[Snowrunner]

Breaking ice in the toilets? Sounds pretty life altering to the weenies us Americans have apparently become.

Not only Americans.
My "wakeup" to how deep we have fallen and how quickly forget, came last year sometime in January when there was frost making it down to California and destroying the *gasp* Strawberries.

On the local news they went to a "Choices" (Whole Foods) market and interviewed a guy who looked like he was in his 60s, and asked him what he would do when the price of the STrawberries he was holding would double.
His answer? "Well, I guess I have to pay it, I mean, what else could I do? You NEED this stuff."

No Dude, you do NOT need Strawberries in January (they taste like crap anyway).
But then again, I do remember that things like oranges weren't available in the summer, only in the Winter months when I grew up, likewise certain fruits and veggies you just couldn't get, and I am not THAT old.

We somehow managed to live back then, I am sure we'll be able to survive again.

[JJ]

yeah, then I won't have to listen to the customers b*tch because the oranges in July don't look like they were squeezed out of a tube. We've got a long way to go...

[forbin]

need strawberries in january ?
of course we do! every day there are countless magazines and articles banging on about 5 a day fruit that the collective now belives this
we used get away with Jam , the old fashioned way .

its sad really these people will buy oil and strawberries and like what ever the price - well maybe .
but they won't get any cheaper , then after a while it sinks in

I just expect it to take longer thats all . 70's we were mostly paid in cash each week , now it by the bank once a month ( and we have credit cards to spread the debt ) , just takes a little longer for the effect of high prices to hit....
Forbin

[CarlosFerreira]

Well, I've been giving this problem some consideration. Here in Portugal, a Mediterranean country, people are coming to work in shorts and short sleeves for a couple of months now. Nobody discusses PO, energy alternatives and everyone's just pissed off at the price of gas. It's a country that stalls whenever there's any significant rain and that has people crying whenever the temperature drops below 10º Celsius.

There's never any snow but in the highest mountainous resort.

Things should be OK, it's a blessed climate, but there's been a turning away from the normalness of life as it used to be. Tell people something's like it used to be in Grandma's time, and they'll find an excuse to go to the loo and never come back. No talk of holding back, going back, preserving, efficiency or living simple. We want more, all foot floored all the way to the abyss.

People, as someone pointed in another thread, are not ready for what's coming. Leader's don't know what's going on, and nobody dares say it won't be business as usual. 3 years before WW2, Churchill warned the Parliament that if they didn't act, later it would be more painful. They didn't, so it was.

Nobody will risk saying that it won't be business as usual, so people will be bickering over usual privileges until well on the way down. In 5 years time, peakoilers will still be seen as doomers. In 10 years time, most people still won't understand what's hit them.

And yes, you don't need strawberries in January.

[MarkJ]

We have plenty heating oil, kerosene and propane customers with poorly insulated, poorly weatherized homes with old windows and older grossly oversized, grossly inefficient, poorly designed, poorly maintained heat and hot water systems that burn well over 1,000 gallons per year.

One of our customers with a large uninsulated home and antique boiler burns over 3,000 gallons of heating oil per year, but it doesn't seem to bother them.

What's scary is the amount of people that *aren't* insulating, weatherizing, upgrading, servicing or replacing their heating systems.

[gnm]

One of our customers with a large uninsulated home and antique boiler burns over 3,000 gallons of heating oil per year, but it doesn't seem to bother them.

What's scary is the amount of people that *aren't* insulating, weatherizing, upgrading, servicing or replacing their heating systems.

Must be nice to be so rich as to shrug off that kind of expense... I wonder what the idiots will do when there are shortages or rationing and they can't get it at any price. I suspect then it will bother them.

Same here on the insulating etc... seems like the only one doing it that I know of is.... me....

-G

[Kingcoal]

Three years ago I ripped out my oil heater and put in a high efficiency NG unit. The gas company ran the line to my house for free, as long as I was putting in the NG heater. It was a very good move. I was hoping for the switch to pay for itself in about 5 years, which I felt was probably too optimistic at the time. NG and fuel oil were rising in tandom back then.

The switch has more than paid for itself already. NG, at least in the short term, looks pretty good. Had I stayed with oil, I'd literally be broke by now.

[Snowrunner]

What's scary is the amount of people that *aren't* insulating, weatherizing, upgrading, servicing or replacing their heating systems.

If I had to guess I'd say the reason for this is that most people aren't aware of the problem / waste.

How many people do you know, that aren't in the business, that know the latest and greatest technology in that field?

[CarlosFerreira]

If I had to guess I'd say the reason for this is that most people aren't aware of the problem / waste.

How many people do you know, that aren't in the business, that know the latest and greatest technology in that field?

Sorry, I disagree. Asked a friend, who had complained about how cold the winter had been, and how expensive heating had been all winter, if he was going for insulation. Bugger told me no, he's changing the car this summer.

I'll admit, he's got a somewhat old car, and needs it to work. But, it's a serviceable car...

[MarkJ]

What's scary is the amount of people that *aren't* insulating, weatherizing, upgrading, servicing or replacing their heating systems.

Same here on the insulating etc... seems like the only one doing it that I know of is.... me....

People are spending money on cars, trucks, SUVs, boats, snowmobiles, kitchen & bath remodels, stainless appliances, furniture, big screen televisions, tile, granite, marble, hardwood floors, fireplaces, pellet stoves, decks etc, but not on building envelope improvements.

When it comes to insulating, they say they can't afford it, or maybe next year.

How many people do you know, that aren't in the business, that know the latest and greatest technology in that field?

Nearly all our heating and heating fuels customers since we've been telling them for years about the benefits of properly sized, properly designed, high efficiency heat & hot water systems as well as the benefits of improving the building envelope. After educating our customers, many of them know more than some people in the business.

Some of our current customers were customers of my grandfather. He was telling them the same thing many years ago when fuel was much cheaper.