[philly0wills]

Oops

[like_the_dinosaurs]

What if it turns out that capitalism is a mistake? lol

[dsula]

What if it turns out that capitalism is a mistake? lol

Capitalism is not a mistake. The world changes and so do societies. What a boring world this would be if 2 million years ago somebody implemented a sustainable form of society. There would be no history, no change, no nothing. Boring as hell.

By the way capitalsim is most of the time the best way to go because it encourages efficiency and rewards the performer while punishing the slacker.

[Revi]

I don't know what works with stocks, since they have usually tanked for me. I like tangible things like land, silver, cast iron pots, stoneware, etc. They usually seem to appreciate for me.

I like what he says in the article:

"Unless we remain vigilant, it is easy to make similarly poor decisions. Trying to “replace” lost value in a portfolio by taking big swings is one of the worst things you can do.

The most seductive (and therefore common) mistake is to spontaneously sell off a badly performing portfolio. Although pretty much everyone understands the wisdom of “Buy Low, Sell High”, the history of the stock market proves that most investors do exactly the opposite."

I think the worst thing you can do is to sell at the low point of any market. If you can ride it out, you'll be able to sell for more when the price goes up. I have a hard time selling things, because I get attached to them, but I am beginning to get over that.

[rangerone314]

What if it turns out that capitalism is a mistake? lol

Capitalism is not a mistake. The world changes and so do societies. What a boring world this would be if 2 million years ago somebody implemented a sustainable form of society. There would be no history, no change, no nothing. Boring as hell.

By the way capitalsim is most of the time the best way to go because it encourages efficiency and rewards the performer while punishing the slacker.

The problem with capitalism is that it encourages efficiency while IGNORING externalities, such as pollution and other social costs. Its easier to be efficient when you are not held accountable for your behavior.

It is possible to design other systems where the slacker is punished. Such as if they don't work, they don't get food.

Boring is good. Boring means you are not being burned out of your home, dying of a plague, or starving to death.

Isn't there a Chinese curse: "May you live in interesting times." ?

[dsula]

The problem with capitalism is that it encourages efficiency while IGNORING externalities, such as pollution and other social costs. Its easier to be efficient when you are not held accountable for your behavior.

It is all a big feedback loop. Once pollutiion is looked at as a problem the 'green' company is rewarded while products from the 'polluting' companies are not bought anymore. That is the beauty if capitalism. It does exactly what the consumer wants. Don't blame the car company for building SUVs. Blame the consumer who buys it.

It is possible to design other systems where the slacker is punished. Such as if they don't work, they don't get food.

That's written in the communist manifesto. Communism doesn't work well.

Boring is good. Boring means you are not being burned out of your home, dying of a plague, or starving to death.

Different people different taste.

[mcgowanjm]

It is all a big feedback loop. Once pollutiion is looked at as a problem the 'green' company is rewarded while products from the 'polluting' companies are not bought anymore. That is the beauty if capitalism. It does exactly what the consumer wants. Don't blame the car company for building SUVs. Blame the consumer who buys it.

That's the problem. For 500 years capitalism has made
this claim, when the facts are this:

We've had frontiers, third worlds, slaves and genocide
that have been necessary for Capitalism to OFFload
costs.

And bury ideas. Oh and Limitless Energy, and Limitless
Ability of Atmosphere/Oceans to absorb human pop growth.

And since 1972, debt creation based on Limitless Energy
allowing for serfs to acquire "SUV's".

Now, with PO2005 and humans way past overshoot, All must be paid back. See any Plutarchs stepping up?

Picower did. But not in a Volunteer way. ;}

[rangerone314]

Boring is good. Boring means you are not being burned out of your home, dying of a plague, or starving to death.

Different people different taste.

I wasn't aware that starving to death constitutes a different taste.

[rangerone314]

The problem with capitalism is that it encourages efficiency while IGNORING externalities, such as pollution and other social costs. Its easier to be efficient when you are not held accountable for your behavior.

It is all a big feedback loop. Once pollutiion is looked at as a problem the 'green' company is rewarded while products from the 'polluting' companies are not bought anymore. That is the beauty if capitalism. It does exactly what the consumer wants. Don't blame the car company for building SUVs. Blame the consumer who buys it.

It is possible to design other systems where the slacker is punished. Such as if they don't work, they don't get food.

That's written in the communist manifesto. Communism doesn't work well.

Different people different taste.

If capitalism does exactly what the consumer wants, why do we need marketing and advertising? (I took and aced marketing, I already know the answer to that question)

[dsula]

If capitalism does exactly what the consumer wants, why do we need marketing and advertising? (I took and aced marketing, I already know the answer to that question)

As the great business man Dagobert Duck (I think in english he's called Scrooch McDuck) once said: Satisfy the need of the consumer. And if there's no need. Create one. The fault once again lies with the consumer who is gulliable enough to buy into the advertisers claims.
Seriously, who is to blame, the company that advertieses the latest razor blade, or the guy who thinks he needs it and goes out to buy it? Take some responsability for your own actions.

[mcgowanjm]

And if there's no need. Create one. The fault once again lies with the consumer who is gulliable enough to buy into the advertisers claims.
Seriously, who is to blame, the company that advertieses the latest razor blade, or the guy who thinks he needs it and goes out to buy it?

the Education System is the problem along with corporations
having more rights than humans.

Trained to be consumers while taking on debt which cannot
be repaid. While criminalizing poverty. That's a formula for slavery.

Democracy is not possible w/o surplus.

[dsula]

That's the problem. For 500 years capitalism has made
this claim, when the facts are this:

We've had frontiers, third worlds, slaves and genocide
that have been necessary for Capitalism to OFFload
costs.

