will want to buy everything they have.

Or at least a P-38 and a wrench to fit your local shopping cart wheels.

[CrudeAwakening]

While we're on the subject of doomer literature and history, for anyone who hasn't read Cormac McCarthy's "The Road", it's like putting a couple of big donuts on your doomer bat while you're getting loose in the on-deck circle.

After reading it, you'll feel like you're ready for anything, though you'll be tempted to drive straight to the grocery store to see if it's still open and if it is you will want to buy everything they have.

I'm part way through it at the moment, BT. I'm thinking I really should have chosen something more uplifting right now.

I borrowed it from a friend, who has, until now, been immune to my doomer prognostications, but reading it has spooked the crap out of him and he no longer snickers at my canned food collection.

[Consensi]

What should we city dwellers be watching? What is OUR "canary in the coal mine"?

For me it is the very first instance of the outbreak of hostilities with Iran. Considering the fact that Iran has the ability to eliminate the flow of up to 30% of the worlds oil is something I take very seriously. If there ever will be a preview of Post Peak Oil conditions 20 years from now, that will be it.

When it happens expect to see empty grocery store shelves, abandoned cars and trucks along the streets, power blackouts, and hungry, frightened, and bewildered city dwellers roaming about.

When the first missile takes off in the direction of Iran, I git... No questions asked.

[WyoDutch]

With "US" playing the part of the Tar Baby in Iraq and Afghanistan, there aren't enough deployable troops here at home to make a pissants impact. The militarized poe-leece that the feds have created in every hamlet across the land have their own family and skins to think about. (Recall how during Katrina.... a substantial number of poe-leece abandoned their posts and evacuated with the families. I'm sure that didn't go un-noticed at the seats of power.)

Personally, I think the time may be coming when the politicians and the power brokers are the ones "heading for the hills" as they see the peasants approaching with pitchforks in one hand, blazing torches in the other, and a "I'm mad as hell and I'm not gonna take it anymore" look on their faces.

Look at the politicians in America today...

Average net worth of our 100 Senators = $8.9 million

G.W. Bush net worth = Estimates from $8 to $135 million
Dick Cheney net worth = Estimates from $30 to $100 million
Henry Paulson net worth = $700 million
John McCain net worth = $40 million
Barak Obama net worth = Unknown, but 2007 income was $4.2 million

Do you honestly think that these folks have anything in common with us commoners? Do you think they can possibly view us as anything but working class cattle that need to be housed and fed so we can produce goods and services for them? Do you think they really give a hoot in hell about our hopes and aspirations?

Am I heading for the hills? Not this time... not this time.

Drawing (large)

[allenwrench]

Well spoken post WyoDutch

[VMarcHart]

Recall how during Katrina.... a substantial number of poe-leece abandoned their posts and evacuated with the families. I'm sure that didn't go un-noticed at the seats of power.

Good point. I guess if the Natl Guard knocks, I'll pretend not be home.

G.W. Bush net worth = Estimates from $8 to $135 million

Was this a typo? That's 16-17 times margin of error.

[Quagmire]

I bet Bush is anxious to get out of office so he can head to the hills of Paraguay.

" According to an Associated Press article that appeared in the Chicago Examiner last Friday," (March of this year) "Bush's younger brother Neil has recently visited Paraguay and met with that country's president Nicanor Duarte and a delegation from the Universal Peace Federation, a group associated with the Rev. Sun Myung Moon. "

"Reports first surfaced in the fall of 2006 that Bush has purchased land in Paraguay for such a compound. As the article says,
"An Argentine official regarded the intention of the George W. Bush family to settle on the Acuifero Guarani (Paraguay) as surprising, besides being a bad signal for the governments of the region. Luis D Elia, undersecretary for the Social Habitat in the Argentine Federal Planning Ministry, issued a memo... in which he spoke of the purchase by Bush of a 98,842-acre farm in northern Paraguay, between Brazil and Bolivia..."
"Bush is also believed to have purchased this land because of its massive supply of fresh water as part of his approach to global warming. The writer of this piece ominously asks,
You think he knows something we don't?""
.

[the48thronin]

Deliveries or certain goods such as food and fuel will start being delayed or cancelled. When you start seeing empty spaces on the shelves and gas stations out of gas or closing, that's your sign.

This could happen quickly. A couple years back a transportation strike in GB emptied shelves within 3 days.

I'm not going, neither are millions of my brothers and sisters. Being as YOUR STORE is one week from empty shelves without us, we feel a need to try to keep the country together in what ever shape we can in what ever method we can.

