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NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

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NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby mattduke » Tue 21 Apr 2009, 20:46:17

So why shouldn’t the Fed just keep cutting interest rates? Why not lower the target interest rate to, say, negative 3 percent?

At that interest rate, you could borrow and spend $100 and repay $97 next year. This opportunity would surely generate more borrowing and aggregate demand.

The problem with negative interest rates, however, is quickly apparent: nobody would lend on those terms. Rather than giving your money to a borrower who promises a negative return, it would be better to stick the cash in your mattress. Because holding money promises a return of exactly zero, lenders cannot offer less.

Unless, that is, we figure out a way to make holding money less attractive.

At one of my recent Harvard seminars, a graduate student proposed a clever scheme to do exactly that. (I will let the student remain anonymous. In case he ever wants to pursue a career as a central banker, having his name associated with this idea probably won’t help.)

Imagine that the Fed were to announce that, a year from today, it would pick a digit from zero to 9 out of a hat. All currency with a serial number ending in that digit would no longer be legal tender. Suddenly, the expected return to holding currency would become negative 10 percent.

That move would free the Fed to cut interest rates below zero. People would be delighted to lend money at negative 3 percent, since losing 3 percent is better than losing 10.

Of course, some people might decide that at those rates, they would rather spend the money — for example, by buying a new car. But because expanding aggregate demand is precisely the goal of the interest rate cut, such an incentive isn’t a flaw — it’s a benefit.

The idea of making money earn a negative return is not entirely new. In the late 19th century, the German economist Silvio Gesell argued for a tax on holding money. He was concerned that during times of financial stress, people hoard money rather than lend it. John Maynard Keynes approvingly cited the idea of a carrying tax on money. With banks now holding substantial excess reserves, Gesell’s concern about cash hoarding suddenly seems very modern.

If all of this seems too outlandish, there is a more prosaic way of obtaining negative interest rates: through inflation. Suppose that, looking ahead, the Fed commits itself to producing significant inflation. In this case, while nominal interest rates could remain at zero, real interest rates — interest rates measured in purchasing power — could become negative. If people were confident that they could repay their zero-interest loans in devalued dollars, they would have significant incentive to borrow and spend.

Having the central bank embrace inflation would shock economists and Fed watchers who view price stability as the foremost goal of monetary policy. But there are worse things than inflation. And guess what? We have them today. A little more inflation might be preferable to rising unemployment or a series of fiscal measures that pile on debt bequeathed to future generations.


N. Gregory Mankiw is a professor of economics at Harvard. He was an adviser to President George W. Bush.
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby Tyler_JC » Tue 21 Apr 2009, 21:07:29

Why, exactly, would anyone want to listen to an economic adviser of President Bush?

That's like trusting Bernie Madoff's accountant to handle your 401K.
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby mlit » Tue 21 Apr 2009, 22:03:08

I kind of think that most of the money not in motion has no serial number as its fiat digital money sitting in banks. If you want blood in the streets just try telling people we've cancelled some of their cash as we wanted to encourage spending.

I wonder what percentage of 'economists' are legally retarded.
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby Tyler_JC » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 00:56:21

mlit wrote:I kind of think that most of the money not in motion has no serial number as its fiat digital money sitting in banks. If you want blood in the streets just try telling people we've cancelled some of their cash as we wanted to encourage spending.

I wonder what percentage of 'economists' are legally retarded.


He isn't actually suggesting that we destroy 1 in 10 dollars.

He's advocating inflation, naked money printing. The effect is the same.
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby mlit » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 01:00:03

Imagine that the Fed were to announce that, a year from today, it would pick a digit from zero to 9 out of a hat. All currency with a serial number ending in that digit would no longer be legal tender. Suddenly, the expected return to holding currency would become negative 10 percent.

That move would free the Fed to cut interest rates below zero. People would be delighted to lend money at negative 3 percent, since losing 3 percent is better than losing 10.

Of course, some people might decide that at those rates, they would rather spend the money — for example, by buying a new car. But because expanding aggregate demand is precisely the goal of the interest rate cut, such an incentive isn’t a flaw — it’s a benefit.


did I misread? Or is just assuming we dont understand forced inflation

They already are naked printing but since the banks arent loaning its not having the inflationary effects desired
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby yesplease » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 01:32:23

mlit wrote:They already are naked printing but since the banks arent loaning its not having the inflationary effects desired
Even naked printing in this case doesn't seem to be very inflationary, since the banks still have to pay back the loans to the fed, and since they aren't increasing loans, the only thing that could be inflationary, interest made on those loans, isn't even an issue.
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby Tyler_JC » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 01:39:32

yesplease wrote:
mlit wrote:They already are naked printing but since the banks arent loaning its not having the inflationary effects desired
Even naked printing in this case doesn't seem to be very inflationary, since the banks still have to pay back the loans to the fed, and since they aren't increasing loans, the only thing that could be inflationary, interest made on those loans, isn't even an issue.


