[Northern_Pike]

Hello.

A few months ago, I stumbled onto “peak oil” as a result of searching for facts to confirm or dispel my own thoughts about the rising fuel prices and food prices. I had not heard the term “peak oil.” I am not a scientist. I am not an educated man. I just had a “hunch,” almost a gut feeling, about these current problems.

So armed with some knowledge gleaned from my time in Iraq during a time of chaos and a decline of humanity, and my time as a truck driver, learning just how much our everyday lives depend on oil, and some very basic ideas of the laws of “supply and demand,” I struck out on the net to find facts related to my very own newly forming ideas. Imagine my surprise as I searched and found folks saying every thought and theory I was forming in my own mind, and so very much more, with the graphs and charts to back it up! If I could start to put the evidence together and draw conclusions about the causes of our current problems independently, and then find so many others that have drawn these same conclusions, then that is good enough for me. The logical answer for so many of the world’s dilemmas is peak oil!

Since I was seeking facts and figures to help me understand just exactly what the situation was, it was inevitable I would stumble onto the many experts and the many opinions on the subject, none more valuable than what can be found right here on peakoil.com. Thank you all for the wealth of invaluable information. I now fully understand the gravity of the current situation and how bad it might become.

Now armed with some facts, a sound theory, and with the knowledge that things are going to get worse not better, I have finally begun to open the eyes of my spouse as well. We are not fully leaving the grid until the grid leaves us, or until we are forced to, but when we must, we will be ready.

I apologize for not making this my very first post (alas, it is my second). But, I have been lurking and learning here for a while, and may find myself compelled to post from time to time. My trying to bring “peak oil” to the attention of others is not meeting with much success. I guess, the understanding of what we must soon face is difficult to grasp at best, and much more comforting to deny at worst.

- Pike

[Ferretlover]

Welcome to PeakOil.com, Pike. There are a wide variety of topics and we are indeed lucky to have quite a few terrific, well-informed posters! (Of course, we do have a few stinkers, too! )
The "How to Get Around this Site without losing Your Mind" thread is quite helpful (also in the Welcome Forum). If you have questions, feel free to ask any Moderator.
You will find that if people don't come looking for info on their own, they won't believe any of what is discussed here.

[Cashmere]

And another light bulb is energized.

Welcome aboard.

[joeltrout]

I am not an educated man.

I am glad you are here...don't get me wrong but I have to question your first post on another thread.

Dear Representative Stupak,
As a war veteran and patriotic American, I have never been more proud of America than I am at this moment. H. R. 3997, the legislation that proposes bilking the American taxpayers to pay for the irresponsible investments of others is beyond socialism; it is communism. Please continue to fight it, and defeat it.
--snip--
Is it the honest nature of any given vote that the voters continue to revote until an outcome favorable to the interests of the loser is achieved? As an American, I implore you to stand your ground, defend your post, and continue to protect your fellow Americans. Mr. Stupak, if you continue to vote for us like this, you can rest assured, we would continue to vote for you. I encourage you to proclaim that this transfer of wealth from Main St. to Wall St. shall not pass! The American people don’t want to pay for this bail out!
Sincerely,
An American
- Pike

If you are not an "educated man" especially in economics and financial markets, how do you know that passing the bill is a bad thing?
Just curious don't hate me.
joeltrout

[americandream]

As a South African schol aged child, I recollect sitting on our lawn chatting to the gardener. In the course of our conversation, I discovered that he was an extremely learned Marxist and I asked him what drew him to Marx.

Prophetically he spoke about the fact that we could build only so many highways, cars and other consumer goods with the resources we had as a nation and that the South African political paradigm was socially and economically too costly and would fall in due course.

He also remarked on the fact that there was no panacea to the problems that would arise as the nation as a whole had become addicted to an unsustainable and neurotic idea and that it would take the fire of self-awareness to bring about sustainable change.

Each man or woman would in time become aware of the true nature of his or her condition in other words. That's where you are at my friend and welcome to the new world.

[Cashmere]

If you are not an "educated man" especially in economics and financial markets, how do you know that passing the bill is a bad thing? Just curious don't hate me.

I think that's a pretty insulting response JT.

As a preliminary matter, "education" is not required to understand the basic presumption of what is being asked.
1. Take Taxpayer money.
2. Give it to the banks that created this problem.

Some people believe that giving money to the people who created this problem will result in curing the problem. It's the same logic that's applied when you give an arsonist a 5 gallon bucket of gasoline and a flame thrower to put out the house fire he started.

As a secondary matter, the sack-of-sh-t morons who YOU, Joel Trout, would no doubt describe as "educated" men - Bernanke, Paulson, GS execs - were swearing up and down just a few months back that this mess was contained, problem over. They are clearly either educated in the wrong area, they are liars, or their education is worthless to us.

