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Dollar hegemony for another century

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Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby copious.abundance » Wed 21 Oct 2009, 23:39:55

Interesting p.o.v.

>>> LINK <<<
Dollar hegemony for another century

Let me stick my neck out.

The dollar will still be the world’s dominant reserve currency in 2030, sharing a degree of leadership in uneasy condominium with the Chinese yuan. It will then regain much of its hegemonic status as the 21st century unfolds. It may indeed end the century even stronger than it was at the start.

The aging crisis in Asia — and indeed the outright demographic implosion in Japan and China, not to mention China’s water crisis — will soon be obvious to everybody. Talk of Oriental supremacy will start to sound overblown at first, and then preposterous.

Japan is about to go bankrupt. It is on the cusp of a fiscal crisis that will change perceptions of Asia dramatically. The IMF says gross public debt will reach 218pc of GDP this year. This is compounding very fast. It will be 246pc in 2014.

[...]

Charles Dumas from Lombard Street Research says Washington must be chuckling as the weak dollar gives it time to rebuild America’s industrial core. The “inflationistas” — ie, those convinced that the dollar is being debauched despite the fact that core inflation in the US is falling and that the M3 money supply is contracting — are playing straight into the hands of the United States.

Nobel Laureate Gary Becker told me a few weeks ago that America’ spectacular gains in productivity – growing at a trend rate of 2.25pc to 2.5pc — is laying the foundation for a much stronger US recovery in the long-term than most people seem to realize. Compare that with 0pc to 1pc for the eurozone. In Italy it is negative.

The UN expects America to add roughly 100m people by 2050, keeping its age balance in relatively good shape through a mix of immigration and a healthy fertility rate — now 2.12 live births per woman, still above replacement level. This compares to: Taiwan (1.13), Korea (1.2), Japan (1.22), Ukraine (1.25), Poland (1.27), Spain (1.3), Italy (1.3), Russia (1.4), Germany (1.41), China (1.77), Britain (1.96), and France (1.98). Some of this data may be slightly out of date, but the picture remains valid.

Professor Becker said a collapsing birth rate is extremely hard to reverse, and the cultural effects are insidious. Old societies are status quo. They are slow to embrace new technologies. Young minds are the source of hi-tech invention.

[...]
Stuff for doomers to contemplate:
http://peakoil.com/forums/post1190117.html#p1190117
http://peakoil.com/forums/post1193930.html#p1193930
http://peakoil.com/forums/post1206767.html#p1206767
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby Jotapay » Wed 21 Oct 2009, 23:46:38

Can I print this for toilet paper like a Sears catalogue of old in 2030? Seriously.
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby TheAntiDoomer » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 00:42:27

Absolutely great find OF2! This argument is a swift kick to the nuts for the America Haters here. The last 2 paragraphs are fantastic:

At the end of the day, America is a unified nation forged by wars, under the rule of law, with a (largely) unifying language and patriotic creed, and one of the oldest and most deeply-rooted democracies in the world. As the Supreme Court demonstrated during Watergate, it can break presidents who violate the law.

It is often stated that a currency reflects the strength of an economy over time. Actually, it reflects the strength of a society. Who really thinks that Europe’s old-aged home is a better bet than America, even if they can hold the euro together as the gap widens further between Germania and Club Med? Or thinks that China’s half-reformed Communist regime is ready for global leadership. Remember the little girl in a red dress with pigtails who `lip-synched’ the opening ceremony of the Beijing Olympics? Believe what you will.
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby hardtootell-2 » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 02:27:42

Two words:

Medicaid
Medicare
Iraq
Afghanistan
Fanny
Freddy
AIG

Sorry that's three words. I should get a job with the Federal Reserve. :)

Can anyone honestly say that there is a shred of fiscal control or responsibility in the US when there is evidence like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXlxBeAvsB8

The force of patriotism will preserve the USA! :roll:
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby jbrovont » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 02:36:14

Currency = GDP - deficit

or did I miss something?
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby americandream » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 05:36:39

