hillsidedigger wrote:I often suggest to people on message boards that there should be no more than one person per 16 acres of good land in the world (12 billion good acres = 750 million people). Such a statement is generally scoffed at but the analysis in the opening post of this thread just goes to show how few people this planet can support for the long term.
frankthetank wrote:I've been crunching some numbers the past few days and what i'm seeing is that renewables use way too much land! and would almost be impossible to replace fossil fuels.
Take wood and wind for example.
To heat homes in my county, i figure to do it sustainably it would require 533,000 acres (41000 households/4 cords house/.3 cords/acre). This is not possible without exploiting the lightly populated northwoods and mowing them down. Not to mention we'd be fighting with Madison, Eau Claire, Milwaukee, and even Minneapolis for these resources WHEN it comes to that
lateStarter wrote:17 acres feels about right to me. On one of our properties we have 7 acres of mixed forest, 7 acres of produce, and 1 acre of pasture. Too bad I don't live there!
Farmers in DeKalb County, Mo., who depend on corn, soybeans and pasture land for their livelihoods will soon gain another source of income: annual payments from the Wind Capital Group, which is leasing space on their properties to create the largest wind farm in Missouri. Lost Creek Wind Farm will cover 32,000 acres and produce enough electricity to power 50,000 homes. The project will also create short-term construction jobs and ongoing operations jobs as well as infrastructure benefits for DeKalb County
Wind Capital Group has awarded contracts to General Electric for supply of 100 1.5 megawatt turbines for its Lost Creek wind farm in Missouri, and to provide operation and maintenance for the project for five years.
Ludi wrote:lateStarter wrote:17 acres feels about right to me. On one of our properties we have 7 acres of mixed forest, 7 acres of produce, and 1 acre of pasture. Too bad I don't live there!
Might not be sustainable in the long term. Most hunter-gatherers had a population density of 1 square mile per person. Not saying we need to or should be hunter-gatherers, just that might be the kind of density we really need as apex predators (like bears need large territories).
Talkin' long term here.
<<<personally against any large-scale renewable schemes. If individuals and communities want to install them, great, but T Boone Pickens and his ilk can kiss my blotchy pinkish ass.
frankthetank wrote:Good example of land use and wind farms:Farmers in DeKalb County, Mo., who depend on corn, soybeans and pasture land for their livelihoods will soon gain another source of income: annual payments from the Wind Capital Group, which is leasing space on their properties to create the largest wind farm in Missouri. Lost Creek Wind Farm will cover 32,000 acres and produce enough electricity to power 50,000 homes. The project will also create short-term construction jobs and ongoing operations jobs as well as infrastructure benefits for DeKalb CountyWind Capital Group has awarded contracts to General Electric for supply of 100 1.5 megawatt turbines for its Lost Creek wind farm in Missouri, and to provide operation and maintenance for the project for five years.
So in this case they are putting one of these monsters 1 per 32 acres...
Homesteader wrote:They are all screwed.
Renewables are to Peak Oil as five or six BB's are to a charging grizzly bear.
neocone wrote:Homesteader wrote:They are all screwed.
Renewables are to Peak Oil as five or six BB's are to a charging grizzly bear.
How about I spit on the bear? That should surely work right?
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