[Ache]

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/news/a ... grads.html

School's out, surf's up, summer beckons. Time for college students to see if they can stay afloat in the worst economy their generation has known.

Young people are carrying a load heavier than they normally bear as they scatter from campuses, judging from an AP-mtvU poll that finds students anxious about their finances, job prospects after graduation and the pressures facing their folks back home.

Josh Donahue, 23, an Oregon State University economics graduate, is living on food stamps. First in his family with a university degree, he stays with relatives and scrapes even for a menial job instead of the bank gig he'd dreamed about.

"A degree in economics," he said, "doesn't really prepare you to understand the economy very well."

[TWilliam]

Ahhhh... nothin' like a healthy dose of Reality...

[Schmuto]

George Carlin: "All of this self-esteem bullshit robs children of the experience of failing until they get fired from their first job because they suck at it. Little Bobby never got to hear those character-building words, "you lost Bobby. You're a loser.""

Or something like that.

[pablonite]

"A degree in economics," he said, "doesn't really prepare you to understand the economy very well."

Is there any more proof required that the "educational system" is owned?

It's debt slavery and to somehow convince them to drop thousands on an "economics" education highlights the degree of brainwashing in America today. Of course a few will get lucky being able to afford a piece of paper confirming they are compliant, obedient left brain people but it does not bode well for the future of humanity.

[patience]

Yeah, the saying in engineering from 40 years ago was, first you get a degree, then you go to work and get an education. So true.

[TWilliam]

Yeah, the saying in engineering from 40 years ago was, first you get a degree, then you go to work and get an education. So true.

Yep. Same reason they say that lieutenants tend to die from friendly fire more often than hostile fire...

[Ache]

Corwin Burton, a sophomore at the University of Maryland, also on the Washington outskirts, gave up his apartment and moved back home when the tips dropped off at the bar he tends. Studying nano-engineering, he's confident the economy will rebound by the time he gets out of grad school.

"It always does," he said. "It's nowhere near bad enough to think that the country's going to explode and fail. The economy naturally cycles. I've studied enough economics to know that. It goes up, it goes back down."

[Ache]

In Grants Pass, Ore., Donahue wonders when it's going to go up. He regrets stretching his bachelor of science in economics over five years, thinking he'd be a financial analyst now if he'd finished school in four, before the crisis. Given the turmoil in the financial industry, however, it's questionable whether an entry job would still be there.

Sharing his $200 a month in food stamps with his aunt and uncle in lieu of rent, he's applying for work as a delivery man, a hotel clerk, a bank teller and a white-collar job in the insurance industry. He's planning on going to law school.

"Having a college degree and having to ask other people for help is not a funny thing," he said. "It's a little demoralizing."

[odegaard]

I never understood why Liberals Politicians keep on trying to push more people into college.
It is a cruel hoax. It would of been more kind and gentle to just punch people in the nose.

Sure a doctor, lawyer, or engineer will pay off their college debts.
But there's so many people out there with degrees like liberal arts, art history, and music appreciation. You know what's going to happen to those college graduates right?
They're just going to move back into mommy and daddy's house to collect free rent for the next 12 years as they *try* to pay off the credit card interest on that cheese pizza they ate in their freshman dorm room.

[3aidlillahi]

Sure a doctor, lawyer, or engineer will pay off their college debts.

Even then, you might not do so well. Didn't SPG say she only makes like $20,000 a year (granted it's out West)? That's hardly enough to pay down a couple hundred grand in student loans if she owes that much. Law firms dropped people like crazy. I've talked to former lawyers who've seen all of their friends with several years of experience get canned. Not too many people are safe unless if you go into specialized medicine.

---

Are there any other '09 grads out there?

As for me, there doesn't seem to be nearly as many entry-level jobs available now as there would have been last year. However, the market isn't completely dry for geology majors.

I've really thought about moving back with my parents even if I get a full-time job. That way I could say a few hundred a month, help out my parents and possibly persuade my parents to use their land for as much fruit/nut tree planting and gardening as possible. At least until I can save money for my own land.

Overall, it sucks for Americans. But given what people have gone through throughout history, I'd say we're still lucky - or at least I am. My parents still have decent jobs without lost wages or hours (my mom just got a $1500 bonus); they still have their home with a small plot of land with good soil; and I'm PO aware.

[Sixstrings]

I don't quite understand why students expect that holding a bachelor of arts degree equates to some kind of entitlement of success.

At some point a man must rise or fall according to his merit.

[Ainan]

Yeah, the saying in engineering from 40 years ago was, first you get a degree, then you go to work and get an education. So true.