The inflationary move comes when the Federal Government starts paying for its new spending programs with printed money.

Instead of draining private savings to fund government consumption, the government could simply use the printing press to "create" new dollars and use those to pay for programs.

Suddenly the public deficit ceases to be a drain on the economy and actually becomes a positive.

Every additional dollar of deficit is one more free printed dollar with which the government can buy goods and services.

The real value of each individual dollar would drop...but who's counting?
(certainly not the bureaucrats themselves!)
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby yesplease » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 02:21:46

In terms of running the printing presses, it's only inflationary if the new spending programs cost more than the old spending programs adjusting for changes in tax income (Clinton nabbed a few hundred billion a year by increasing taxes on those making over $350k/year or something like that). So far, if the dollar index is any indication, it looks like the current administration's spending is less that that of the last administration, so we aren't seeing massive inflation from the printing presses just yet.
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby Micki » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 04:39:09

That article was just plain dumb. For many reasons (and for some purpose I am sure).
We are not seeing price inflation yet for the simple reason that there is not enought willingness to create it yet. If the fed reserve for instance wanted to see the hoarded money being lent to increase velocity, they could refuse to rollover the loans or issue new loans unless part of it is lent out. And they could increase the number of banks and institutions that can borrow directly from fed. And treasury could simply increase selling of bonds to any imaginable amount. Tricky part is of course that if you overdo it you have Weimar in a blink. Once prices start moving you don't have to worry about hoarding, they will be all too keen to convert the hoarded cash to appreciating asset/commodity.
First of all however what the admin wants to do is keep long term dated interest rates down and they want to save wall street and big banking. It is focus on interest rates that has been the main target since Larry Summers wrote "gibsons paradox and the gold standard" (which also explains why gold price surpression is critical.). If you however put fed and treasury at a waypoint where they need to select the deflationary path or the inflationary it is all too obvious which one they will (already have) chose.
Everyone here is just so darn inpatient that if they don't see effects of something straight away it must not be there.
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby mattduke » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 07:46:36

Micki wrote:That article was just plain dumb.

These are the guys the regime uses to justify their actions.
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby Roy » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 10:30:32

economists crack me up.

Looking in the rear-view mirror to plot a course.

That works so damn well.

:lol:
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby lowem » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 10:37:46

So, when do the real monetary helicopter drops / B-52 carpet bombings start?
The Fed could send everyone a $100 billion cheque and let the fun begin ... :lol:
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby Micki » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 20:40:33

lowem wrote:So, when do the real monetary helicopter drops / B-52 carpet bombings start?
The Fed could send everyone a $100 billion cheque and let the fun begin ... :lol:

It is a guess work except for a few insiders. My uneducated guess though is that budget deficits will continue to be monetized and at some point there will be a tipping point when money starts gushing into real things. Fed of course claims they then can do tightening to prevent inflation from going wild but I am yet to be convinced they have the balls to use them. If they can't handle a depression now they won't want to do it in a year or two or five.
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby smallpoxgirl » Wed 22 Apr 2009, 21:42:34

lowem wrote:So, when do the real monetary helicopter drops / B-52 carpet bombings start?
The Fed could send everyone a $100 billion cheque and let the fun begin ... :lol:


Yeah. They're painting themselves into a corner, because they keep trying to lend money to banks that are deeply insolvent. The problem is, you can never borrow your way to solvency. The banks are staring straight at a charging rhino. Obviously they're not going to make new loans when they are a breath away from going tits up. At some point here we are going to have to have an organized liquidation and reorganization of these banks. Until then we're just rearranging deck chairs.
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby Kristen » Thu 23 Apr 2009, 01:17:43

Let's just change the rules completely! Opposites day could work. liabilities and assets are switched around, so suddenly, well, we're rich again! How much do you want to bet Geithner carries a bottle of xanax and a flask with him at all times?
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Re: NYT: It May Be Time for the Fed to Go Negative

Unread postby mattduke » Mon 27 Apr 2009, 22:52:51

Robert Murphy weighs in on this NYT piece.

http://mises.org/story/3432
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