Has nothing to do with capitalism. The problem is that the playing field is not level. It is not capitalisms fault that some dictator in africa sells of the countries raw materiel to the highest bidder and rules his own people with an iron fist.

And bury ideas. Oh and Limitless Energy, and Limitless
Ability of Atmosphere/Oceans to absorb human pop growth.

And since 1972, debt creation based on Limitless Energy
allowing for serfs to acquire "SUV's".

Now, with PO2005 and humans way past overshoot, All must be paid back. See any Plutarchs stepping up?

Picower did. But not in a Volunteer way. ;}

Capitalism is not a model for sustainability. Your confusing things.
Capitalism is a model for highest efficiency. If you expect your life to be plain vanille where each day looks exactly the same the previous has and there's nothing to look forward to, then captialism is not for you.

[dsula]

the Education System is the problem along with corporations
having more rights than humans.

Trained to be consumers while taking on debt which cannot
be repaid. While criminalizing poverty. That's a formula for slavery.

Democracy is not possible w/o surplus.

Maybe, but that's not the problem of capitalism but some other issue. You can have bad education in any society. Has nothing to do with captalism.
Democracy and captialsim are not the same. Arguably any democracy today and any capitalist system today isn't one at all.

Democracy works with or without surplus. What doesn't work is socialism without surplus.

[rangerone314]

the Education System is the problem along with corporations
having more rights than humans.

Trained to be consumers while taking on debt which cannot
be repaid. While criminalizing poverty. That's a formula for slavery.

Democracy is not possible w/o surplus.

Maybe, but that's not the problem of capitalism but some other issue. You can have bad education in any society. Has nothing to do with captalism.
Democracy and captialsim are not the same. Arguably any democracy today and any capitalist system today isn't one at all.

Democracy works with or without surplus. What doesn't work is socialism without surplus.

I don't fall for the marketing cr*p. But so much for the vaunted "efficiency" of a system that satisfies a customer's imaginary "need" that the system created in the first place. A system that is efficiently taking raw materials and converting them into garbage to fill landfills.

What we have now is a mutated version of Adam Smith, just like what the USSR practiced was a mutated version of Marxism. Theories like these seldom work well in reality, and certainly work even more poorly the further you deviate from assumptions and rules in the model.

Corporate personhood? Campaign finance (legal bribes for future favors) is free speech? Property grabbing from a homeowner to sell to a corporation is "eminent domain"? Taxpayers bailing out huge banks?

WTF!?!?

This train has jumped so far off the rails that its a bus now.

Screw kleptocapitalism. I'm surprised Adam Smith doesn't rise out of his grave and hit everyone with a clue-by-four.

[VMarcHart]

What a boring world this would be if 2 million years ago somebody implemented a sustainable form of society. There would be no history, no change, no nothing. Boring as hell.

I guarantee the world was very sustainable 2 million years ago, and boring at all.

...capitalsim ... encourages efficiency and rewards the performer while punishing the slacker.

Somehow I can't see the efficiency and the performance of Wall Street, vis-a-vis the rewards it received. As for punishing the slacker ... wait until you are not physically able to work, which can happen to everyone.

[dsula]

As for punishing the slacker ... wait until you are not physically able to work, which can happen to everyone.

Capitalism is cruel. It stomps right over anybody in a blink of an eye. It shows no compassion, no room for the weak, no room for illness or any other defficiency. That's why capitalism is augmented with some form of socialism in each developed nation. Nothing is perfect and everything has a weakness.

However as of today, even though they are not perfect, capitalism and democracy are the best forms of society we have.

[rangerone314]

As for punishing the slacker ... wait until you are not physically able to work, which can happen to everyone.

Capitalism is cruel. It stomps right over anybody in a blink of an eye. It shows no compassion, no room for the weak, no room for illness or any other defficiency. That's why capitalism is augmented with some form of socialism in each developed nation. Nothing is perfect and everything has a weakness.

However as of today, even though they are not perfect, capitalism and democracy are the best forms of society we have.

But you turn on FOX news and find out socialism is EVIL!

Actually we don't have democracy... we have representative government, which = plutocracy.

Switzerland is actually closer to a true democracy.

The system seems unable to fix itself, to self correct or heal. The corruption accumulates. I would say that is a sign of terminal illness in an organism, and a sign of terminal illness in a society, too.

Some political theory suggests that what constitutes the best form of society depends on the circumstances in which that society exists. That is why the military subset of society has a command structure rather than voting.

[Kristen]

Capitalism is evil, plain and simple. It's full of greed and its stratagem seems to end with one holding all of the cards, dictating the world by creating "needs" and "status symbols" which really are not important, only to those who are brainwashed into believing them. So to all you "Pro-Capitalist Fighters".... Do a little self reflecting and imagine what it's like not to have any crayons at all.

[americandream]

How much better a species would we have been had we dedicated our resources and cumulative skills to:

1 Philosophy, the arts and sports;

2 Personal and collective development;

3 Quality of life, and,

4 True freedom.

As opposed to supermarkets, shopping malls, shopping and garage sales.

What if it turns out that capitalism is a mistake? lol

Capitalism is not a mistake. The world changes and so do societies. What a boring world this would be if 2 million years ago somebody implemented a sustainable form of society. There would be no history, no change, no nothing. Boring as hell.

By the way capitalsim is most of the time the best way to go because it encourages efficiency and rewards the performer while punishing the slacker.

[Revi]

Capitalism is like a monopoly game. Near the end of the game we're all creeping around the board hoping we don't land on Boardwalk, staying in jail as long as possible and dreaming of landing on Free Parking.