As to when to leave, when the trucks are not coming to your stores, you will either leave or eat each other.

ps the national guard will be WALKING after the first week.

[Jenab6]

I headed for the hills in 1998. I bought my mountain cabin in 2000. It's in the Alleghenies just north of Hillsboro, West Virginia. I've been prepping ever since. I can last maybe five years on stores. I can do without electricity, too. I've already made the adjustment to living without running water in the house, after the pump motor burned out and I decided not to get another one. By doing without I'm getting ahead on the powerdown learning curve. I've built myself an outhouse and engineered a no-electricity water system. I have thirty or so apple trees growing up, now over five years old, plus a dozen or so nut trees of similar age. And my area (Pocahontas County) has farms, animal ranches (cows, sheep, horses, goats) and locally grown animal feed. And a low population density, mostly hard working White people. We can make it, I think, if the government doesn't mess with the local economy. And, if it does, I'll just try to be very, very quiet and inconspicuous. I'm a mile from the highway and screened therefrom by a fold in the land. I'm letting the deciduous trees that sprout in my front yard grow. In a few more years, my house will be invisible even from the mountain trail that runs up past it.

[BigTex]

I headed for the hills in 1998. I bought my mountain cabin in 2000. It's in the Alleghenies just north of Hillsboro, West Virginia. I've been prepping ever since. I can last maybe five years on stores. I can do without electricity, too. I've already made the adjustment to living without running water in the house, after the pump motor burned out and I decided not to get another one. By doing without I'm getting ahead on the powerdown learning curve. I've built myself an outhouse and engineered a no-electricity water system. I have thirty or so apple trees growing up, now over five years old, plus a dozen or so nut trees of similar age. And my area (Pocahontas County) has farms, animal ranches (cows, sheep, horses, goats) and locally grown animal feed. And a low population density, mostly hard working White people. We can make it, I think, if the government doesn't mess with the local economy. And, if it does, I'll just try to be very, very quiet and inconspicuous. I'm a mile from the highway and screened therefrom by a fold in the land. I'm letting the deciduous trees that sprout in my front yard grow. In a few more years, my house will be invisible even from the mountain trail that runs up past it.

Do you have a good woman who can dress game, work a wash tub and who looks sexy in a flour sack dress?

If you don't you ought to keep an eye out for one before TSHTF.

[eastbay]

I headed for the hills in 1998. I bought my mountain cabin in 2000. It's in the Alleghenies just north of Hillsboro, West Virginia. I've been prepping ever since. I can last maybe five years on stores. I can do without electricity, too. I've already made the adjustment to living without running water in the house, after the pump motor burned out and I decided not to get another one. By doing without I'm getting ahead on the powerdown learning curve. I've built myself an outhouse and engineered a no-electricity water system. I have thirty or so apple trees growing up, now over five years old, plus a dozen or so nut trees of similar age. And my area (Pocahontas County) has farms, animal ranches (cows, sheep, horses, goats) and locally grown animal feed. And a low population density, mostly hard working White people. We can make it, I think, if the government doesn't mess with the local economy. And, if it does, I'll just try to be very, very quiet and inconspicuous. I'm a mile from the highway and screened therefrom by a fold in the land. I'm letting the deciduous trees that sprout in my front yard grow. In a few more years, my house will be invisible even from the mountain trail that runs up past it.

Do you have a good woman who can dress game, work a wash tub and who looks sexy in a flour sack dress?

If you don't you ought to keep an eye out for one before TSHTF.

You mean, one like this?


[web]http://www.angelpig.org/floursack/flour_sack_dress.gif[/web]

[BigTex]

Do you have a good woman who can dress game, work a wash tub and who looks sexy in a flour sack dress?

If you don't you ought to keep an eye out for one before TSHTF.

You mean, one like this?


[web]http://www.angelpig.org/floursack/flour_sack_dress.gif[/web]

Yes, except it needs to be filled with a woman.

[Duende]

Jenab6 wrote:

...mostly hard working White people.

[sarcasm]Phew... well, as long as those hard working people are white.[/sarcasm]

[thuja]

I am ready for the zombies baby. Staying in the city. I got my rainwater catchment, my big food garden, my chickens, my root cellar filled with food and my guns.

Oh and I know most of my neighbors and have a good network of friends when the collapse comes. I expect Argentina/Post-Soviet Union Russia/Cuba.

I do not expect Zimbabwe/Rwanda...yet...