I've had no doubt all along that the dollar would reign supreme. American capital owns China having created it in its own image. As China rises as a manufacturing power, so will the dividends and other income streams to American money pools, creating the basis for the neutralising of the bad debts on the books of banks. China knows this and Washington is amused by the doomsayers.
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby Chuckmak » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 06:01:52

pstarr wrote:
TheAntiDoomer wrote:Absolutely great find OF2! This argument is a swift kick to the nuts for the America Haters here.
My nuts are swelling with pride. :P


I laughed so hard just now

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby Mudpuppy » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 06:30:01

Two words:

Medicaid
Medicare
Iraq
Afghanistan
Fanny
Freddy
AIG


Ermmm ... I have a question on language usage. Is that Fanny in the American sense of the word or the English sense of the word. Because I am unsure if you mean vagina or buttocks as the meanings are opposed in the previously mentioned languages. Will the world be undone by America`s vagina`s or America`s buttocks. I need to know which way I should face. :-D
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby americandream » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 07:02:34

Fanny's listed above Freddy :lol:

Mudpuppy wrote:
Two words:

Medicaid
Medicare
Iraq
Afghanistan
Fanny
Freddy
AIG


Ermmm ... I have a question on language usage. Is that Fanny in the American sense of the word or the English sense of the word. Because I am unsure if you mean vagina or buttocks as the meanings are opposed in the previously mentioned languages. Will the world be undone by America`s vagina`s or America`s buttocks. I need to know which way I should face. :-D
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 07:29:17

americandream wrote:I've had no doubt all along that the dollar would reign supreme. American capital owns China having created it in its own image. As China rises as a manufacturing power, so will the dividends and other income streams to American money pools, creating the basis for the neutralising of the bad debts on the books of banks. China knows this and Washington is amused by the doomsayers.


By 'reign supreme' what do you mean exactly? Does it really matter to US investments in China if there is devaluation of the dollar by 50% over a couple of years? Considering the volume of growth expected in these investments along with the fact many key players are already bought and paid for? Also, who in America is to gain from these investment pools? It seems presumptuous to suggest investment pool growth will generally benefit the USA. The trickle down effect is one contention. Another is the whole change of focus culturally that comes with exposure to the rest of the world. It is hard to invest seriously in a country without getting involved.
There is a common denominator somewhere in the future which is yet to be established. It's not about what currency the workers are paid in but what they can buy with that currency. The USD$ could devalue gradually by, say 50% over a couple of years, in sync with increased value of the Yuan. This would save the political embarrasment of actually lowering wages; whilst increasing productive competition and reducing real debt.
I would not go so far as to say the dollar is in terminal trouble; but I would be betting on serious devaluation on forex for some time yet. There are still a hell of a lot of electric kettles, microwaves, TVs and PCs to sell in Chindia. Then there is the issue of transport. And peak oil.
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby Revi » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 08:44:52

Maybe we have deteriorated so much that we are due for a rennaissance. The country is full of young people who could do all sorts of things. We are very innovative.

I think we could re-make ourselves.

All we lack is the will to do it.

Get rid of gasoline vehicles, get some mass transportation, rebuild cities and streetcar suburbs, build a decentralized electric grid that has millions of solar roofs feeding into it. Wind, water and nuclear power start to supplant the dirty coal. High speed rail takes over from airplane travel for most folks. Efficiency is the order of the day.

It's all possible.

One of the great things about Americans is that we're not too sentimental.

Out with the old, in with the new.

It's the American Way!
Deep in the mud and slime of things, even there, something sings.
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby rangerone314 » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 08:59:01

Ummmmmmmmmmmmm....

U. S. debt forecast to hit $20-trillion by 2019


Barack Obama's Risky Deficit Spending

At best, the rising cost of the debt would intensify pressures to increase taxes, cut spending -- or create bigger, unsustainable deficits. By the CBO's estimates, interest on the debt as a share of federal spending will double between 2008 and 2019, to 16 percent. Huge budget deficits could also weaken economic growth by "crowding out" private investment.

