Hermes wrote:yesplease wrote:Emissions are caused by the creation of anything
Wrong, and you know it.
Oh, oh wait. I know what you're going to say. Something like the creation of a loincloth gives off emissions because of the deer farting that the leather was taken from.
Loincloth production isn't exactly at an all time high in case you didn't notice, and guess what, everything created in a society where energy is fossil fuel intensive is fossil fuel intensive. Be it a fork or a loincloth from a farmed deer.
Hermes wrote:yesplease wrote:but emissions from forks generally aren't looked at when determining air quality because it's the factory making the forks that's producing emissions, not the forks themselves.
No. Emissions aren't looked at for forks BECAUSE FORKS DON'T NEED AN ENERGY SOURCE TO BE USED!!!!!
No. Emissions aren't looked at because emissions are tabulated by source. A fork requiring how ever much in the way of SOx/NOx/etc for production does not emit that at it's point of use. The EPA/CARB aren't going to regulate emissions from the fork, but from the factory making the fork. Similarly, the EPA/CARB are not going regulate emissions from a vehicle producing no emissions, they are going to regulate emissions from the factory making the vehicle and energy generation facilities making energy for it's use. ZEV does not refer to emissions over a vehicle's life-cycle, that would be specified in a LCA (Life Cycle Analysis). They're called different things for a reason. If you wish to (seriously) discuss the emissions associated w/ EV operations over their lifetime you wouldn't embark on a semantic holy crusade about whether or not they
should be called ZEVs, which is your opinion and fine, but you would (correctly) point out that even as a ZEV, given a LCA of them their emissions, plenty of crap cans still be generated at a power plant far away from the vehicle. This would also require you to do some research regarding the electricity generation profile of specific regions as well comparing the emissions of a bunch of small mobile sources compared to a few large stationary ones, so feel free to ignore the actual meaning of the term for what you're referring to and continue to rant on the information superhighway street corner in your deerskin loincloth.
Hermes wrote:A "Zero Emission Vehicle" ... is an attempt to divorce the end-user from having to think about where the resources came from in order to make the thing go, particularly because transportation is so incredibly energy intensive.
No. A "Zero Emission Vehicle" is simply a term stating that the vehicle does not emit emissions at it's
point of use, nothing more.
Hermes wrote:Divorcing the user from the energy needed to make the thing run coddles those who want the warm fuzzy glow of believing they're not having a negative impact on the Earth by their participation in all of this insanity around us.
Calling them "Electric Cars" is one thing, but "Zero Emission Vehicles"? It's flagrant.
It's not flagrant, it's English. There is nothing about divorcing the user from anything wrt the term ZEV. All it means is that there aren't emissions at the point of use, nothing more, nothing less.
Wikipedia wrote:A zero-emissions vehicle, or ZEV is a vehicle itself that produces no emissions or pollution from the vehicle when stationary or operating.
Zero emissions only refers to emissions at the point of use from the vehicle, not anything else. What you're referring to is called a LCA. Learn it, live it, love it, post it!