Damn straight Patience! I'm currently working for a year in the IT industry as part of my degree. I didn't learn anything for the first 2 years at all! Of course all the lessons in 'work' are just as, if not more important than the skills. If I mess up at University, I get another shot at it, and another, and another, and if I still fail they would fricking pass me anyway. If I mess something up at work, that's my arse on a plate. Also, nothing seems to be done in industry as it is taught in University.

All the other students I know are dead broke, despite being given twice as much as they need to live on by the government. Even those working at the same company as me being paid a small fortune are getting free money from their parents and they still have no money! I'm so glad my parents would never help me out. Maybe I would end up self entitled and buying a new PC every fucking year and takeaways several times a week.

Having said that I am planning to buy a cheap used car for hopefully my last year at University in the UK. So I can look around my beloved England one last time.

I'm really trying not to turn this into a rant. But my advice to any other student who does not squander their money is never let anyone else know you have money. Put it in another account even, so people can't see your bank statements. The number of spoilt brats who have tried to get me to pay for things for them because they are broke. Those who received the same grants, loans, pay as me and received money from their parents wanted me to pay for their train tickets, food and drinks!? One guy stopped talking to me for a good few weeks because I would not buy him a coat as it was getting towards winter. His blew his money on video games, knew he would not get another loan and grant till after Christmas and seemed to think I owe it to him. I could argue it would be doing him a dishonour to deprive him of such a valuable life lesson.

Bugger, I'm ranting, got to take a nice cold shower to cool off.

[TWilliam]

Bugger, I'm ranting, got to take a nice cold shower to cool off.

You have every right to rant. What you're seeing are the fruits of the increasingly socialist mindset that's been permeating western culture for decades, "I deserve it because I exist, because I need it and want it", and it is despicable. One of its more insidious manifestations is the 'self-esteem' parenting that's been in vogue for some years now...

[davep]

deleted. Too much information...

[Kristen]

I don't think we can blame people for going to college or saying they are dumb for doing it. Soon people will realize that school isn't worth it and try to discover other means. Anyone of you who went to college thirty years ago and built a life from it can see its benefits.

[auscanman]

I am just about to finish 'articling', which is a 10 month apprenticeship required to qualify as a lawyer in Canada. I opted not to return to the firm I articled at, mostly due to one of the partners in my department being the most abrasive and psychologically unstable individual I have ever encountered. It wasn't easy to turn down what would have been a very lucrative job in this horrific economic climate, but I think nobody should ever have to endure a poisonous work environment. No amount of money would make returning there worth it for me.

Large/medium sized law firms in Canada have typically hired back an average of 85+% of their articling students as lawyers, but this year roughly 50% hireback is the norm. There are going to be many hundreds of newly called lawyers chasing around VERY few jobs, and the layoffs of currently employed associates haven't even really started here.

The US model of high tuition fees, with correlated student debt burdens, has only been implemented over the past 7 or 8 years in Canadian law schools and other 'professional' programs, so the current situation in which swarms of newly called lawyers and other 'professionals' are in debt up to their neck and unemployed is unprecedented. It will be interesting to see if there is more of a backlash against the high tuition fee model in Canada than there is the US.

[odegaard]

I don't think we can blame people for going to college or saying they are dumb for doing it. Soon people will realize that school isn't worth it and try to discover other means. Anyone of you who went to college thirty years ago and built a life from it can see its benefits.

There's a big difference between now and 30 years ago. Back then few had a college degree and now there's more college graduates than you can shake a stick at.
If we go back to high school economics and revisit the law of supply and demand we learn that if the supply becomes excessive than the price of said commodity will go down.
This is equally true of any commodity whether it's a bushel of corn or a college diploma.

The economics graduate mentioned in the first post should understand this quite well.

[yesplease]

Sure a doctor, lawyer, or engineer will pay off their college debts.

Even then, you might not do so well. Didn't SPG say she only makes like $20,000 a year (granted it's out West)? That's hardly enough to pay down a couple hundred grand in student loans if she owes that much. Law firms dropped people like crazy. I've talked to former lawyers who've seen all of their friends with several years of experience get canned. Not too many people are safe unless if you go into specialized medicine.

I think people just need to face facts, they aren't safe unless they spend less than they earn, and that's that. Assuming we'll make enough to pay off huge student loans is a risk no matter how we cut it.

[vision-master]

I don't think we can blame people for going to college or saying they are dumb for doing it. Soon people will realize that school isn't worth it and try to discover other means. Anyone of you who went to college thirty years ago and built a life from it can see its benefits.

It was just a sign of the times.

Anyone who got a good union job thirty years ago and built a life from it can see its benefits too.

[TWilliam]

Anyone who got a good union job thirty years ago and built a life from it can see its benefits too.

Yep. In fact, I remember reading somewhere that of those who retire with a net worth in excess of one million (millionaire by definition), college grads nearly always have a lower net worth than those who started work straight out of high school.