[deMolay]

This really says how bad it has become. Do I buy grub and pay my rent/mortgage or bury Mom/Dad. http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me ... 4079.story

[Rabbit]

It's sad how people expect the government to do everything for them. By their deeds they tell the government that they want cradle to grave care. The government will by happy to enslave the masses.

[deMolay]

Kind of reminds me of Tom Joad.

[Kristen]

If it were up to me, if you couldn't afford a fancy cremation or burial in a cemetery, you would be given a shovel and could bury em out back, so to speak. There are so many properties becoming empty, why not tear them down and give the land to bury the deciet.

[SeaGypsy]

Death is the Governments final tax opportunity.
I'm for deep sea burial, thanks; or as my father said "Bury me standing under an apple tree."
The latast farce in the commercial death trade; a friend of mine works in Sydney as a grave digger. He told me that they are now in continuous recycling of gravesites. You fork out thousands for a grave and a box, the box rots, the grave gets recycled. What are you actually buying?

[deMolay]

God I am glad none of you are my kids. Pretty damn nonchalant about old dad's last remains. Hell throw him in the ditch. But one more symptom of the times. Hell get some coyotes over here Dad is dead.

[SeaGypsy]

God I am glad none of you are my kids. Pretty damn nonchalant about old dad's last remains. Hell throw him in the ditch. But one more symptom of the times. Hell get some coyotes over here Dad is dead.

The legal options suck:
Buy a grave which will be dug up in a few decades anyway.
Be cremated, adding your own carbon to that used to destroy any nutritional value in your corpse.
Is there any real dignity in these or just a sham?
In Australia they just changed from 200 to 1000 the number of acres 1 must own to install a private cemetary.
Time is ripe for an overhaul of the system.
If I want to be buried at sea, why can't I?
If my father wanted to be buried under a tree why did the law insist he be cremated 1st?
Stupid wastefull outdated laws.

[deMolay]

Sea Gypsy, no disrespect here. But I don't see this as a matter of efficiency. I see it as a symptom of a bigger crisis. People aren't even honoring their dead or acknowledgeing them. This is a sea change. This isn't a one on one. It is a very high rate of change. Hell next month throw his ass out on the street. Dumb Bitch up and died.

[SeaGypsy]

I do get your point here; but the devils advocate in me says there are plenty of reasons people are doing this.

[Caffeine]

SeaGypsy, do you know what funeral expenses are like in other (non-US, non-Aus) parts of the world? Like in the Philippines/Southeast Asia?

[SeaGypsy]

It depends a lot where exactly in Asia one dies, where I live in the Philippines many people have their 1st non leaking roof after they die. The cemetaries are like villages for the dead, full of ornamental buildings.
If you die in a developed or fast growing area, the plot can be very expensive; but nobody would dare even think of recycling it.
If you arrange a plot on a remote island or mountain village, costs come down exponentially.
It is not hard to spend from $100USD to $5000USD; the 5k would get your family a house on top of your grave for all saints day; the $100 would get a beautiful mountain vista with a humble plaque.

[beamofthewave]

I dont think Americans want cradle to grave care like people in Finland have or the people of France where the government cares for you if/when you get sick so you dont end up homeless on the street to die, I think in the US we are quite aware that the government allows the corporations to mine us for every cent we have and then throw us away like a bad apple. American citizens are used to this and completely accept being ruled and robbed by multinational corporatiions with no government to stand in to protect them. I think any good American would voluntarily and happily die from an operable cancer than insist that the government protect them from health insurance corporations who refuse to pay for a procedure because the citizen did not have the insurance long enough to meet the one year requirement of a pre-existing condition and the citizen did not have the 20-100,000 dollars to pay the hospital up front for the care, and dont give me that drivel that it does not cost that much because my mother died of cancer as did my brother. We in the USA love suffering for the precious corporations, we love not having enough money to bury our beloved family members so that ultra rich can bet in the hedge fund markets, there is no amount of suffering we will not do for our beloved corporated masters. I am so proud of the emotional pain and humiliation my fellow country men are willing to endure for our beloved ultra rich, we shouldnt even tax them just like Newsweek says so we can all proudly assert that we dont believe in any protection from the corporations and are so willing to sacrifice our children for Exxons profits.

[Pretorian]

Death is the Governments final tax opportunity.
I'm for deep sea burial, thanks; or as my father said "Bury me standing under an apple tree."
The latast farce in the commercial death trade; a friend of mine works in Sydney as a grave digger. He told me that they are now in continuous recycling of gravesites. You fork out thousands for a grave and a box, the box rots, the grave gets recycled. What are you actually buying?

In some countries the dead are responcible for maintenance fees for their gravesites; that's after paying a full price for the lot of course. Those who fail paying their dues get evicted and their graves are resold.

[SeaGypsy]

Death is the Governments final tax opportunity.
I'm for deep sea burial, thanks; or as my father said "Bury me standing under an apple tree."
The latast farce in the commercial death trade; a friend of mine works in Sydney as a grave digger. He told me that they are now in continuous recycling of gravesites. You fork out thousands for a grave and a box, the box rots, the grave gets recycled. What are you actually buying?

In some countries the dead are responcible for maintenance fees for their gravesites; that's after paying a full price for the lot of course. Those who fail paying their dues get evicted and their graves are resold.

The way it works in OZ is the rates are scaled so you repurchase your site every 20 to 40 years. Given that most people die in their 70's this gives time for the children to join them in the ever after, but many granchildren will find no more than a plaque or piece of paper if they are looking for the grandparents in middle age.

