[AlexdeLarge]

45% Of Doctors Would Consider Quitting If Congress Passes Health Care Overhaul
http://www.investors.com/NewsAndAnalysis/Article.aspx?id=506199

Two of every three practicing physicians oppose the medical overhaul plan under consideration in Washington, and hundreds of thousands would think about shutting down their practices or retiring early if it were adopted, a new IBD/TIPP Poll has found.

Dr. No

How's that HopeNchange tm working out for you ?

[jedrider]

45% Of Doctors Would Consider Quitting If Congress Passes Health Care Overhaul

That's interesting. What would they do? Could they become bankers or maybe welfare workers? Would they move to third-world countries to help people truly in need? Yes, the third option is the only true moral one!

[Ferretlover]

Out with the old, in with the new? For those who would do that, it is best they do it while there are still other employment options available. I have a small voice telling me that insurance, of all kinds, is going to be the next big bubble, and without that insurance money, many doctors are going to learn a new lifestyle-whether they like it or not.

[Sixstrings]

[b]45% Of Doctors Would Consider Quitting If Congress Passes Health Care Overhaul

Nice, more threats. Republican banskters: give us the money or we crash your economy. Republican doctors: give us the money or we quit and let you die.

Seriously, though, let them quit and let them eat cake.. thanks to decades of republican globalism, we have nothing to fear with these threats. We have those H1B visas, you see, and we can just keep bringing in Indian docs to do those jobs that American docs won't do.

(I hate immigration, but this is one area I have to admit doesn't bother me.. I've had very good experience with Indian and Latin American doctors -- I've found them to be more thorough, more professional, just as competent, and most of all they don't have the bad attitude so many Americans docs have)

[dinopello]

45% Of Doctors Would Consider Quitting If Congress Passes Health Care Overhaul

That's interesting. What would they do? Could they become bankers or maybe welfare workers? Would they move to third-world countries to help people truly in need? Yes, the third option is the only true moral one!

Taxi Cab Drivers. I know several of the firms here are hiring.

[vision-master]

These guy's might need some help?

[Tyler_JC]

They won't go into other work. They'll retire.

Many of them are in their 50s/60s and don't need the money.

They are working because they like what they do. If they feel that the government is going to take away the enjoyment of working, they'll fade off into the sunset.

[Sixstrings]

They won't go into other work. They'll retire. Many of them are in their 50s/60s and don't need the money. They are working because they like what they do. If they feel that the government is going to take away the enjoyment of working, they'll fade off into the sunset.

My mother has a very good doc, I think he's like 70. He's old school.. doesn't send her to specialists for every little thing, does it all himself. He actually calls her on the phone between appointments just to check up on her.

She was seeing a rheumatologist.. waits between appointments were so long that the guy actually forgot everything about her last visit. After a nightmare with specialists, this old fashioned doc has her stabilized for the first time in a year.

[BigTex]

I predict that doctors will do what everyone else does when the rules change: they will bitch up a storm and keep on working.

For those with student loans, they won't have much choice.

Some of you might have seen the list of the 15 top paid occupations on Yahoo Finance. One spot went to CEOs, and the rest were different types of doctors and dentists.

A doctor always has the option of doing business on a cash only basis. I have heard of a few that do business this way.

[Plantagenet]

Its not like the Doctors know anything about healthcare.

Who wouldn't want Nancy Pelosi and Barney Frank to devise an entirely new healthcare system for us all?

[smallpoxgirl]

Nice, more threats. Republican banskters: give us the money or we crash your economy. Republican doctors: give us the money or we quit and let you die.

I'm most certainly no Republican, but this sort of idiotic self-serving vitriol from the left has got me siding with them strongly right now. Hateful diatribes against doctors are not going to make your healthcare any better. I'd be perfectly happy making $60,000 a year, but you try to make me into a postal employee, and I'm very likely to start learning Spanish and tell you and Sallie Mae to kiss my white butt. I'll move to Guatemala and take care of people that actually appreciate my help. At least I won't have some government dipshit telling me I can't keep a goat in my yard. Maybe Tex is right. Maybe I'm bluffing, but becoming a government employee is not even remotely in my life plan and it's not a concept to which I am at all open. Every time the government sticks it's nose into medicine, it tracks dog crap all over the place. If they're the only game in town, it's time to seriously look at finding a new town.

[vision-master]

Maybe I'm bluffing, but becoming a government employee is not even remotely in my life plan and it's not a concept to which I am at all open.

I know this nice German Doctor who worked for the State. He's got a nice pension now.

[Pops]

If you are going to click on one of Alex's threads, expect at least a small amount of bias:

"according to statistician Nate Silver, the poll is "simply not credible," and Fox News itself acknowledged that the poll is "not scientific.""
http://mediamatters.org/research/200909170025

[BigTex]

Maybe Tex is right. Maybe I'm bluffing, but becoming a government employee is not even remotely in my life plan and it's not a concept to which I am at all open.

I don't think you are bluffing. I just think that the reality that arrives is often not as bad as people think it's going to be.