At worst, the burgeoning debt could trigger a future financial crisis. The danger is that "we won't be able to sell [Treasury debt] at reasonable interest rates," says economist Rudy Penner, head of the CBO from 1983 to 1987. In today's anxious climate, this hasn't happened. American and foreign investors have favored "safe" U.S. Treasurys. But a glut of bonds, fears of inflation -- or something else -- might one day shatter confidence. Bond prices might fall sharply; interest rates would rise. The consequences could be worldwide because foreigners own half of U.S. Treasury debt.


I'd note the CBO estimate of interest being 16% of budget is based on both rosier projections of economic growth than are likely to happen realistically, as well as a lower interest rate than is likely in the future.

Yep, the future of the dollar looks bright!

On the positive side, this has been kind of a dismal week so far, and the article at least made me laugh!
Last edited by rangerone314 on Thu 22 Oct 2009, 09:00:19, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby eXpat » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 08:59:33

Can we count that one, as another prediction by Oily and his sidekick Anti?
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby rangerone314 » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 09:20:01

eXpat wrote:Can we count that one, as another prediction by Oily and his sidekick Anti?


I would.

Here's my prediction:

We've seen a tech stock bubble, a housing bubble, commodities bubble etc etc

I'm pretty sure the next bubble is going to be the Federal debt bubble.

When that pops its not going to be inconvenient like popping a pimple. Its going to be more like popping your aorta.
An ideology is by definition not a search for TRUTH-but a search for PROOF that its point of view is right

Equals barter and negotiate-people with power just take

You cant defend freedom by eliminating it-unknown

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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby crude_intentions » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 09:55:35

Charles Dumas from Lombard Street Research says Washington must be chuckling as the weak dollar gives it time to rebuild America’s industrial core


Industrial Core of What? To rebuild the industrial core you need competive wages with China, Mexico, <insert third/second world hell-hole here>.Of course you'll never have competive wagesw with China so long as the yuan is pegged to the dollar. Of course now you have the situation where the dollar peg is now acting as a stop gap against further dollar collapse.
Amazing how you don't here anyone complaining about the dollar peg much anymore in Washington. :twisted:
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby mcgowanjm » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 10:30:27

At the end of the day, America is a unified nation forged by wars, under the rule of law, with a (largely) unifying language and patriotic creed, and one of the oldest and most deeply-rooted democracies in the world. As the Supreme Court demonstrated during Watergate, it can break presidents who violate the law.


Main St America is seething. Especially when they hear this:

By Kathryn Hopkins
The Guardian
October 21, 2009

One of the City's leading figures has suggested that inequality created by bankers' huge salaries is a price worth paying for greater prosperity.

In remarks that will fuel the row around excessive pay, Lord Griffiths, vice-chairman of Goldman Sachs International and a former adviser to Margaret Thatcher, said banks should not be ashamed of rewarding their staff.

Speaking to an audience at St Paul's Cathedral in London about morality in the marketplace last night, Griffiths said the British public should "tolerate the inequality as a way to achieve greater prosperity for all".


From time to time, in some moment of peril or anxiety, a statesman appears on the scene promising to eliminate tyranny, ensure the triumph of liberty, and achieve permanent peace. For a moment, the statesman achieves the status of prophet, one who in his own person seemingly embodies the essence of the American purpose. Then reality intrudes, exposing the promises as costly fantasies. The prophet’s followers abandon him. Mocked and reviled, he is eventually banished—perhaps to some gated community in Dallas.

Yet however brief his ascendancy, the discredited prophet leaves behind a legacy. Most obvious are the problems created and left unresolved, commitments made and left unfulfilled, debts accrued and left unpaid. Less obvious, but for that reason more important, are the changes in perception.


We're staring at the worst grain harvest since 1975(quantity), 1993(quality) while we get the Second Great Grain Robbery with China playing the USSR and Clinton doing her best Dr K.

The RecoveryLess Recovery:

No Recovery. Recession To Worsen ­ Revolution To Follow
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby TheAntiDoomer » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 11:19:26

My god, i'm not even sure what this is? When Can i expect revolution? I think the principle in Bill Madison said it best:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEkWH8DB7b0

mcgowanjm wrote:
At the end of the day, America is a unified nation forged by wars, under the rule of law, with a (largely) unifying language and patriotic creed, and one of the oldest and most deeply-rooted democracies in the world. As the Supreme Court demonstrated during Watergate, it can break presidents who violate the law.