[JJ]

It depends a lot where exactly in Asia one dies, where I live in the Philippines many people have their 1st non leaking roof after they die. The cemetaries are like villages for the dead, full of ornamental buildings.
If you die in a developed or fast growing area, the plot can be very expensive; but nobody would dare even think of recycling it.
If you arrange a plot on a remote island or mountain village, costs come down exponentially.
It is not hard to spend from $100USD to $5000USD; the 5k would get your family a house on top of your grave for all saints day; the $100 would get a beautiful mountain vista with a humble plaque.

the Chinese cemetarys in Manila are unbelievable. The dead "live" better than the living. Houses, tv, refrigerator, etc. Bings mom buried her mom on the side of the hill up the road. You can't really tell its a grave. We went and pulled some weeds off of it. Bing says you lay the body out in the living room for everyone to sit with. I asked the funeral director who comes into produce if we can just lay the body out on a board in our living room here in Burnet, Texas and he said yes, theres no law against it, you just have to jump through some hoops. (here's the cemetary next to our house in the Philippines).
Photo (very large)

[Hoops_Mckann]

I dont think Americans want cradle to grave care like people in Finland have or the people of France where the government cares for you if/when you get sick so you dont end up homeless on the street to die, I think in the US we are quite aware that the government allows the corporations to mine us for every cent we have and then throw us away like a bad apple. American citizens are used to this and completely accept being ruled and robbed by multinational corporatiions with no government to stand in to protect them. I think any good American would voluntarily and happily die from an operable cancer than insist that the government protect them from health insurance corporations who refuse to pay for a procedure because the citizen did not have the insurance long enough to meet the one year requirement of a pre-existing condition and the citizen did not have the 20-100,000 dollars to pay the hospital up front for the care, and dont give me that drivel that it does not cost that much because my mother died of cancer as did my brother. We in the USA love suffering for the precious corporations, we love not having enough money to bury our beloved family members so that ultra rich can bet in the hedge fund markets, there is no amount of suffering we will not do for our beloved corporated masters. I am so proud of the emotional pain and humiliation my fellow country men are willing to endure for our beloved ultra rich, we shouldnt even tax them just like Newsweek says so we can all proudly assert that we dont believe in any protection from the corporations and are so willing to sacrifice our children for Exxons profits.

+1, I I guess that is why many job applications and interviews look for a "team player", or were "sports minded"

[Roy]

I see it as a symptom of a bigger crisis. People aren't even honoring their dead or acknowledging them. This is a sea change. This isn't a one on one. It is a very high rate of change. Hell next month throw his ass out on the street. Dumb Bitch up and died.

Our culture hates death and loves it at the same time--support our troops! (look at the results of the last election if you don't believe me, or turn on some primetime broadcast TV).

We hide from death and old age. We try to make ourselves look younger and feel younger pharmaceutically and using medical procedures etc.

When someone dies, we have them embalmed in a chemical cocktail, then apply a nice suit of clothes and put makeup on them to make them look alive for their open casket funeral. And we spend thousands on a casket. WTF?

I don't understand and have never understood the idea of spending thousands of dollars on a funeral. I understand honoring the deceased person's memory, but don't think that requires all the trimmings of a modern funeral. A pine box, a cleric of some sort if you believe in that stuff, and close family is enough I think.

I would prefer to be buried in my backyard, under a fruit tree perhaps. Hell once you're dead you don't care anymore. Ashes to ashes, dust to dust.

Not chemically embalmed body buried in steel casket that doesn't decay for a loooooong time; and when it does will impart some toxic chemicals to the surrounding ground.

I would not want to be a financial burden on my family after I pass, or a superfund site either.

I think the old way of a family cemetery on family land could work well for those of us in rural areas.

City folk? They will continue to have to pay for a space. Seagypsy's idea is also a good option in my opinion, at least for those who live in coastal areas.

Our government has created a set of regulations that forbids or makes it very difficult for folks to take care of their own, in a way making funeral expenses mandatory.

That will change in time I believe.

[Aaron]

Pfft...

This is how to do it...

On August 20, 2005, in a private ceremony, Thompson's ashes were fired from a cannon atop a 153-foot (47 m) tower of his own design (in the shape of a double-thumbed fist clutching a peyote button) to the tune of Norman Greenbaum's "Spirit in the Sky" and Bob Dylan's Mr. Tambourine Man.[32] Red, white, blue, and green fireworks were launched along with his ashes. As the city of Aspen would not allow the cannon to remain for more than a month, the cannon has been dismantled and put into storage until a suitable permanent location can be found. According to his widow Anita, Thompson's funeral was financed by actor Johnny Depp, a close friend of Thompson. Depp told the Associated Press, "All I'm doing is trying to make sure his last wish comes true. I just want to send my pal out the way he wants to go out."[32]

Other famous attendees at the funeral included U.S. Senator John Kerry and former U.S. Senator George McGovern; 60 Minutes correspondents Ed Bradley and Charlie Rose; actors Jack Nicholson, Bill Murray, Benicio Del Toro, Sean Penn, and Josh Hartnett; singers Lyle Lovett, John Oates and numerous other friends. An estimated 280 people attended the funeral.

The plans for this monument were initially drawn by Thompson and Ralph Steadman and were shown as part of an Omnibus program on the BBC entitled Fear and Loathing in Gonzovision (1978). It is included as a special feature on the second disc of the 2003 Criterion Collection DVD release of Fear and Loathing in Las Vegas (labeled on the DVD as "Fear and Loathing on the Road to Hollywood"). The video footage of Steadman and Thompson drawing the plans and outdoor footage showing where he wanted the cannon constructed were planned prior to the unveiling of his cannon at the funeral.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hunter_S._Thompson#Funeral