Based on that, I'd take the OP's opinion over theirs, and yours, right now and forever.


To the OP -
Stop being so damn "proud" of your country. We should all be very embarrassed at how our country has behaved and how its citizens have allowed it to behave.

Be proud of the American ideal. Be proud of the founding fathers and their principles of living. Be proud. Be proud of whatever American spirit is left in a few of us.

But for G-d's sake, stop being proud of your country. It's pride like that that allowed the gov to pull off 911 without so much as a loud peep from the proud Americans who are too proud to consider that 911 was an inside job cause for war.

[americandream]

I am not an educated man.

I am glad you are here...don't get me wrong but I have to question your first post on another thread.

Dear Representative Stupak,
As a war veteran and patriotic American, I have never been more proud of America than I am at this moment. H. R. 3997, the legislation that proposes bilking the American taxpayers to pay for the irresponsible investments of others is beyond socialism; it is communism. Please continue to fight it, and defeat it.
--snip--
Is it the honest nature of any given vote that the voters continue to revote until an outcome favorable to the interests of the loser is achieved? As an American, I implore you to stand your ground, defend your post, and continue to protect your fellow Americans. Mr. Stupak, if you continue to vote for us like this, you can rest assured, we would continue to vote for you. I encourage you to proclaim that this transfer of wealth from Main St. to Wall St. shall not pass! The American people don’t want to pay for this bail out!
Sincerely,
An American
- Pike

If you are not an "educated man" especially in economics and financial markets, how do you know that passing the bill is a bad thing?
Just curious don't hate me.

Are you inferring that it takes "education" to understand these facets of daily life which are there to be gleaned if one pays attention?

[americandream]

Well put Cash. It's an idea that makes us men. Men who are willing to lay down our lives. Not the cement and mortar it takes to actualise that idea. America was founded on the ideas of fairness for all and equality of man, by men who had seen and experienced the rank foulness of inherited privilege. Thes are noble ideas and worthy of self-sacrifice. Not the den of thieves who have corralled this nobleness as their own.

[joeltrout]

No it doesn't require education to know what is going on but it helps a ton especially when people who have spent their entire adult lives studying economics/financial markets are the ones teaching you.
joeltrout

[joeltrout]

1. Take Taxpayer money.
2. Give it to the banks that created this problem.

Hahaha if only it was that simple.

That is the problem. Everyone (who doesn't understand the markets) thinks it is simply that. Giving taxpayer money to stuff wall streets fat wallets. It is way beyond that.
joeltrout

[americandream]

No it doesn't require education to know what is going on but it helps a ton especially when people who have spent their entire adult lives studying economics/financial markets are the ones teaching you.

Agreed up to a point. However, I suspect that there is many a wiser man out there than me who has come to where he is through the hard knocks of life.

[joeltrout]

Agreed up to a point. However, I suspect that there is many a wiser man out there than me who has come to where he is through the hard knocks of life.

Wiser yes, Happier yes, More successful in the things that matter like family, friends, reputation, etc...yes

But

The hard knocks of life don't prepare you to run the financial markets of the most powerful country in the world.
joeltrout

[americandream]

Agreed up to a point. However, I suspect that there is many a wiser man out there than me who has come to where he is through the hard knocks of life.

Wiser yes, Happier yes, More successful in the things that matter like family, friends, reputation, etc...yes. But. The hard knocks of life don't prepare you to run the financial markets of the most powerful country in the world.

I don't think Pike here is applying for a job with the Fed or Treasury, as far as I can glean from his postings. I seems to me that he is taking a position on the way he perceives his country to be run and the last time I looked, there weren't any formal qualifications required for that. Within that context, I would have to defer to my intellectual superiors, whether they be formally educated or not. But as a for example, with a tax lawyer, yes I agree that university and law college are essential prerequisites to offering educated advice/service.

[Cashmere]

No it doesn't require education to know what is going on but it helps a ton especially when people who have spent their entire adult lives studying economics/financial markets are the ones teaching you.
joeltrout

How do you explain Bernanke's and Paulson's complete inability to see this "crisis" coming as of a few months ago?

Me, Roc, DP, and virtually every member of Ticker Forum saw this coming for the last year or two. Not a PhD in economics to be found.

Like I said - if your argument is that educated economists like Paulson and Bernanke are more reliable sources for suggested courses of action going forward, then I'd ask, "what do the inside walls of a rectum actually look like?"

[Northern_Pike]

I am not an educated man.

I am glad you are here...don't get me wrong but I have to question your first post on another thread.

If you are not an "educated man" especially in economics and financial markets, how do you know that passing the bill is a bad thing? Just curious don't hate me.