Main St America is seething. Especially when they hear this:

By Kathryn Hopkins
The Guardian
October 21, 2009

One of the City's leading figures has suggested that inequality created by bankers' huge salaries is a price worth paying for greater prosperity.

In remarks that will fuel the row around excessive pay, Lord Griffiths, vice-chairman of Goldman Sachs International and a former adviser to Margaret Thatcher, said banks should not be ashamed of rewarding their staff.

Speaking to an audience at St Paul's Cathedral in London about morality in the marketplace last night, Griffiths said the British public should "tolerate the inequality as a way to achieve greater prosperity for all".


From time to time, in some moment of peril or anxiety, a statesman appears on the scene promising to eliminate tyranny, ensure the triumph of liberty, and achieve permanent peace. For a moment, the statesman achieves the status of prophet, one who in his own person seemingly embodies the essence of the American purpose. Then reality intrudes, exposing the promises as costly fantasies. The prophet’s followers abandon him. Mocked and reviled, he is eventually banished—perhaps to some gated community in Dallas.

Yet however brief his ascendancy, the discredited prophet leaves behind a legacy. Most obvious are the problems created and left unresolved, commitments made and left unfulfilled, debts accrued and left unpaid. Less obvious, but for that reason more important, are the changes in perception.


We're staring at the worst grain harvest since 1975(quantity), 1993(quality) while we get the Second Great Grain Robbery with China playing the USSR and Clinton doing her best Dr K.

The RecoveryLess Recovery:

No Recovery. Recession To Worsen ­ Revolution To Follow
"The human ability to innovate out of a jam is profound.That’s why Darwin will always be right, and Malthus will always be wrong.” -K.R. Sridhar


Do I make you Corny? :)

"expect 8$ gas on 08/08/08" - Prognosticator
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Re: Dollar hegemony for another century

Unread postby americandream » Thu 22 Oct 2009, 14:59:49

Why will the dollar reign supreme?

Here are a few reasons:

1 No investor with half a brain would park assets in a country run by a dictatorship, no matter how good they are at running a low wage efficient economy. Which accounts for why most Chinese as well as their own government cannot wait to exit surplus funds to America. You filter them out of the country through locally based foreign investment pools, carry them over to Hong Kong on mules..anything will do. Which is why Jim Rogers skeedaddled over there last year.

2 America is a safe haven for investments down to its toes. Socialism in America is free health, thats how private money friendly the state is. And it has the wherewithal to defend that ideology.

3 Most important of all. Investment vehicles of any magnitude are invariably denominated in the US currency and created by Americans or the Brits.

Capitalism always boils down to very simple issues when you're confronting someone with lots of lolly.

SeaGypsy wrote:
americandream wrote:I've had no doubt all along that the dollar would reign supreme. American capital owns China having created it in its own image. As China rises as a manufacturing power, so will the dividends and other income streams to American money pools, creating the basis for the neutralising of the bad debts on the books of banks. China knows this and Washington is amused by the doomsayers.


By 'reign supreme' what do you mean exactly? Does it really matter to US investments in China if there is devaluation of the dollar by 50% over a couple of years? Considering the volume of growth expected in these investments along with the fact many key players are already bought and paid for? Also, who in America is to gain from these investment pools? It seems presumptuous to suggest investment pool growth will generally benefit the USA. The trickle down effect is one contention. Another is the whole change of focus culturally that comes with exposure to the rest of the world. It is hard to invest seriously in a country without getting involved.
There is a common denominator somewhere in the future which is yet to be established. It's not about what currency the workers are paid in but what they can buy with that currency. The USD$ could devalue gradually by, say 50% over a couple of years, in sync with increased value of the Yuan. This would save the political embarrasment of actually lowering wages; whilst increasing productive competition and reducing real debt.
I would not go so far as to say the dollar is in terminal trouble; but I would be betting on serious devaluation on forex for some time yet. There are still a hell of a lot of electric kettles, microwaves, TVs and PCs to sell in Chindia. Then there is the issue of transport. And peak oil.
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