[Tyler_JC]

Maybe I'm bluffing, but becoming a government employee is not even remotely in my life plan and it's not a concept to which I am at all open.

I know this nice German Doctor who worked for the State. He's got a nice pension now.

Define "nice".

Doctors work harder than almost anyone else on the planet to get their degrees and qualifications.

They don't even begin to start paying down their student loans until their mid thirties. By that point, most of their friends already have children in grammar school.

Becoming a doctor is a huge commitment of time and money. They basically lose a decade of their best years in order to go into the field. It only seems fair that they receive generous compensation for their efforts.

[vision-master]

He immigrated HERE.

[Sixstrings]

I'd be perfectly happy making $60,000 a year, but you try to make me into a postal employee, and I'm very likely to start learning Spanish and tell you and Sallie Mae to kiss my white butt.

First of all, 60k is about what a lot of nurses make (locally, they start out at around 45k, some make more). If specialists could just be happy with around 200k, then all our problems would be solved. I say specialists, because as you know, every doctor and his uncle has become a specialist these days so they can bill more.

Secondly, single payer (which isn't even remotely on the table, the whole controversy is just over public option) doesn't equate to being a government employee. Medicare is a single payer system.. are you "working for the government" when you treat a Medicare patient, SPG? What difference does it really make, whether the check comes from Aunt Aetna or Uncle Sam? For the American people, one difference would be that $600 billion of insurance company profits would be removed from the healthcare system. What's more important to you, insurance company executive bonuses or using that money to heal the sick?

Now if we really did have single payer, think of the simplified paperwork. Quite a bit of healthcare expense is all bureaucracy to handle the billing for the multiple labyrinthine insurance policies (companies whose raison d'etre is to NOT pay out on claims and/or delay payment).

Anyway, I don't mean to pick an argument with you SPG. You're one of the good guys.

P.S. I do agree with the Republicans that there can be no real reform without a big hammer coming down on malpractice lawsuits. This will never happen, of course, since the Dems are in the pocket of the trial lawyers. And physicians are in the pocket of Repubs, so here we are in Mexican standoff for all eternity -- the end result being healthcare inflation that will one day utterly bankrupt our republic.

Now, we do need to keep malpractice suits in place (crap does happen.. a local hospital has done some wacky things, like amputating wrong leg etc.).. but the payouts need to be drastically capped. The caps need to be just enough to be punitive without pushing malpractice insurance to astronomical levels.

[Sixstrings]

Becoming a doctor is a huge commitment of time and money. They basically lose a decade of their best years in order to go into the field. It only seems fair that they receive generous compensation for their efforts.

I like the figure for Britain, it looks just about right. Believe it or not, there are folks who will practice medicine because they love it, not to become quick millionaires. Personally, I'd rather have a doc who is 100% focused on his job, not half his mind on his stock portfolio.

But that figure for Germany.. oh my gosh, how can that be right? I have a hard time believing anybody can live even a middle class life in Germany of all places, on just $57k. There must be more to that story, like some kind of extra long residency? (maybe lower wages in eastern germany skew that statistic?).

I bet there's something fundamentally different going on in Germany, like probably free education (so no student loans) and something different about how the hospitalists practice.

[smallpoxgirl]

First of all, 60k is about what a lot of nurses make (locally, they start out at around 45k, some make more). If specialists could just be happy with around 200k, then all our problems would be solved. I say specialists, because as you know, every doctor and his uncle has become a specialist these days so they can bill more.

My point is that money has little to do with why I or any doctor I know is pissed about this plan.

Secondly, single payer (which isn't even remotely on the table, the whole controversy is just over public option) doesn't equate to being a government employee. Medicare is a single payer system.. are you "working for the government" when you treat a Medicare patient, SPG?

Absolutely. Dealing with medicare is orders of magnitude worse than dealing with the DMV. It is absolutely without question the worst part of being a doctor today.

What difference does it really make, whether the check comes from Aunt Aetna or Uncle Sam?

Because the check doesn't come from uncle sam for about 9 months. You have to fill out 80 pages of forms. They lose half of them. Meanwhile the check from uncle sam comes with 87 different regulations that you have to comply with, each of which would take a smart lawyer a week to understand. When they finally do pay you, it doesn't even begin to cover all the hours it took trying to get paid. In the end taking care of medicare patients more closely resembles working for HR Block than practicing medicine.

What's more important to you, insurance company executive bonuses or using that money to heal the sick?

What's important is insightful discussion of the problems with our medical system instead of this childish BS about sticking it to the man. Seriously. There are a lot of complex reasons why our medical system is in disarray, but being oppressed by the insurance company isn't on the list.

Now if we really did have single payer, think of the simplified paperwork.

Can you possibly be that clueless about with what it's like to interact with the government?

Quite a bit of healthcare expense is all bureaucracy to handle the billing for the multiple labyrinthine insurance policies (companies whose raison d'etre is to NOT pay out on claims and/or delay payment).

Dealing with insurance companies is like a feminine hygiene commercial compared to dealing with medicare or medicaid. When I was in private practice, I eventually started making my receptionist make all the calls to medicare and medicaid. I ended up wanting to scream at them every time I called.