Nah, I have no hate at all for you, joeltrout. I don't know you well enough to hate you yet. I may lack formal higher education, however, that doesn't mean I am stupid, completely ignorant, or live under a rock. I may only know just enough to be dangerous, but I am o.k. with that. A few things I know about this bail out plan bother me enough not to favor it.
1. No one is 100% certain the 700 billion dollar bail out will even work. There are many saying the world economy may slip into a Global Great Depression regardless of a yes vote in Congress for a bail out.

2. No one is 100% certain the 700 billion dollar bail out is actually needed. There are many saying the world economy might recover over time without a 700 billion dollar bailout. Even the amount "700 Billion Dollars" was picked completely at random, simply because they needed a really big number to amaze, confuse, and scare the masses. Well, I'm afraid the wizards behind the curtain have failed to impress us.

3. I can’t think of a single example of what the Federal Government can manage better than a private corporation bent on turning a profit, yet, some would have us believe the Government can take over these failed businesses and turn them profitable over time? That is a laugh.

4. I don’t make enough money to pay very high taxes or even any taxes, but my boss does, and he might find paying both my wages and higher taxes mutually exclusive.

5. The notion of taking money out of the pockets of the taxpayers of “Main St.” to turn around and bail out “Wall St.” makes no sense. Now, I know there are those that claim this is really a rescue of “Main St.” itself. Well, in that case, taking the money out of the pockets of “Main St.” taxpayers to turn around and use that same money to save those same “Main St.” folks makes even less sense.

6. Any time Barney Frank, Sean Hannity, George Bush, Newt Gingrich, Barak Obama, John McCain, and especially Nancy Pelosi all agree on something, I have my doubts about it being in my best interest.

7. Robin Hood, stole from the rich to give to the poor, I don’t support that, noble as it may sound. Why then would I support stealing from the poor to give to the rich?

8. Prolonging the inevitable collapse of society and dragging it out over many, many years, may actually be counter productive in my estimation. A brief and massive die off may mean those left can settle into a sustainable future void of pretenses much quicker and easier.

9. Calling on the taxes of others to pay off and prop up faulty investments is not capitalism, is not American, and is not desirable, no matter how dire the consequences of inaction might be.

10. The dying off of weak institutions and corporations, leaving only the strong and the intelligently created ones to survive, just seems to make great sense.

Perhaps I am not educated enough to "get it." Perhaps I never will no matter how well it is explained to me. But, as it stands, no one has convinced me in any fashion, how dire this need for a "bail out" is. Simply saying "We really, really need this money, and we need it now!" isn't enough to make it true to me.
- Pike

[kpeavey]

A structured education is not a requirement for someone to understand what is going on in the world. Northern_Pike developed his ideas on his own, then used further research to find supporting documentation. That's a point in his favor as far as I'm concerned. A self-taught individual will have a deeper understanding of an issue as a result of the internal motivation to learn. Stack a few up against a lecture hall of college boys, they'll hold their own. This Pike guy has collected his feces in a single location.

[Northern_Pike]

To those that gave a kind word, at least in support of my being allowed to have my own opinion, I thank you for that.

To those most knowledgable economic stategists and big market investors that are so well educated on the matter, I say this:

My "big money" investments as of late include a combat shotgun w/ ammo, ammo for my rifle, good quality boots for the entire family, bicycles for same, and plenty of dried beans and rice for a long time. I'm also keeping our 4x4 SUV's gas tank topped off, and the vehicle full of good quality tools(spade, axe, etc.). It seems all my investments have recently gone up substantially in value, and I project will continue to do so in the future. How are your investments doing?

-Pike

[kpeavey]

My recent investment in a woodstove has not yet produced results, but winter is coming and it looks promising.

I opened a jar of chicken I canned in March. I experienced an immediate return in the form of a delicious hot meal. I have several more jars on the shelf, and that investment is holding steady. I expect it to hold its value for a few more years.

The solar hot water rig produced yet another hot bath today, as well as all I needed to do the dishes. After 4 years of faithful service, this thing shows no sign of dropping in value.

[Cashmere]

My "big money" investments as of late include a combat shotgun w/ ammo, ammo for my rifle, good quality boots for the entire family, bicycles for same, and plenty of dried beans and rice for a long time. I'm also keeping our 4x4 SUV's gas tank topped off, and the vehicle full of good quality tools(spade, axe, etc.). It seems all my investments have recently gone up substantially in value, and I project will continue to do so in the future.

Concur that this is the wisest first place to put your money.

[Northern_Pike]

Attaboy, kpeavey! Another sound investment strategy is hard at work for the investor. God, I love it!

- Pike